Hi Guys ...

Got my wheels and tire mounted up today and wow ... my front end is a 4x4 ... The rears look good to me ...

I have a couple inches of clearance in the rear from top of tire to the fender ... but I have 6 inches of clearance in the front ...

I used the rigth stuff detailing front end disk brake kit with standard spindles ... The springs are new, originals and were installed when I purchased the car ...This is the first time the front springs had ever had any weight on them ...

I need to replace them with at least a 2" drop ... is there a 3 or 4 inch drop available? Is my tire not tall enough in the front ... I'm running 205/65/15 in the front ...

Here's a pic of the front....

http://home.earthlink.net/~timandsteph/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/4x4frontwheel.jpg

And one of the rear ...

http://home.earthlink.net/~timandsteph/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/rearwheeltirefitment.jpg

Can you post a shot of the whole car...does it sit level or close to it?I put new springs in the front of mine years ago,and it didnt sit that high or anywhere near it.I'm gonna go out on a limb and say you've got big block spings in a small block car...just a thought

No ... it doesn't sit completely level ... higher in front ... I never thought about there possibly being big block springs in the car ... that might just be the deal ... What's the difference in length or compression rate b/n big block and small block springs?

If these are big block springs ... I should more than likely still get a 2" drop Hotchkis ... don't ya think?

Here's the only pic that I snapped of a side shot ...

http://home.earthlink.net/~timandsteph/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/sidecarview.jpg

Ok

Is that sucker got a super charger on it?? It looks like it ha a blow off valve.

I am going out on limb here and saying that with the big and littles (Tires on the rear and front) maybe the last owner put drag springs in it.

Is you suspension at full travel right now? You could have the springs not seated in the pockets or they might be some sort of spring that goes in one way and you have them upside down?

If your at full travel how stiff is the front end? If it's really stiff I say you have an install of the spring issue. If not you might some sort of weird spring. Can the old owner be called to see what they bought and installed?

Joe

I would say that your most likely problem is that either
1. the springs are not seated in the pocket
2. your control arms are binding if you tightened then with the suspension dropped
when tightening the bolts that go through bushings in the front and rear you need to tighten them with the full weight of the car on the tires

i had that problem on last job i did with full disks on a car. if you look in where the shock goes you can probally see spring is on the pocket and not around it.good pry with a bar and a loud pop it will be in place.heres a pic before i fixed my own car. http://s198.photobucket.com/albums/aa157/hereitis67/?action=view&current=fish044.jpg

Have you moved the car yet, or did you just drop it off the jack in place?

Our cars suspensions camber out SEVERELY at full droop. and when set back on the ground, they bind up. The tire needs to move in, but friction with the ground won't let it.

Your car is obviously bound up tight at full extension. Roll her out of the garage and back in, bet she settles 4" or more.

Thanks guys ... I haven't moved the car yet ... I just bolted up the wheels and droped the car off of jack stands ...

I'll lower the car and roll her out and back in the garage tomorrow and see what happens ...

I'll also check to make sure the springs are seated correctly but I'm pretty sure they are ...

Thanks again,
TIM

Is there any suspension parts that I should loosen prior to setting the car back on the ground ... I completely changed all the suspension parts prior to lowering the car ...

If so, which parts should I loosen?

Thanks,
TIM

the bolts that hold the lower arms to the frame
the bolts that hold the upper arms to the cross shaft
you can loosen the ones that hold the sway bar to the frame, but thats not really needed

I have the same issue, and was told the springs would settle.... well it was only a 1/4" .

Everything was rebuilt on the front end. I just think the springs are too heavy or too long (Z-28 replacments from Moog) and the motor is all steel except the intake.

I will be cutting my springs to get the drop I need/want. You may want to do the same ?

http://i10.photobucket.com/albums/a130/Dougs68Camaro/59460974-S.jpg

OK ...

I Rolled the car out of the garage and back in ... I also pushed up and down on the fenders and added my weight ...

The front went from 6" lift (fender to top of tire) to about 4.25" lift ... Still higher than I would like ... Do you think there is another 2" of settling ??? Maybe I should see if it settles more before I run out and get the 2" drop springs ... What do you guys think?

http://home.earthlink.net/~timandsteph/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/4.25inches.jpg
http://home.earthlink.net/~timandsteph/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/4.25inchesb.jpg

Also, yes the car does have a blower ... it's a solid roller 383 with a Procharger D1SC ... I still haven't broken it in and dynoed yet ...

Here's a couple quick shots ...

http://home.earthlink.net/~timandsteph/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/blown383.jpg
http://home.earthlink.net/~timandsteph/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/blown383b.jpg

Ohhh yaaa, blown baby.........gotta love it!! You might not have to worry about it being high in the front if it hooks up. You could be pulling the wheels off the ground and you could need that extra travel!!

You said the person you bought the car from already had the springs. Any way for you to find out what they are from that person?

Also this is problem I see people complaining about alot in posts. I think the springs will settle some but the stock type replacement springs are made to fit one application. Taking wieght off the front via heads intake etc could add up to it sitting higher. Not knowing the springs application that you have is sort of a shot in the dark since they make many differnt springs. You could try removing a coil or 1/2 coil at time to get it where you like it and avoid buying more springs? Knowing the application of it would be nice though so you would know if it's going to work out correctly though if you did cut them.

I contacted the person that I purchased the car from and he said they were small block springs ... so I'll see if it settles at all ...

no, I don't think there is another 2" of settling.
where do you want the front end to be?
if you want it lowered from stock I would get the lowering springs

if you just want it stock I would double check that those springs are sitting in the pocket and the suspension is not binding
then just cut a coil

no, I don't think there is another 2" of settling.
where do you want the front end to be?
if you want it lowered from stock I would get the lowering springs

if you just want it stock I would double check that those springs are sitting in the pocket and the suspension is not binding
then just cut a coil

What he said, check the pockets in the frame also. Also loosen the control arm pivot points and put it on the ground, the torque them.

Is the upper control arm close to hitting the bump stop?

These are sort of hard to make out but this is what I have. Hotchkiss front small block springs, the tire is a 205/60-15 on a 15X7 Rally.
You can see how my control arms sit and the angles they are at......sort of. As you can tell this is with no hood and inner fenders and only the engine and trans in the car. It will go down some more. I know because I have had the same suspension under her for a few years. It always drops about 1/2 inch after coming off the jack stands when it's fully loaded. I expect it to drop about an 1 1/4 from where it's at now after it's together and driving.

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y168/cruiser_ss350/67%20Camaro/67Engine003.jpg

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y168/cruiser_ss350/67%20Camaro/100_2911.jpg

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y168/cruiser_ss350/67%20Camaro/100_2910.jpg

Same suspension but with a 235/60-15 on 8 inch rally wheel

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y168/cruiser_ss350/67%20Camaro/Picture083.jpg

Here she is sitting on somewhat of a down hill slope and the 205/60-15. The picture makes it look a little higher since the drivers side is sitting on the begining of the slope/boat ramp where the picture was taken.

http://www.camaros.net/images/xchange/164.jpg

There's about 1 to 1 1/2 inches of clearance between the upper control arm and the bump stop (how much should there be?) ... I'll try jacking up the car and loosening the control arms (upper and lower) ... then lowering and tourqing them down (what torque settings should these be torqued to? I've been using 85 lower and 50 upper) ... I remeasured and now top of tire to bottom of fender is closer to 4" ...


Also ... Is there an easy way to see if the springs are seated correctly ... without tearing the suspension apart ...

Sometime tomorrow I'll try to get a few pics of the springs and front suspension ...

Thanks ...

You should see the end of the top coil in the little inspection hole in front of the brace for the upper shock mount.

You should see the end of the top coil in the little inspection hole in front of the brace for the upper shock mount.Important point. Make sure the spring end is visible through the hole, regardless of the position of the spring end sits in the lower control arm.

The lower control arms as viewed from the front, should be relatively level. Draw an imaginary horizontal line through the lower control arm bushings and the lower ball joints should be on this line.

You could install the front bumper after having it filled with lead.......

Torque specs here: http://www.camaros.net/forums/showthread.php?t=101991&highlight=torque

Thanks guys ... I'll do some adjusting tonight ...

make sure to roll the car after you drop it down and before you torque anything

make sure to roll the car after you drop it down and before you torque anything


Sure will ... thanks

You should see the end of the top coil in the little inspection hole in front of the brace for the upper shock mount.

any one have a pic of this for reference?

Ok Guys ...

Both of the front springs appear to be seated into the lower control arms with no problems ... However, when I looked down the opening in the front of the Subframe to view the top of the springs, I noticed that the passenger side spring appears to not be seated properly ... I should have checked this a little closer when I put my front suspension together ...

The only way to fix this is to remove and re-install ... correct? If so, I'm thinking that I should just go and add some drop springs in the front while I have it appart ... this will help me get that rake look that I dig ...

Here is a Side by Side shot of the Passenger and Driver Side Spring Tops as viewed when looking down the front opening of the subframe ... notice on the Driver side, I assume what I circled is the little are of the spring tip that shows it's seated correctly ... RIGHT?

I also shot a couple pics of the front suspension to see how level it is and you can also see the differences in the angle of the spring coils from one side to the other ...

Please give me your thoughts to verify that the Driver (RIGHT PIC) side looks correct, where as the passenger (LEFT PIC) side has issues ...

http://home.earthlink.net/~timandsteph/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/driverandpassengercomparison.jpg

http://home.earthlink.net/~timandsteph/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/frontsuspensiona.jpg
http://home.earthlink.net/~timandsteph/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/frontsuspensionb.jpg

That is wicked! I had a similar situation with a '68 small block. Replaced the original coils with 'replacement' springs and the car sat up like a gasser in front. Not sure why either, but I switched to the Hotchkis 2" lowering coils for about $150. The car now sits tight in front. I think about 2.0" between tire and fender well with original 14" rallye wheels.

If you have the cash to spend check out the QA1 coil over shocks/springs. About $450.00 and you adj the ride hight. You remove your old spring and the coilspring/shock installs right in the stock location. Problem solved and you make it what ever rake you like. This is what I will be going to. As I understand the shock is compairable to a bilstien. So you if that is correct you will spend $150.00 for springs and I think about $75.00 ea for bilstiens so there is $300.00. For the extra $150.00 you get shocks you can adj with a dial, coil overs and fully adj ride hight. Pretty good deal but just spendy up front. They install very quickly.

One other thing you might try undoing your sway bar. Mine had my suspension bound up once, I run a hotchkiss bar on mine also.

You lower arms do look un-even so I bet your not seated.
Yes i would just buy the hotchkiss springs if your going to take it apart.

Wish I was more help!!

Joe

Passenger spring looks to be outboard more than drvr side spring if you're using the shock rod as a reference.

Installed springs have the flat end up into the pocket?
There is a hole next to the upper shock mount to view the end of the spring sitting in the pocket.

Still, with minor things mentioned, you'lll still too high. LCA bolts are higher than lower ball joints.

I shouldn't have any issues with front tire rub with the Hotchkis 2" lowering springs ... should I?

205/65/15 tire on a 15x6 wheel

Tim, I don't think you'll get what you need from any of the "little details."
You might get an inch if each of them is a "little off."

Pull the springs, and either replace them with shorter ones, or cut a full coil off. Reassemble and check, and be prepared to do it again if it's still too high.

The Hotchkiss springs are near double the rate of stock springs. Ride is tight and firm, and "rubbing" is usually not a problem.

I shouldn't have any issues with front tire rub with the Hotchkis 2" lowering springs ... should I?

205/65/15 tire on a 15x6 wheel

I agree with Jim on the "rubbing"deal.I have the Hotchkis 2" drop in the front with 225/60/15 on 15x7 ralleys and dont have a problem unless it is full lock to the left and the drivers side tire rubs the frame...barely.Since a parking lot...or a nascar style spin-out is the only place I would have the car at full left I never worried about it

Check out Brian Lewis's 69 pics (torque thrust pics). Don't know if that is the look you want or if using the same suspension components on a 68 will offer the same results. I used Eibach lowering front springs as he did on my 69. And I love the stance it has now. I replaced all suspension parts, but went with the 3 leaf mono replacements for the rear which is different than what Brian has. Mine sits with just a little rake to it. My specs on tires, spacing, wheels and such were in a sticky but I don't see the sticky anymore.

I don't think you will have any rub issues. Mine does/did not rub at all. The picture with the 235/60-15 on the 8 inch wheel had some rub issues at the top of the wheel well after hitting a very hard bump or prgrosive dips in the road. Some new KYB's helped that problem alot but it still rubbed sometimes.

My 205/60-15 on a 7 inch rim never rubed at all.

Keep in mind that the car will drop a good bit when you install all the interior and glass back in it. I would leave it alone until You get all the parts installed and drive it a few miles to settle the springs. Good luck