T56 Information - First Generation Camaro Swap - Page 4 - Team Camaro Tech
Transmission & Driveline Transmissions and Differentials

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post #46 of 224 (permalink) Old Feb 5th, 07, 02:33 AM
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Re: T56 Information - First Generation Camaro Swap

So how about putting a T56 behind a pontiac block?

i would think that if they both take the same muncie, then the same T56 should work, right?

the only issue i cant get past is that the adapter plate is only listed for chevy sb
but i cant think of any reason why it would not be listed for a pontiac block or even a chevy big block
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post #47 of 224 (permalink) Old Feb 5th, 07, 08:07 AM Thread Starter
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Re: T56 Information - First Generation Camaro Swap

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Originally Posted by 400bird View Post
So how about putting a T56 behind a pontiac block?

i would think that if they both take the same muncie, then the same T56 should work, right?

the only issue i cant get past is that the adapter plate is only listed for chevy sb
but i cant think of any reason why it would not be listed for a pontiac block or even a chevy big block
I agree that it should work, with the one reservation that I'm not sure what the pilot bushing dimensions are for Pontiac engines. If they take "Chevy" pilot bushings, then the McLeod extended pilot bushings would work too.

To play it safe, you might want to call McLeod or ATS and pick their brains.

Mike - '68 Camaro with lots of stuff done to it.


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post #48 of 224 (permalink) Old Feb 5th, 07, 06:39 PM
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Re: T56 Information - First Generation Camaro Swap

ya, i dont think they take the same pilot bushing
but when i get the funding i will definantly call both meleod and ats
thanks
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post #49 of 224 (permalink) Old Feb 6th, 07, 12:57 PM
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Re: T56 Information - First Generation Camaro Swap

O.K. guys This is a very great thread with a lot of great information brought out by Mkelcy.
While I cannot divulge proprietary information on how we acheived the proper shift position I can assure you it is correct and does indeed fit WITH NO TUNNEL MODIFICATIONS needed. However(you all new that was coming ) you have to use a specific bell housing, crossmember, and shifter assembly(all provided). If you choose to use a factory GM bell then yes you will have to make some mods to your tunnel.
I have contacted two of our customers who recently did this swap with no cutting and I am having them send me more pictures. With their permission, I will post the pictures on here for you all to see that it is possible and has been done. Just so you all are aware, one of the customers had a Dynacorn(sp?) body which came with no hole in the tunnel for the shifter and had to cut a hole for the shifter but it is in the correct factory location. The tunnel in no way had to be modified for the Viper tranny to fit.
I will keep you posted. Keep the great information flowing.

Richard
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Keisler Engineering
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post #50 of 224 (permalink) Old Feb 6th, 07, 01:43 PM Thread Starter
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Re: T56 Information - First Generation Camaro Swap

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Originally Posted by rj8806 View Post
While I cannot divulge proprietary information on how we acheived the proper shift position I can assure you it is correct and does indeed fit WITH NO TUNNEL MODIFICATIONS needed. However(you all new that was coming ) you have to use a specific bell housing, crossmember, and shifter assembly(all provided).
Richard
Tech Support
Keisler Engineering
Richard, thanks for posting.

There are obviously a lot of people doing one-off things with T56's and Keisler may be one of them. If we could see pictures and understand how you're doing a "perfect fit" T56, we could all say "that's really clever" and tell people it can be done with your kit.

As it is, without any explanation beyond "specific bellhousing," we're still pretty much left in the dark. A bellhousing that takes about 3"-4" of length out of the overall engine to shifter location, is one very special bellhousing that likely also requires a non-standard input shaft and a fairly interesting clutch setup. Pictures would be very helpful.

If you do post pictures, I'd really like to see images of an original first generation Camaro just so we can tell precisely what's being done to make it work, and that it does in fact work.

Again, I look forward to seeing what Keisler's doing.

Mike - '68 Camaro with lots of stuff done to it.


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post #51 of 224 (permalink) Old Feb 6th, 07, 02:00 PM
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Re: T56 Information - First Generation Camaro Swap

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Originally Posted by Mkelcy View Post
Richard, thanks for posting.

There are obviously a lot of people doing one-off things with T56's and Keisler may be one of them. If we could see pictures and understand how you're doing a "perfect fit" T56, we could all say "that's really clever" and tell people it can be done with your kit.

As it is, without any explanation beyond "specific bellhousing," we're still pretty much left in the dark. A bellhousing that takes about 3"-4" of length out of the overall engine to shifter location, is one very special bellhousing that likely also requires a non-standard input shaft and a fairly interesting clutch setup. Pictures would be very helpful.

If you do post pictures, I'd really like to see images of an original first generation Camaro just so we can tell precisely what's being done to make it work, and that it does in fact work.

Again, I look forward to seeing what Keisler's doing.
Since I started reading this thread this morning, I was checking with the boss man to see what I could and couldn't divulge. We do use a "clutch housing" not a standard "bell housing", we also use a different input shaft than came standard in the Viper tranny. The "clutch housing" is considerably shallower(is that a word ) than a standard bellhousing(i.e. GM 621 etc....). The clutch and flywheel setup are standard.
I am currently waiting for some e-mails from the guys I contacted earlier as they are sending me more photos and yes, they have given me permission to post them. Since I have never posted any pics on this forum, I do not know if I am able to and ultimately, may contact you by PM and hopefully you could post them for me??? Please respond to my e-mail address below and I will send the attachments to you to post.
As I stated, I will keep you all informed and just so everyone knows, I am not in sales and I am not trying to make a sale here. I am in Tech Support and am trying to offer up clarification and advice.

Richard
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Keisler Engineering
techsupport@keislerauto.com
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post #52 of 224 (permalink) Old Feb 6th, 07, 02:22 PM Thread Starter
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Re: T56 Information - First Generation Camaro Swap

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Originally Posted by rj8806 View Post
As I stated, I will keep you all informed and just so everyone knows, I am not in sales and I am not trying to make a sale here. I am in Tech Support and am trying to offer up clarification and advice.

Richard
Tech Support
Keisler Engineering
There's nothing wrong with pointing out a uniquely desirable aspect of your product. This thread has shown there's a concern about having to cut up our first generation cars to fit a T56. If you guys are doing it without cutting, I'm guessing there's some interest.

Mike - '68 Camaro with lots of stuff done to it.


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post #53 of 224 (permalink) Old Feb 6th, 07, 03:02 PM
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Re: T56 Information - First Generation Camaro Swap

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Originally Posted by Mkelcy View Post
There's nothing wrong with pointing out a uniquely desirable aspect of your product. This thread has shown there's a concern about having to cut up our first generation cars to fit a T56. If you guys are doing it without cutting, I'm guessing there's some interest.
When I first came to work for Keisler Engineering back in Jan. 2005, we were selling T-56 kits for the 1st gen Camaro along with kits for the C3 vette. Our supply of "Viper" trannys got used up and Tremec would only sell them to Dodge. They weren't available to the aftermarket anymore. We have since found a new supply and have "re-opened" the 1st gen kit. Back then, you didn't have to cut the tunnel either.
We understand everyones concern for the fittment and the need to make it work without cutting. That is our number 1 priority. We make every effort to offer a kit that requires no cutting. In some cases though, there is no way around it. That is not the case for a Viper tranny in a 1st gen Camaro. We have engineered and developed a kit that is absolutely a bolt in replacement with no modification necessary to the car in any way.
I just got off of the phone with both guys who are sending me pictures and they told me to look for them Friday or Monday at the outside. Once again, as soon as I receive them, I will post them so everyone can see.

Richard
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post #54 of 224 (permalink) Old Feb 6th, 07, 06:47 PM
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Re: T56 Information - First Generation Camaro Swap

Wow! This thread just keeps getting better and I look forward to seeing the photos. I'll send a P/M to Richard to facilitate the posting of the photos, if he doesn't already have a volunteer.

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post #55 of 224 (permalink) Old Feb 6th, 07, 07:36 PM
 
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Re: T56 Information - First Generation Camaro Swap

I also work at Keisler Engineering. I will post the photos up when I recieve them from the customer. Just remember that most of the guys I talked to today with our 6 speed kit in the car they have there console in and carpet. I am talking with them to see if i can get a interior shot with the carpet and console removed.
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post #56 of 224 (permalink) Old Feb 9th, 07, 08:57 AM
 
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Re: T56 Information - First Generation Camaro Swap




Here are some pics to give you some idea however I am trying to get some of the guys to take the console out so you can see the top of the tunnel.
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post #57 of 224 (permalink) Old Feb 9th, 07, 08:59 AM
 
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Re: T56 Information - First Generation Camaro Swap

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post #58 of 224 (permalink) Old Feb 9th, 07, 09:00 AM
 
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Re: T56 Information - First Generation Camaro Swap

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post #59 of 224 (permalink) Old Feb 9th, 07, 09:01 AM
 
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Re: T56 Information - First Generation Camaro Swap

Here is an engine shot also
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post #60 of 224 (permalink) Old Feb 9th, 07, 08:18 PM
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Re: T56 Information - First Generation Camaro Swap

Thanks for all the information and photos. You show photos of the tranny mounted in a '67 and it does seem to fit well. Is there enough adjustment to also fit the cut hole in a '68 and '69? I understand they are placed in a slightly different location than the '67.
My car wants one.

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