can someone explain tall vs short deck BBC? - Team Camaro Tech
Engine General Engine Discussion.

 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #1 of 11 (permalink) Old Jan 8th, 10, 09:48 AM Thread Starter
Tech Team
jeff
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Spokane, WA
Posts: 81
Question can someone explain tall vs short deck BBC?

I've been reading up on the Big Blocks but haven't found good referance to what the differance between the two are (other than deck height).
Is one a smog motor? Do the two use a differant stroke? One a farm truck block vs performance?
Thanks,
Jeff.
jostby is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 11 (permalink) Old Jan 8th, 10, 12:37 PM
Senior Tech
David
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Rainsville, Alabama
Posts: 4,274
Re: can someone explain tall vs short deck BBC?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jostby View Post
I've been reading up on the Big Blocks but haven't found good referance to what the differance between the two are (other than deck height).
Is one a smog motor? Do the two use a differant stroke? One a farm truck block vs performance?
Thanks,
Jeff.
Tall block BB's are sometimes categorized as "industrial" engines.This stems from the fact that they were mainly used in heavy duty trucks suitable for farm and/or fleet type work. Although their original intent is more "pedestrian" in nature....they can be built to performance standards. Performance parts can be obtained but header fitment and hood clearance becomes an issue when installing the tall deck in our beloved Camaros.

David F.

"All I need is a fast machine". Steve McQueen
My Machine: 1969 Pro Street Camaro
468 CID 661 Horsepower Turbo 400
33"x19.50" Mickey Thompsons
Check Out My Camaro
661 Horsepower 468
1969ProStreetCamaro is offline  
post #3 of 11 (permalink) Old Jan 8th, 10, 02:44 PM
Super Moderator
Jake-68's rule
 
Everett#2390's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Va Beach VA
Posts: 29,073
Re: can someone explain tall vs short deck BBC?

The easiest visual inspection of the difference between tall block and short block is to look at the water pump-to-cylinder head deck.

Short deck engines, the top of the w/pump bolt to the block is at the deck.
Tall deck blocks have the deck 3/4 inch higher than the top of the w/pump.

Give a man a rescued dog for the health of both their souls.
'With age comes wisdom, but then wisdom ages you even more.' GO CUBS! Other Stuff
Everett#2390 is offline  
post #4 of 11 (permalink) Old Jan 8th, 10, 03:18 PM
Gold Lifetime Member
John
 
Vintage 68's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Moraga,Ca.,USA
Posts: 13,704
Thumbs up Re: can someone explain tall vs short deck BBC?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jostby View Post
... what the differance between the two are (other than deck height).
... Do the two use a differant stroke?
... One a farm truck block vs performance?
Thanks,
Jeff.
As stated, they were originally a truck application to allow the use of a different piston-ring package with additional ring.
- Tall deck blocks use a special intake manifold and distributor to allow for the additional height. Other than that many parts can be the same as a standard deck.
- The 'stroke' of a standard and a 'tall-deck' 427 are the same, only difference is the piston.
- Although they are/were engineered to increase engine cycle life for industrial/HD truck applications, they are also used in some factory HP applications - like the 700HP 572 Big-blocks

1968 Convertible
Some trucks
Other V8 things - some of which float
Other V6 things - none of which float
Oh yeah, and 1 "Straight-Six" ...

If a man says something in the garage - and his wife can't hear him - is he still wrong !!!
Vintage 68 is offline  
post #5 of 11 (permalink) Old Jan 8th, 10, 04:14 PM
Senior Tech
Jim
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 168
Re: can someone explain tall vs short deck BBC?

rodent4 is offline  
post #6 of 11 (permalink) Old Jan 8th, 10, 04:22 PM
Senior Tech
David
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Rainsville, Alabama
Posts: 4,274
Re: can someone explain tall vs short deck BBC?

Thanks for the pics illustrating the different waterpump mounting locations.


David F.
www.firstgens.com

"All I need is a fast machine". Steve McQueen
My Machine: 1969 Pro Street Camaro
468 CID 661 Horsepower Turbo 400
33"x19.50" Mickey Thompsons
Check Out My Camaro
661 Horsepower 468
1969ProStreetCamaro is offline  
post #7 of 11 (permalink) Old Jan 8th, 10, 06:21 PM
Senior Tech
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: detroit
Posts: 2,285
Re: can someone explain tall vs short deck BBC?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jostby View Post
I've been reading up on the Big Blocks but haven't found good referance to what the differance between the two are (other than deck height).
Is one a smog motor? Do the two use a differant stroke? One a farm truck block vs performance?
Thanks,
Jeff.
Typical oem passenger blocks circa 60,70,s measured 396/402/427/454.
The T engine(tall deck) 366/427.
All these engines shared the 3.76 stroke aside from the 4" 454 passenger.
The .400" increase in deck height with T engines allowed a 3rd compression ring to be used for heavy duty applications.

George
68 Camaro
8-71 blown 461 Rat on E-85
fatblock is offline  
post #8 of 11 (permalink) Old Jan 9th, 10, 02:25 PM
Senior Tech
Tim
 
77wolf10.85's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Oklahoma
Posts: 3,222
Re: can someone explain tall vs short deck BBC?

I had a TD427 irrigation engine block. It had OEM gear driven cam, block was drilled for thrustwasher plate retention. That would be a quick way to spot one if you were just eyeballing bare blocks.

The 366 had main cap side tie bolts iirc. 427TD didn't.

Tim Smith
77wolf10.85 is offline  
post #9 of 11 (permalink) Old Jan 9th, 10, 05:35 PM
Gold Lifetime Member
John
 
Vintage 68's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Moraga,Ca.,USA
Posts: 13,704
Wink Re: can someone explain tall vs short deck BBC?

Quote:
Originally Posted by 77wolf10.85 View Post
I had a TD427 irrigation engine block. It had OEM gear driven cam, block was drilled for thrustwasher plate retention. That would be a quick way to spot one if you were just eyeballing bare blocks.

The 366 had main cap side tie bolts iirc. 427TD didn't.
If it had the gear drive and the trust plate then it was a Counter-Rotation unit
Very common set-up for them as well as Marine units.

1968 Convertible
Some trucks
Other V8 things - some of which float
Other V6 things - none of which float
Oh yeah, and 1 "Straight-Six" ...

If a man says something in the garage - and his wife can't hear him - is he still wrong !!!
Vintage 68 is offline  
post #10 of 11 (permalink) Old Jan 9th, 10, 06:54 PM
Senior Tech
Rich
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: North Jersey
Posts: 1,463
Re: can someone explain tall vs short deck BBC?

A quich visual on the difference,The standard deck is flush with the top of the water pump.With a tall deck the distance between the top of the water pump and the deck will be about the same as the thickness of a 3/8" bolt.

With modern "3D" profiled steel connecting rods,you can probably squeeze a 4.5" stroke crank into a 427 tall deck truck block.The tall deck 427 isnt notoriously thick like some earlier engines,so it isnt a given that it will bore out to .125" over,but if you did bore that much,you could have a really big engine based on a cheap truck block.I use 3D rods in a regular 454 block with a 4.25" crank and have tons of room,so with minimal grinding I could see another 1/4 inch of stroke going in.If you tried to get a 4.5" crank in a low deck,the rods might not hit,but the pistons would have to be too short to actually work,thats were the tall deck steps in.

On a lighter note,I have seen some of the "inner city" type racers use them "4 ring boat anchor" 366 truck engines with multiple kits of nitrous to make crazy power with junkyard parts.I have seen these guys take a school bus engine out of the junkyard,put an aluminum ravcngi ntake and 3 nitrous plates on it,cram it into a gutted out Malibu or Cutlass or whatever and make a lot of money off of unsuspecting victims,and the engines last forever.
RichSchmidt is offline  
post #11 of 11 (permalink) Old Jan 10th, 10, 05:35 PM Thread Starter
Tech Team
jeff
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Spokane, WA
Posts: 81
Re: can someone explain tall vs short deck BBC?

Thanks guys, all excellent answers with interesting tidbits of info

I shall wonder no more!!

Jeff.
jostby is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Team Camaro Tech forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address.
NOTE we receive a lot of registrations with bad email addresses. IF you do not receive your confirmation email you will not be able to post. contact support and we will try and help.
Be sure you enter a valid email address and check your spam folder as well.



Email Address:
OR

Log-in









Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome