In the Beginning - A 68 rises from the ashes [Archive] - Team Camaro Tech

: In the Beginning - A 68 rises from the ashes


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cheby2
Nov 22nd, 07, 02:47 PM
I thought I would cronicle the rebirth of this sad sack 68 , a SS / 4speed car with deluxe interior . Plans include a 6.0 LS engine , automatic tranny (TBD) , with a 9" rear w/Calvert Racing leafs and CalTracs , DSE minitubs , and all new sheetmetal .

In the beginning.....

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_0876.jpg
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_0877.jpg

And now , after a round with the plasma cutter .....

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_0991.jpg
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1001.jpg
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_0992.jpg
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_0993.jpg
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_0994.jpg
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_0997.jpg
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1000.jpg


http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_0995.jpg

cheby2
Nov 22nd, 07, 02:51 PM
...and her new clothes....
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1006.jpg
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1008.jpg

a shot of the engine mockup ...
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1011.jpg

I will be updating as the project proceeds , Terry

LukeSkywalker
Nov 22nd, 07, 03:20 PM
Wow, good luck. You got yourself quite a project there.

keypilot
Nov 22nd, 07, 04:08 PM
WOW! and i didnt think it looked too bad i that first pic.

good luck, keep the pics coming.

Eleanor's Nemesis
Nov 22nd, 07, 04:29 PM
The slotted mags are way cool!

good luck with your project.....mine looked almost exactly like your about 6 months ago. Still workin' on it-

AutoRodTechnologies
Nov 22nd, 07, 04:56 PM
I love projects like this.. I love your combination of plans.. I love it when they are upgraded like this, and I love it when a old car like this is saved from the crusher..
Don't crush em.. Restore em..
I'll be watching this one


SUBSCRIBES!!!!!!!!

alanrw
Nov 22nd, 07, 05:30 PM
Shims, don't forget the shims!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Wow, I don't think you can strip it any furthur. A true re-birth. What is amazing is when they first built it, it only took hours. And they lined up the sheet metal in a few minutes. That always puts me away.

alan

AutoRodTechnologies
Nov 22nd, 07, 05:55 PM
I'm assuming your next step will be sandblasting then epoxy??

Also curious.. Do you have a completion goal??

cheby2
Nov 22nd, 07, 09:41 PM
WOW , I'm amazed , first 5 responses to the thread and not a negative remark in them ! I think I'm going to like it here ! Seems like there's always one where they say " you can't do that " , " I don't think I'da done it like that " or " I've got a buddy that knows a guy that ......" LOL . BTW , YES , blasting and epoxy is the next step , I still have a few pieces to remove ( inner wheelwells , package tray panel , cowl outers , and floorboard / rest of trunk floor ) , but I think I'll wait untill after blasting to remove these because of moving the car in the current structural condition . As far as a completion goal , well ..... I kind of quit putting deadlines on myself , a year would be great , two years would be ok , besides , I'm in my element , I love this and it's my therapy . This is my 8th one in the last 20yrs and it's still fun ! Terry

These are a few pics of my last build

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/104_0173.jpg
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/104_0176.jpg
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/104_0175.jpg

cheby2
Nov 22nd, 07, 10:06 PM
Forgot 1 thing , I bought all the sheetmetal from Firewheel Classics in Wiley , Texas , had everything I needed in stock . Great people to deal with , just called them , told them what I wanted , when I'd be there , hooked on to the car hauler and headed up there . I would highly recomend them to anyone and they will get all my business . Terry

absintheisfun
Nov 23rd, 07, 07:07 AM
Forgot 1 thing , I bought all the sheetmetal from Firewheel Classics in Wiley , Texas , had everything I needed in stock . Great people to deal with , just called them , told them what I wanted , when I'd be there , hooked on to the car hauler and headed up there . I would highly recomend them to anyone and they will get all my business . Terry

Great people! I went there once to check it out and bought some POR15 while I was there. Went back 6 months later, and they remember me and my project!
Great people to deal with!!

Hatman
Nov 23rd, 07, 08:00 AM
Not to Hi-jack but I bought this car in April and worked on it on nights & weekends ,taking a month off not working on it at all because of the heat in August.http://i190.photobucket.com/albums/z235/Madhatter68/CamaroWiperheater023.jpg
http://i190.photobucket.com/albums/z235/Madhatter68/CamaroPics006.jpg
http://i190.photobucket.com/albums/z235/Madhatter68/Camaro006.jpg

alanrw
Nov 23rd, 07, 09:41 AM
Out of curiosity, when you do a massive rebuild like this, what reference points do you use to hang the inner fenders, rear quarters etc. to make sure all the new sheet metal goes right where it is supposed to? I am pretty sure when the car was originally built, it was jigged together. Is the car built up with clecos with the frame on wheels so you can actually see it assembled before you start tacking and welding?

alan

JPCamaro
Nov 23rd, 07, 11:27 AM
Wow great looking Nova. I've got a feeling the Camaro will turn out sweet based on that Nova. This post reminds me of the "Impressive metalwork" thread. I'll be following this one.

GMJoe
Nov 23rd, 07, 11:36 AM
Congats on saving it from the scrap heap, and i agree if it turns out like the chevy 2 it will be a beauty....
Joe

cheby2
Nov 23rd, 07, 07:03 PM
Alanrw , the inner wheelwells attach to a fixed point on the inner structure , so as long as you reattach those back in the proper oreintation , their location is pretty well fixed . As far as the outer skin , you have more flexibilty lining up things with the panels mocked up with clamps , clecos ect. and you can tweak one or more panels at the same time to come up with the best lines . You will also be able to mount the trunk lid and doors and get them in the mix to try and setup the best possible gaps and alinement that you can among all the panels before you weld anything on . Even with all this you still may have to slice and dice a bit to get everything looking good . It's kind of time consuming but you ultimately end up with a better overall car if you get everything all situated in the beginning and it doesn't come back to bite you later . BTW , this is the first time I've been this deep into a car body , it's a challenge , but doable and I ain't skeered ! Terry

cheby2
Nov 24th, 07, 05:42 PM
Well , I got a few things done today , decided to change the cowl ends (one was rusted ,one was dented) so I attacked the time consuming task of cutting all the welds and removing them . Not a hard job , just tedious , now I have to order replacements . I still have a lot of ceaning up the spot welds around the car and a little more metal removal around the edges of the panels . I cleaned up the drip well of the remaining top metal and spot welds also today . Just have to keep forging ahead on the nasty prep work and hope to have the body at the sandblasters this week sometime so I can start some constructive work instead of this destructive stuff . Terry

Took a few pics to share
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1014.jpg
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1017.jpg
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1018.jpg
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1019.jpg

cheby2
Dec 5th, 07, 08:48 PM
Well , It's been a couple of weeks since I posted anything on this project , but I have been working on it . Got a few things done and I'm finally ready to blast it hopefully tomorrow . I now have all the sheetmetal to do everything , had to order the cowl ends , deep tubs , and package tray panel and have them here now . I've been busy cleaning up spot welds and removed remaing metal on the trunk panel and wheel tubs . I also did a little surgery on the hinge pillar and top of windsheild to correct some improper repairs . Here are a few pics of progress .

Repair on the hinge pillar
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1024.jpg

Top of windsheild
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1027.jpg

The deep tub and package tray panel
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1031.jpg
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1033.jpg

A few shots of the rear http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1036.jpg
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1037.jpg
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1038.jpg
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1040.jpg

So far It's been nasty no-good dirty work , but it's got to be done . I'm going to leave the floor in until I get the trunk area back in to keep some support for the location of the frame rails , but it has to come out before the installation of the tubs . I think I will put some more support off the cart to the rocker panels before taking the floor out , so far nothing has moved and the cart really makes it nice with keeping everything in place . I will post when I get her blasted and some epoxy on her . Terry

JPCamaro
Dec 5th, 07, 10:30 PM
WOW, what an epic build. I just want to know...what lake was this car parked in? LOL. I just can't believe the amount of rust that was on it. Keep up the good work.

J.P.

cheby2
Dec 5th, 07, 10:48 PM
South Louisiana , might as well be a lake ! LOL

JPCamaro
Dec 6th, 07, 01:33 AM
South Louisiana , might as well be a lake ! LOL

LOL!

Z10396
Dec 6th, 07, 03:30 AM
Wow, that thing is naked! I thought my car was stripped with quarters, outerwheels and taillight panel off. Terry, I commend you for saving this car. The Chevy II looks great and it is easy to see that the Camaro is well on its way of being restored back to glory. B

DougP
Dec 6th, 07, 06:05 AM
All that "dirty work" will pay off in the end -- thanks for keeping us update and good luck with the rest of the project

AutoRodTechnologies
Dec 6th, 07, 08:43 AM
Looks like your making some progress..
And I do have to say that the chevy II is gorgous!!!!!!!!!!

sleepsinshed
Dec 6th, 07, 05:21 PM
Hey, I think I see a piece of metal you forgot to remove!

Thanks for sharing this project with us. I'm hoping to learn a lot as the work progresses. Won't it be a lot harder to get everything aligned when so many panels are being replaced at the same time? I'd be tempted to do one panel at a time to always have a few reference points. But then I've never attempted anything nearly as complex at this.

cheby2
Dec 6th, 07, 10:20 PM
Thanks for the support guys , I've always wanted to do one like this and having a place to record the process and share it with other like-minded people is priceless . As far as getting this deep into the body structure , I have no idea what I'm doing ! flying by the seat of my pants as we speak ! LOL I would be more comfortable with the one panel method but the it got to the "might as well " stage pretty quick . It's pretty simple process if you look at it like sub-assemblys , and have a plan going in , thinking three steps ahead all the time . As far as the outer sheetmetal , there are some fixed points of attachment on the major panels that you will have , and you will have to temporarily mount several panels at once (they will key off of one another) to get the proper oreintation of the section as a whole (if that makes any sense) BTW thanks for the comments on the Chevy II , it was hard to let that one go , but I'm a Camaro guy to the core and had a burning desire to do another one , plus the fact that the guy I sold it to wanted it worse than me , and his money proved it ! Terry

AutoRodTechnologies
Dec 7th, 07, 06:48 AM
Sometimes when the offer is that good you just have to let thigns go!!
I know how that goes.. been there/done that. :(

Rhino
Dec 7th, 07, 08:00 AM
...As far as getting this deep into the body structure , I have no idea what I'm doing ! flying by the seat of my pants as we speak ! LOL I would be more comfortable with the one panel method but the it got to the "might as well " stage pretty quick...

I'm the same as you. I've never been too deep into a body until my most recent project. The "Might as well" bug bit me hard as well :)
I was a little intimidated until I actually started cutting into it a little further. Now it's just as you said. if you look at components in their sub-assemblies, it makes the process so much easier.

Camuchi
Dec 7th, 07, 09:00 AM
Holy Crap!

What a cool project. And to think I am nervous about doing my rear quarters, what a wimp I is.:yes:

Where are you neighbor? I am over in Fairhope AL but have a project in Mandeville/Covington going on right now.

Have fun-Matt

cheby2
Dec 7th, 07, 10:47 PM
Matt , I'm on the southwest side of the state , about 200mi. west of Covington La.

Today's update , I did get a little blasting done , in between all the interruptions (the real world gets in the way sometimes) , about an hours worth . I estimate probably 2-3 more hours over the next couple of days and I'll be ready to epoxy . And ,as usual , we down south get a tropical flow ahead of these Pacific fronts and get tons of moisture in the air , the air is so thick right now that you could cut it witha knife ! and me with bare metal ! Oh well .... Terry

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1041.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1042.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1043.jpg

Rarerat
Dec 8th, 07, 09:47 AM
Great Job!!! Please keep the pics coming.:thumbsup::thumbsup:

:beers:
Nick

AutoRodTechnologies
Dec 8th, 07, 10:21 AM
Keep up the good work!!!

cheby2
Dec 11th, 07, 11:53 PM
Well after considerably more time blasting than I anticipated , I finally got done ! I have sand in places that I didn't know I had ! But all came out well , and I'm glad that part is over . Plus I didn't uncover anything surprising . I got the epoxy on after a lenghthy cleaning , blowing out and vacuming , it all came out well and I'm ready to get to some constructive stuff . Terry

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1049.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1051.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1053.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1055.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1052.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1061.jpg

Z10396
Dec 12th, 07, 02:10 AM
Looking better already! Keep it up!

68vert
Dec 12th, 07, 09:46 AM
I laughed out loud on your comment about the sand!! I just spent probably 5 or 6 hours blowing sand, mouse nests, and 2 dead mice bodies out of my car!! I had to use all kinds of tubing and hose to attach to my blow gun and vacuum cleaner to get it out! Just when you think you're done, you rotate it on the rotisserie, and here comes some more!! Looks like you're making great progress. Good luck with it and keep us posted... Brian

Eric Kammerer
Dec 12th, 07, 01:49 PM
I have sand in places that I didn't know I had !

I'm not sure if you mean in the car, or on your person... been there, so it's probably both :)

cheby2
Dec 13th, 07, 12:32 AM
Both ! LOL! Brain , I tried everything I could think of to get all the sand out , plus I had access to every inaccessable place on the carcass but I know the first turn on the rotisserie sand will hit the floor . Maybe I'll hook a pulley and a motor to it and slang it out ! LOL . I'm going to fab up some sort of spray wand that will spray 360* to coat the inside of the inaccessable areas , such as the rockers and outer roof structure with the epoxy primer . Hopefully will be starting tomorrow on the full trunk floor with the mods for the DSE deep tubs :disco:, followed by the full floor then the tubs . Terry

camaro tim
Dec 14th, 07, 05:02 PM
WOW! what a great job so far.can't wait to see it finished.

garyb
Dec 14th, 07, 08:57 PM
I got the epoxy on after a lenghthy cleaning...

As a novice undertaking a frame-off restoration in my garage, did you spray your epoxy at your place? Inside or outside? I'm located here in the midwest, so the weather definitely won't allow spraying anytime soon here, but come spring, I should have all the sandblasting done and ready to epoxy and then begin the metal work.

--Gary
http://picasaweb.google.com/gbledsoe3/Cutlass_Restoration

cheby2
Dec 15th, 07, 12:29 AM
Gary , I know where you're coming from , I did my first under a single car carport ! Yes , I blasted it on the concrete slab in front of my shop and also shot the epoxy there also . Terry

rmcamaro
Dec 15th, 07, 04:16 PM
Interesting project. I look forward to the updates

cheby2
Dec 15th, 07, 10:36 PM
Had the shop and house all to myself today and got some things done . I got the trunk floor and frame rails modified for the DSE tubs , then got the trunk floor all prepped and welded in , still need to box the frame and fab closeout panels tomorrow . Then it's on to the trunk dropoffs . Terry

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1072.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1073.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1070.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1071.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1075.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1074.jpg

cheby2
Dec 16th, 07, 09:39 PM
Today's progress :

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1076.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1078.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1079.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1080.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1081.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1082.jpg

Mav68erick
Dec 17th, 07, 04:28 AM
You do good works !

DougP
Dec 17th, 07, 05:45 AM
Nice work -- keep those progress pics coming

Corvettemaster
Dec 17th, 07, 07:45 AM
Hey Terry,
I commend you on the undertaking! If more people could muster up this kind of passion for restoring these car we'd have more around for the next generation of Camaro owners. After all we really are only the caretakers for the next guy, we don't truly own anything. I will be following your progress...you give the rest of us the encouragement to press on were we otherwise may give up. Thanks!
http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a371/Wickedink/68%20Camaro/68bodywork006.jpg

Dougs72Nova
Dec 17th, 07, 03:58 PM
Nice work.

Mav68erick
Dec 17th, 07, 04:55 PM
You havent cut or welded in the part that the shocks bolt to the bottom of the trunk yet have ya? In your kit is it Straight or staggered? Ive seen people with 2 different pcs for the same yr car..

cheby2
Dec 17th, 07, 10:34 PM
Mav68erick , I didn't buy the DSE kit , just the tubs , and my trunk pan is for a staggered setup , which you remove when you make the cut for the tubs . I'm thinking a little on the lines of what I did on my Chevy II for the shocks (building a raised section just where the shock is located, as seen in this pic just above and to the right of the tank vent)
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/IMAG0100.jpg

And guys , thanks for the kind words , this is my passion and I love having a media to show the work and maybe influence someone and grow the hobby , plus along the way may give someone the confidence to tackle some of these projects . Nothing like the feeling of accomplishment when you do it hands on . Ok , enough about that , today I got the closeout panels fabbed and installed , next is the trunk dropoffs and then the floor is coming out! Terry

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1083.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1084.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1085.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1086.jpg

Mav68erick
Dec 18th, 07, 04:38 AM
Cool, What are you doing for rear suspension then? leafs or other

aero993
Dec 18th, 07, 04:38 PM
I must agree, you do excellent work. I tried to put a 1/2 full floor in once and d@mn near killed myself. That old metal is sharp and deadly ask me how I know (sorry for getting off topic). Why did you choose to patch the floor instead of using two halves or a full floor pan?

cheby2
Dec 18th, 07, 10:38 PM
Mav , I'm going to use Calvert Racing split-monos and CalTracs

areo993 , I did use a full floor pan , the only thing it doesn't have is the trunk dropoffs attached .

Today's update : Doesn't look like much , but I got the dropoffs on and fabbed and welded a flange from the frame notch to the front of the dropoff . Then I built and installed some bracing from the cart to the rocker panels to better support the car while I cut the floor out . This was done because of the mounting points it now rests on ( front of rear framerails , subframe attachment points ) will not support the car with the floor out , especially with the toe boards out , which I have to change also . Terry

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1098.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1100.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1101.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1102.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1104.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1105.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1108.jpg

DougP
Dec 19th, 07, 06:00 AM
Very nice work -- keep the progess pictures coming

Corvettemaster
Dec 19th, 07, 05:34 PM
I just checked in for the daily update. Lookin GQQD!

Mav68erick
Dec 19th, 07, 06:07 PM
terry I think he meant Full floor ( not trunk ) since I see you got the feet areas cut out

Im gonna need to make a cart like that..

Im replacing 2 Quarters thinking full trunk want full floor.. and Im thinking the rockers are shot from what the areas by the wheel wells look and since the cowl tulips up front Pass was rotted bad and the drivers is dented and rusted.. Not to mention the cowl under the window it looks back with the window I can just se it with all the paint and filler removed!

Anyways good works, but arent you concerned about the quarters fitting since you did the whole trunk and stuff like that.. but hmm really your removed all the Skin metal and leaving all the skeleton so I guess you can make everything new fit rather then old and new fit which could be good and or bad

cheby2
Dec 19th, 07, 11:42 PM
Oops , My Bad ! I misread that , I am putting a full floorboard in , the cut outs in the old floorboard you see in the pics is what the previous owner cut out and took new patch panels and shoved down as far as he could and tacked them all around ! I cut the patch panels out and gave them to my brother . LOL
Mav , once you start taking panels off you tend to find more and more , you get to the "might as well" stage pretty Quick ! I went into this build with the attitude that if it has rust on it I was replacing the panel , period . To be honest , I'm in way over my head , flying by the seat of my pants , but I ain't skeered ! (but I will be fitting quarter before I button up the floor section and as I install the inner/outer wheelwells) Before I install the quarters , the doors will go back on and be adjusted , as will the trunk lid . I am confident that a happy medium can be reached . One good thing about metal is that you can make it longer , shorter or taller and I'm sure that there is some slicing and dicing in my future , but you're right I need to make sure that the inner structure is where it needs to be from the git-go . One thing's for sure , you need to think three steps ahead all the time or it'll come back and bite you . Oh , no update today , had to cut and buff some motorcycle tins today as a return favor for a buddy that notched my LS2 oil pan for me . Terry

cheby2
Dec 20th, 07, 11:48 PM
Ok guys the floor is officially out ! Took a while , several different tools , dealing with more*&^%$#@ spot welds but I got the lion's share out . Still have to remove the remaining flange down each inner rocker (more spot welds!) and cut out and replace the toe boards before the new floor can be installed . Terry

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1110.jpg
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1111.jpg
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1113.jpg
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1114.jpg

Remember what I said about thinking three steps ahead ? When ^ goes to v , you better have been thinking ahead ! Without the braces I put in it would have been catastrophic !
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1119.jpg
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1122.jpg
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1123.jpg

RicheyG
Dec 21st, 07, 07:33 AM
Not to mess up your thread, but I have a question about your dolly. Do you happen to have a drawing of it you can post or email to me?

Mav68erick
Dec 21st, 07, 02:06 PM
Are you retired? you seem to be moving at quite a good pace

cheby2
Dec 22nd, 07, 12:56 AM
Richey , I don't have any drawings , I just built it to fit the car . I got the idea from Mike'sCustomCars web site , A wealth of info and tons of pics .

Mav , actually disabled , an on the job injury , the pace kind of surprises me also , and I tend to get kind of focused during a project plus I'm having a ball .

Today (after doing some shopping for my lovely bride) I cleaned the flanges up around the rockers and started on the toe boards . It took some head scratching but I finally figured out the plan of attack and how I could mark the cut line and how much I needed to replace . I started out by cutting the outboard side and mounting flange out of the car so I could clamp the flange of the new part in it's place and be able to clamp the rest of the trimmed new part over the part of the floor to cut out (if that makes sense ) and mark the floor for cutting . Then remove the new part and cut inside the line to compensate for the thickness of the metal I had overlayed .
Maybe pics will help , a pic of new part in place with flange clamped
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1125.jpg

from the driver's position
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1124.jpg

another angle
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1126.jpg

after cutting
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1127.jpg
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1128.jpg

spot weld cuts (where new flange will weld)http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1130.jpg

Plans for tomorrow include getting pass side cut and both areas cleaned and epoxy sprayed on inner peice , back of new panels and inner rockers . Hopefully floor will go in Sunday ! Terry

Mav68erick
Dec 22nd, 07, 04:48 AM
You keep going these are gonna make good reference pics= )

firstrs
Dec 22nd, 07, 04:53 AM
your posts are really helping to figure out how this car is put together. Great work, and thanks for the amazing pictures.

kristofer
Dec 22nd, 07, 06:35 AM
awesome thread.

taggin this one too.

Corvettemaster
Dec 22nd, 07, 07:51 AM
Terry, I know what you mean about Mike's. The guy is deffinetly on top of his first Gen Game. I have heard the frame cart/jig from Mike's sells for$1700.00 w/o shipping. He sells the plans for the cart section for a $100.00 but like you said his site offers a world of information.
Keep up the good work and keep the pictures coming I am watching your progress with great intrest and check in for daily updates.

JPCamaro
Dec 22nd, 07, 10:51 AM
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1119.jpg

Comming along nicely. I hope you're planning on putting a coat of weld through primer (or something) on the insides of those rear frame rails. Now would be a great time to do it.

J.P.

PS Time off for disability huh? Don't let the labor board (or whoever, Ins Co. maybe?) see these pictures LOL.

cheby2
Dec 22nd, 07, 05:06 PM
Total different kind of situation with the disability . Happened 12 yrs. ago in the railroad industry and it is a occupational disability ( I am disabled from the actual job I was doing) The railroad industry has their own disability system (not under workmans comp) and their own retirement system (do not pay or collect Social Security) Total different animal than the norm , all I am restricted on is how much money I can make in addition to anuity pmts. Ok , with that said , I will have a update later tonight . Have to go to a family function . Terry

cheby2
Dec 22nd, 07, 09:36 PM
Ok , got pass side toe board marked and cut out using same method as driver side and finished cleaning up spot welds all around where floor will mount . Also ground old spot weld remains on front portion of rear frame rails , cleaned everything real well and shot epoxy on car and toe boards . Tomorrow I will weld in toe boards and possibly get floor board fitted and holes drilled for plug welds , maybe even get floorboard welded in ! (have another family function tomorrow also) Terry

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1131.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1132.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1133.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1134.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1135.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1136.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1137.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1138.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1139.jpg

cheby2
Dec 25th, 07, 03:55 PM
Between family functions and people here there hasn't been much time to work on the Camaro . But I did get a few things done , the toe boards are welded in and ground down (man , I hate butt welding sheetmetal ! ) finally , and I set the floor in for a first fitting and it fits well . I am going to mark the flanges for drilling for the plug welds and tub clearance and it ought to be ready to install . Terry:thumbsup:

If anyone's interested , there are 10 pages of pics on Photobucket , click on the link in my sig.

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1143.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1144.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1145.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1146.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1147.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1149.jpg

AutoRodTechnologies
Dec 27th, 07, 06:29 AM
Its been a while since I have checked in,, looks like you are gaining headway.. keep up the good work.

cheby2
Dec 27th, 07, 10:06 PM
Changed gears a little bit to give my back a rest . I had initially cut out rusty flanges where window glass fits on a-pillars and needed to patch in metal to replace , so I thought I would get this out of the way before finishing floor . Also patch in cutout on top of cowl where access hole was for airdoor diaphram on org. air-condition system , as I wasn't going to use it since I am going with Vintage Air setup . I still have more to do on firewall , such as DSE smooth plate , fill various holes , install cowl sides ect. , but I am going to finish floor and install tubs first . Terry

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1152.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1153.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1156.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1157.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1158.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1161.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1162.jpg

Corvettemaster
Dec 28th, 07, 09:18 AM
Looks Good Terry! I can't wait to see pics of the mini tubs and the shock setup.

cheby2
Dec 29th, 07, 12:50 AM
Yea Ron , I can't wait to see them myself , I'm still thinking about how I'm going to do the shock setup . I don't have any pics today , but I did get the floor welded in and will be making the mods for the tubs tomorrow and will at least get them clamped in for some pics . It's really coming together and I need to start fitting the quarters and tail panel before finalizing tubs , so I can hopefully avoid some of those buggers that tend to sneak up and bite you in the a$$ . Terry

spideynut
Dec 29th, 07, 02:28 AM
I have to just say one thing your MEAN with a grinder my friend!!

gonewacky
Dec 29th, 07, 06:20 PM
I thought I would cronicle the rebirth of this sad sack 68 , a SS / 4speed car with deluxe interior . Plans include a 6.0 LS engine , automatic tranny (TBD) , with a 9" rear w/Calvert Racing leafs and CalTracs , DSE minitubs , and all new sheetmetal .

In the beginning.....

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_0876.jpg
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_0877.jpg

And now , after a round with the plasma cutter .....

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_0991.jpg
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1001.jpg
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_0992.jpg
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_0993.jpg
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_0994.jpg
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_0997.jpg
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1000.jpg


http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_0995.jpg
Don't mean to bust your bubble,, but,, mine is in way worse shape than yours, and I'm going to try and save my 68 SS/RS 396 375hp 4speed/... I hope to learn from your experience and pics.. check out my sig, to see what some of my better parts shape are in..

Mav68erick
Dec 29th, 07, 07:39 PM
Dam Dale.. your cars gonna be down to the A pillars and inner sail panel quarters.. so replacing 99% of the sheet metal... was anything on the car salvagable? did it have an engine trans or rear end?

gonewacky
Dec 29th, 07, 07:59 PM
Hey Mav.. Just to make sure you know.. this is not my thread.. I just jumped in here to state my deliema.. if you looked at my sig. pictures, thats my car.. or should I say only a small part of it..My car is a original 1968 SS/RS 396 375 Hp. 4speed posi-trac with original drive train and protecto plate matching numbers car.. .. If it were'nt for all that I would'nt even consider this ordeal,/insanity...

spideynut
Dec 29th, 07, 10:14 PM
Did you guys ever consider the shell? If so why didnt you buy it?

gonewacky
Dec 29th, 07, 10:40 PM
Yes I did.. But I can buy all the repop sheet metal for less than $13,:yes:000.00

cheby2
Dec 29th, 07, 11:21 PM
Did you guys ever consider the shell? If so why didnt you buy it?

No , never seriously considered it , $13,000 plus freight , I've got $4,000 in sheetmetal , and I've got EVERYTHING to do the car plus DSE tubs , except the doors , mine are fine . But I'm doing everything myself , and I work cheeeep ! If you were going to have everything done at a restoration /body shop then , yes , would have considered it . Terry

cheby2
Dec 30th, 07, 12:10 AM
Got a few things done today , finished welding out my floor , except for the side flanges , they are spoted 5 places on each side , will finish them when I get it on the rotissorie . Plus I need to spray a little epoxy on some spots before I mount the seat supports . I got the mods on the floor done for the tubs , and installed the package tray , still need to get the rear seat back supports in to tie everything together before I install the tubs . I'm getting to the point that I need to spray several things with epoxy to seal and protect the bare metal before I cover it with other components . That kind of slows me down a tad but is a necessary step . After I get the tubs in I'm going to do a little work on the firewall , then hang some sheetmetal ! Terry

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1163.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1165.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1167.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1170.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1172.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1174.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1175.jpg

Mav68erick
Dec 30th, 07, 06:44 AM
Hey Terry shes coming along... is the floor over lapped at the toe kick panels and trans hull like an inch or something? Nice job with the rear floor by the wheel tubs stead of cutting flush you made your own flaps = )

RicheyG
Dec 30th, 07, 07:52 AM
Terry,

Nice work. Thanks for sharing this project in such detail, very educational.

prostreet69camaro
Dec 30th, 07, 10:23 AM
Terry,

You are doing a great job and very professional work. This goes to show that alot of do-it-yourselfers can accomplish the same thing. You are saving yourself alot of money doing it yourself.

Mike

Corvettemaster
Dec 30th, 07, 07:03 PM
Waiting to see those tubs...

Rarerat
Dec 30th, 07, 07:28 PM
Incredible work :thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:

Code 72
Dec 30th, 07, 08:24 PM
I will say, I have truly enjoyed this thread. You are doing nice work. Most modern bodyshops would not touch that car with a 10 ft. pole.:beers:
Greg

cheby2
Dec 31st, 07, 12:25 AM
Thanks for all the kind words guys , just glad we have a medium to share this info with like minded people . I can't take all the credit for a lot of the methods you see here , I learned a huge amount from MikesCustomCars and have to give credit where credit is due . But you still have to execute the work , and I'm here to tell you , it's not brain surgery , you just have to plan it out and take your time . I'm not kidding when I tell you that this is the first time I've been this deep into a Camaro body , but it has been by far the quickest turnaround I have experienced in a build due to first cutting all the trash metal off and starting with fresh metal from the git-go .

Today I donned the old blasting suit and blasted a few peices that I didn't do before :mad: and tomorrow will be prepping several spots for epoxy , before I can continue with welding , so , no pics today . Terry

PS Corvettemaster , me too! Mav , yes , there is a lap joint at the front and rear of the floor.

cheby2
Jan 1st, 08, 12:19 AM
Got a few things done today , I went back over everything that was bare metal and sanded any surface rust ,then ground the plug welds that needed dressing . Then shot epoxy on all the bare spots and the peices I blasted yesterday . When I get the tubs , rear seat supports and trunk hinges installed ,I will go back and prep all the floor and trunk surfaces , then get all those surfaces in epoxy . Plans for tomorrow are welding seat supports to floor , welding rear seat supports in and maybe starting the tub installation if everything goes well . Here's a few pics from today . Terry

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1188.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1189.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1190.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1191.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1192.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1193.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1201.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1202.jpg

cheby2
Jan 1st, 08, 11:43 PM
I got the front and rear seat supports welded in today and couldn't stand it , so I hung a little sheetmetal on it to see how everything lined up . Initial fit was good but will definantly need some tweaking , and posibly some cutting and reshapeing , but overall I was satisfied with the fit . Tomorrow I will be starting on the tub installation and will probably message the panels a bit to see what it's going to take to get right . Terry

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1205.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1206.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1208.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1209.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1211.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1212.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1215.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1216.jpg

67FamilyFun
Jan 2nd, 08, 05:31 AM
Terry, I've been subscribed to this thread and watching in awe and admiration for the duration:thumbsup:. As others have said, thanks for the education.

I've never done bodywork because of your quote below...

... but will definantly need some tweaking , and posibly some cutting and reshapeing ...


Not to burden, but can you describe what this means or what you are going to have to do. Not to simplify what you have done, but so far, it looks like everything has almost gone together like legos...there must be a lot more to it than that.
The two things I don't understand are "the art of the 'tweaking'" and how you know that the body/frame and everything is square and where it is supposed to be.
Thanks again,
Scott

Mav68erick
Jan 2nd, 08, 04:53 PM
Tweaking - to use a sledge hammer to force said piece into desired position that is wished upon the worker.

Cutting - to remove original sheetmetal from bad parts of car and then to put on new sheet metal cut and butt weld it in a patch welding fashion as to keep most of the cars sheetmetal as original as possible, ie those who have the ultra rare double passanger side quarter panels must also buy 2 new pass quarters or it cant be numbers matching sheet metal

Reshapeing - To turn a what looks to be a perfectly good car with paint on it into a piece of swiss cheese by blasting it and cutting away what others wouldnt.


Also notice I figured out how terry is getting all the work done that he is...

Pictures from top to bottom going down.

Picture 2 and 5 ... cheap labor I presume? Im gonna assume terry is the one directing these fine photos.

And the Last picture I see a grill? Im thinking grilled crawdads and what ever other critters them folks from Lousiana and deem soul food..

Also terry in the last pic with the grill and tail panel whats up with the tail panel meeting the quarter where its scraped on the quarter? the tail panel looks like it was hit with a cut off wheel?

cheby2
Jan 2nd, 08, 06:00 PM
I am building a post about those very things , tweaking ,cutting and reshaping , along with tools and products that I use . I'll be going a little more indepth about some of the procedures and methods that I personally use , some of it being unorthodox , but it works for me in my shop . Others may handle different circumstances differently , but I don't have a lot of metalworking tools and I have to make due with what I have and limited space . Judging by what I saw today while working with the tubs , both inner and outer along with fitting the quarter with the tubs attached , there will be quite a bit of tweaking , cutting and reshapeing .

And about the pics , Mav , that is my soon to be son-in-law in those pics and he was getting the grill ready to bar-b-que some chicken and sausage . He and my daughter are both Chefs and loves to cook Cajun style . And I was taking all the pics .

As far as the crawfish , we prefer them boiled or in an etouffee , plus it's not quite season yet , maybe by the end of the month . Humm , grilled crawfish ? Might work , we buy the by the 40lb. sack , so that's lots of turning ! That's one thing about down here , if there's a ditch or pond around we'll never go hungry ! If it slithers , crawls , scoots or swims , we eat it , just cook some rice , boil some water with some Zatarands or Tony Chacheres seasoning , onions and roux in it and we can make a meal , Sha ! Terry

Oh ! those marks on the quarter are some foam rubber packaging materal that is stuck to the metal .

Mav68erick
Jan 2nd, 08, 07:38 PM
but whats the black crease cut on the tail panel? black foam?

AutoRodTechnologies
Jan 2nd, 08, 07:45 PM
looks like you are knocking this one out, i better hurry it up

JR2226NHRA
Jan 2nd, 08, 08:46 PM
Cheby 2 What Brand Sheet Metal Are You Using Good Mark? The Rear Body Panle Looks Like It Fits Very Well. Iam Also Building A 68 With All The Aftermarket Sheet Metal And The Rear Body Panle Is Not The Best Fitting Thing I Have Ever Hung Thanks For The Pics I Know What Kind Of Time You Have In This Project

cheby2
Jan 2nd, 08, 11:31 PM
Mav , the tail panel came that way , I haven't cut anything on it ...yet .

JR2226NHRA , a little bit of every Manf. , Goodmark , Dynacorn , Golden Legion , and even a few peices made here in the states . I don't know exactly which the tail panel is but I'm going to make a list of what part is what brand and post so I can pass on my experiences with each one . I don't know for sure , but I would bet that they all come from the same facility in Asia . I know for sure the toe boards and the tubs are made here in the states , the TB fit very well , but there are some issues with the tubs . I don't know if it was my doing (moding the trunk floor and frame rails) or the tubs themselves , or just variances between different cars , but I have and know I'm going to have to do some more cutting/welding to make the tubs fit to my satisifaction . Just about every panel will have some springback issues on the panel and takes a little hammer and dolly work , some more than others . Terry

Chad , I don't know about knocking out , but it is going well , I keep waiting for that monkey to jump on my back !

AutoRodTechnologies
Jan 3rd, 08, 07:40 PM
well it looks like you are doing a great job to me.. keep it up..

Mav68erick
Jan 3rd, 08, 07:45 PM
Mav , the tail panel came that way , I haven't cut anything on it ...yet .

JR2226NHRA , a little bit of every Manf. , Goodmark , Dynacorn , Golden Legion , and even a few peices made here in the states . I don't know exactly which the tail panel is but I'm going to make a list of what part is what brand and post so I can pass on my experiences with each one . I don't know for sure , but I would bet that they all come from the same facility in Asia . I know for sure the toe boards and the tubs are made here in the states , the TB fit very well , but there are some issues with the tubs . I don't know if it was my doing (moding the trunk floor and frame rails) or the tubs themselves , or just variances between different cars , but I have and know I'm going to have to do some more cutting/welding to make the tubs fit to my satisifaction . Just about every panel will have some springback issues on the panel and takes a little hammer and dolly work , some more than others . Terry

Chad , I don't know about knocking out , but it is going well , I keep waiting for that monkey to jump on my back !


I guess the bumper covers that up anyways

69X11
Jan 4th, 08, 12:00 PM
Where did the rear package tray come from. I've been looking for one forever.

alanrw
Jan 4th, 08, 12:35 PM
Sure makes you wonder what GM did back in the day when it came to building bodies. They didn't have time to "fit" everything, just slam em together as they came down the line.

Musta had jigs that pulled everything together, weld it up and once it was out the factory door, it is someone else's problem.



alan

Corvettemaster
Jan 4th, 08, 04:19 PM
Terry .... How are the tubs coming. I was hoping for some pictures. I am on the fence about doing mine since I already bought an installed my OE inners and full trunk pan. But its still not to late to go back and tub it. I'm just not sure I want to spend any more on sheet metal. I too purchased every repop piece out there a year ago for around $8500 plus. I also have another 68 and a 69 in the wait for restoring for my personal use.
http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a371/Wickedink/68%20Camaro/1223200768Camaro019.jpg

http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a371/Wickedink/68%20Camaro/122607trunkframerails025.jpg

cheby2
Jan 5th, 08, 12:26 AM
69X11 , I got it from Firewheel Classics , I think they just started repopping it , nice part .

Corvettemaster , I've been working on it and I'll have to say it isn't the easiest installation and there is a lot to it , but I think the end result will be worth it . BTW cool jig , if I were to do this more I would definately build a much more intricate jig with all the bells and whistles . I don't know if DSE's tub kit comes with more indepth instructions and perhaps a pattern for the rear of the cutout for the tubs , but I know mine didn't and I made my cut too far back and I am going to have to patch some metal in to take up the gap . No big deal , but I am pretty meticulous with measurements and planning out things , but this time I just screwed up , but we can fix it , we have the technology ! LOL Anyway here are a few pics of what I have done , I had one from the rear but I erased it from my camera by mistake . I still have to weld on the outer tub but I have it all fitted and will get it done this weekend . Terry

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1242.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1243.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1241.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1244.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1245.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1246.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1247.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1270.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1271.jpg

Mav68erick
Jan 5th, 08, 06:59 AM
Hey doesnt look like you notched the support things from the floor to the hatshelf for the tubs.. Did you just move them in and weld them or is it such a good job I cant tell?

And wheres your door? If the outer wheel well is located by the quarter panel, how do you know the quarter was in the right spot without the door being in place?

Corvettemaster
Jan 5th, 08, 09:18 AM
Terry,
I saved your pictures to my reference file for later veiwing. I going out in the shop now to finish up the trunk pan an some additional welding. I am pretty sure I am going to for go the tubs on this build and do them on my next one which is a 69 that I may keep awhile. But they do look good and once I get out in the shop I may change my mind if I can keep busy elsewhere. What would you put the cost at? The way you did it and if you were to buy the everything prefabed? Looks good! keep up the good work and thanks for the kind words on the jig. I figured I will be doing several more so it was worth the investment.

cheby2
Jan 5th, 08, 11:02 PM
Mav ,I did put a small notch in the , let's call them Y supports , but I had already removed a section by making a small horizontal cut to a peice that spotwelded to the Y brace and org. tub . I reinstalled the Y brace pretty close to where it was originally .

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_0998.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1244.jpg

I am going to fab a peice to go back in between the Y brace and the tub to brace it back up and make it look more factory , I thought I saved these peices but I can't find them .
The second question , The jam brace , the lineup of the rear of the rocker to the front of the wheelwell , how the sail panel lines up with the dripwell , how it lines up on the side of the rear window structure , height of the side window ledge in compared to the inner window ledge , how the quarter lines up with the outer wheelwell ,ect.... among other things . The door is just another peice of the puzzle , plus it's adjustable , but rest assured , it will be mounted , as will the rear panel and the panel below the rear window ,the trunklid and the roof before anything gets welded . All part of the process .

Corvettemaster , I'm not qiute sure what you're asking about the cost , the tubs are $400 ,the tub kit (springs, offset shackles,tubs,amd shock relocation setup) about $1100=$1200 . I don't think anyone sells a prefabed unit , you would still have to cut and mod your trunk floor and framerails . I would put the time at 35-40hrs for the conversion . But for me about 100hrs , I'm slow ! LOL and I'm not in any hurry and don't have any deadline , I refuse to put one on it ! Terry

RicheyG
Jan 6th, 08, 12:44 AM
Noticed you are using vise grip type clamps. I bought these clecos for holding sheet metal and found them to be far superior to those type of clamps. http://www.aircraftspruce.com/menus/to/sheetmetaltools.html

Richey

Corvettemaster
Jan 6th, 08, 11:42 AM
Noticed you are using vise grip type clamps. I bought these clecos for holding sheet metal and found them to be far superior to those type of clamps. http://www.aircraftspruce.com/menus/to/sheetmetaltools.html

Richey

Clecos are O.K. and I use them but there are times more than not the clamp is the better way to go. Now the investment is another story. Try $34 bux and up per clamp if you buy the IRwin brand vise grip. Looks like Terry has a local Harbor Freight & tool near by which is a good thing. I purchased 50 of the 7" clamps on sale for $3.98 ea. These will work almost as good as the Brand name however any larger and it is necessary to have the quality or your wasting time and money. I just bit the bullet on a couple of larger ones at Northern Tool and I am still stressing over what I spent.

Terry,
You answered my question. I didn't want to spend the additional time or money on this one. I am already in over$22k and you can see I am no further along. I have a 69 I really want to do for myself so I will go with the DSE kit when I get to that project. Keep up the good work! I check to see how your doing daily....:thumbsup:

thorpe67RS
Jan 6th, 08, 05:48 PM
WOW!!! This is the first time ive seen and read thru this entire thread. And what an awesome thread it is. I am amazed that someone can take a car as far down as you have and bring it back to new. I will certainly be making this thread part of my routine in checking into TC. Great, Great Job so far!! :thumbsup:

cheby2
Jan 6th, 08, 11:39 PM
Richey , I have thought about buying the cleco fastners a few times and I'm sure they do what they are designed to do well , but the vice-grip clamps seem to work well for me for a variety of clamping applications besides two peices of metal flat against one another. Plus I may move a peice around several times clamping it each time .

Ron , I thought I understood your question correctly, but wanted to be sure , so I covered all the bases . Yes , you're right on the current build , it wouldn't make much sense to backtrack on the tubs and throw more money at it. I didn't originally plan on the tubs , I made the trip and picked up all my sheetmetal , then after tearing down the car more, made the decision that I wanted to tuck a little more rubber under the car .

And , yes , Harbor Freight is my friend ! I have bought quite a bit of stuff from them over the last couple of years and their stuff has served me well. You just have to treat it as throw away stuff , use it up and toss it , and buy another one . But on my major tools , I try to buy quality tools , such as electric power tools and mechanic hand tools . The long clamps you see in the pics are not even HF quality tools , a friend of mine went to a Chinese tool wholesale warehouse and bought a couple of cases of those as he is about to start a project simular to mine , so I borrowed a couple from him .

Craig , thanks for the kind words , I am tickled to death that this thread has sparked so much interest . I am just doing what I love to do , having a ball and learning a whole lot in the process and being able to pass it along to like-minded car people for their enjoyment is just icing on the cake .

In a couple of days , I'm leaving for a week or so , heading up to Colorado to marry my baby girl off ! Rented a ranch , right on the continental divide just out of Breckenridge , to have the whole shindig , so I'll have to be away from my baby for a while . But I'm sure I'll come back invigorated (or broke!) and ready to pounce right on this project and make it look like a Camaro again . Terry

Microgiant
Jan 6th, 08, 11:44 PM
I have never used clekos. How are they better than say a sheetmetal screw for holding things together?

RicheyG
Jan 7th, 08, 05:27 AM
And , yes , Harbor Freight is my friend ! I have bought quite a bit of stuff from them over the last couple of years and their stuff has served me well. You just have to treat it as throw away stuff , use it up and toss it , and buy another one . But on my major tools , I try to buy quality tools , such as electric power tools and mechanic hand tools . The long clamps you see in the pics are not even HF quality tools , a friend of mine went to a Chinese tool wholesale warehouse and bought a couple of cases of those as he is about to start a project simular to mine , so I borrowed a couple from him .


If you don't mind, I would like to know the name of the Chinese warehouse were you purchased your clamps. I have several clamps from HF, but will need more soon. I shop HF frequently and agree you just use them up and then trash them. I was also wondering if you would mind taking a close up picture of the inside of the inner quarter panel support and post it. Im going to have to fab the bottom of mine on both sides as they are rusted out were they join to the inner rocker panel. Thanks again for sharing your build, Exceptional Work.

RicheyG

camaro tim
Jan 7th, 08, 06:34 PM
Terry,great job.!!! when we move next month ,to be closer to the shop.I will be doing my own qtrs, taillight panel and trunk floor on my 70 camaro.Thanks to you and your pics.BTW I have already had to build a driverside toeboard.THANKS MAN.

thorpe67RS
Jan 7th, 08, 08:12 PM
Safe travels to Colorado. Dont be gone too long..we anxiously await more progresss pics. :D

Arai
Jan 8th, 08, 10:21 AM
WOW......just saw this thread and spent the past 1.5 hours reading it in and reviewing the pictures. You almost have me convinced that I should do the same thing and not buy a shell. You do some EXCELLENT work. I did paint and body work for many years on the side, but I never performed any of the stuff I see you doing here. My hat goes off to you for your superior craftsmanship on your project. So you only spent $4500-$5000 on all the sheet metal? I am trying to weigh the cost of buying the complete shell at $13000-$15000 or to spend $5000 on sheet metal, $3000-$5000 on a car, and another $2000-$2500 on tools. I own several tools in my shop, but still need a plasma cutter and a plethera of clamps. Pretty much have the other neccesities like welder, grinders and so on. I will need to build or buy a stand to put the body on. What type of epoxy is it that you are using to seal everything off? I know WAYYYYY back in the 1st days of building with my father, we used lacquer primer. Then as I started doing more paint work I started using a 3 part epoxy that could be color tinted to assist with coverage later. Is there new technology now that everyone is using or perfers? THanks guys! This site is amazing and this thread is absolutely wonderful and informative!!!

BTW....On Mikes Custom car website I notice on several of the projects they are sealing in between the pieces with a silicone or some other goop...anyone know what this is? Also I see they are sealing the back/underside of most pieces like the quarters with a black substance....is this just rubberized undercoating?

Corvettemaster
Jan 8th, 08, 05:09 PM
WOW......just saw this thread and spent the past 1.5 hours reading it in and reviewing the pictures. You almost have me convinced that I should do the same thing and not buy a shell. You do some EXCELLENT work. I did paint and body work for many years on the side, but I never performed any of the stuff I see you doing here. My hat goes off to you for your superior craftsmanship on your project. So you only spent $4500-$5000 on all the sheet metal? I am trying to weigh the cost of buying the complete shell at $13000-$15000 or to spend $5000 on sheet metal, $3000-$5000 on a car, and another $2000-$2500 on tools. I own several tools in my shop, but still need a plasma cutter and a plethera of clamps. Pretty much have the other neccesities like welder, grinders and so on. I will need to build or buy a stand to put the body on. What type of epoxy is it that you are using to seal everything off? I know WAYYYYY back in the 1st days of building with my father, we used lacquer primer. Then as I started doing more paint work I started using a 3 part epoxy that could be color tinted to assist with coverage later. Is there new technology now that everyone is using or perfers? THanks guys! This site is amazing and this thread is absolutely wonderful and informative!!!

BTW....On Mikes Custom car website I notice on several of the projects they are sealing in between the pieces with a silicone or some other goop...anyone know what this is? Also I see they are sealing the back/underside of most pieces like the quarters with a black substance....is this just rubberized undercoating?


You don't need the plasma cutter. I spent 2 grand and found out it wasn't all it was cracked up to be. You can get the same results with cheaper tools it just takes longer. Don't forget the consumable for a plasma cutter aren't cheap but cut off wheels are and you go through them almost at the same rate. I just sold my Esab PC650 since it just sits around besides I thought the money would be better spent on a new welder. I am picking up a new Miller 252 machine this friday.... So unless your rich you can for go the PC.

Hatman
Jan 8th, 08, 08:14 PM
You don't need the plasma cutter. I spent 2 grand and found out it wasn't all it was cracked up to be. You can get the same results with cheaper tools it just takes longer. Don't forget the consumable for a plasma cutter aren't cheap but cut off wheels are and you go through them almost at the same rate. I just sold my Esab PC650 since it just sits around besides I thought the money would be better spent on a new welder. I am picking up a new Miller 252 machine this friday.... So unless your rich you can for go the PC.
You are going to love the Miller 252 I bought one last month and I'm wondering why I waited . Take your time and set the timer for your pre flow & post flow start-up speed & burn back & i'm sure you will enjoy it as I am.

cheby2
Jan 8th, 08, 11:29 PM
Arai , Thanks for the kind words , actually I have about $4000 in sheet metal ,but......... I went and picked up my metal (600mi round trip) , so I figure I saved around a grand on shipping . I bought the complete front end from the firewall forward , top , from the doors back and around , acomplete floor , trunk ,toe boards ,DSE tubs&firewall plate and package tray . The only thing I didn't buy was the doors and the rocker panels .

Ron is right about the plasma cutter , I used one on mine to quickly remove all the big panels but spent many hours on removing spotwelds and edges around big panels .

As far as the epoxy (this ought to stir up some discussion) I use Omni epoxy primer , I also use their high build urathane primer and have shot their bc/cc on the last couple of projects . I have gotten very good results with the Omni products , and they have held up well . I have also shot some Dupont HotHues colors on another project as well as Ditzler products . All seem to be quality products with just different methods of application and mixing .I'm sure there are a lot of opinions on different brands and on Omni , but I am simply stating what works and has worked for me in the past .

Well it's 12:26 am and we're taking off at 5:00am on our trip to Co. so I better get some rest , I'm going to see miles and miles of Texas tomorrow . Terry

Arai
Jan 9th, 08, 04:55 AM
Arai , Thanks for the kind words , actually I have about $4000 in sheet metal ,but......... I went and picked up my metal (600mi round trip) , so I figure I saved around a grand on shipping . I bought the complete front end from the firewall forward , top , from the doors back and around , acomplete floor , trunk ,toe boards ,DSE tubs&firewall plate and package tray . The only thing I didn't buy was the doors and the rocker panels .

Ron is right about the plasma cutter , I used one on mine to quickly remove all the big panels but spent many hours on removing spotwelds and edges around big panels .

As far as the epoxy (this ought to stir up some discussion) I use Omni epoxy primer , I also use their high build urathane primer and have shot their bc/cc on the last couple of projects . I have gotten very good results with the Omni products , and they have held up well . I have also shot some Dupont HotHues colors on another project as well as Ditzler products . All seem to be quality products with just different methods of application and mixing .I'm sure there are a lot of opinions on different brands and on Omni , but I am simply stating what works and has worked for me in the past .

Well it's 12:26 am and we're taking off at 5:00am on our trip to Co. so I better get some rest , I'm going to see miles and miles of Texas tomorrow . Terry

Thanks.....I have as well shot Omni, Dupont, PPG and House of Color. So I guess it is safe to assume that its pretty much the same stuff I used to shoot 10 years ago when I was in the biz. Thanks

DZ Fool
Jan 9th, 08, 05:15 AM
In a couple of days , I'm leaving for a week or so , heading up to Colorado to marry my baby girl off ! Rented a ranch , right on the continental divide just out of Breckenridge , to have the whole shindig , so I'll have to be away from my baby for a while . But I'm sure I'll come back invigorated (or broke!) and ready to pounce right on this project and make it look like a Camaro again . Terry


Do some skiing I hope

Leonard1
Jan 9th, 08, 10:24 AM
Amazing, simply amazing!

Wazoo151
Jan 9th, 08, 12:03 PM
Great work - I feel like a slacker after watching your rapid progression, but I can't weld to save my life :)

Robert

Freddy Mercado
Jan 9th, 08, 04:13 PM
Wow, this is one of the best posts ever!!! Ive seen plenty included in here and Team Chevelle. This is by far the best!!! Great job!

Corvettemaster
Jan 10th, 08, 03:37 PM
You are going to love the Miller 252 I bought one last month and I'm wondering why I waited . Take your time and set the timer for your pre flow & post flow start-up speed & burn back & i'm sure you will enjoy it as I am.



While Terry is away I don't think he would mind us keeping his thread going. Hatman:
I picked it up last night and had only a few minutes to fool around with it but that was enough to make me very happy. This is going to make life a lot easier and the quality of the welds will be much stronger. According to the manual the timers are factory set but can be adjusted, Did you find a need to make changes?

Mav68erick
Jan 10th, 08, 06:30 PM
dam... I may actually have to start doing something instead of watching..

Hatman
Jan 11th, 08, 07:22 AM
While Terry is away I don't think he would mind us keeping his thread going. Hatman:
I picked it up last night and had only a few minutes to fool around with it but that was enough to make me very happy. This is going to make life a lot easier and the quality of the welds will be much stronger. According to the manual the timers are factory set but can be adjusted, Did you find a need to make changes?
Yes they are preset from the factory but the factory doesn't know what size wire you are useing ie. ..023,.035, .045. It may work for you with the presets but I found in needed a little differant run in time with spot welds. It's easy to set up. Let me know what you do.

iowa68x2
Jan 14th, 08, 10:04 PM
Who's the man? Terry is. I salute you for having the stones to even try this. I have a project that will likely require work like this one and I have one that isn't so bad, and I've been trying to decide which one to do first. After seeing what a little work ethic can do I may just start taking apart the bad one first. I guess if I can fix it then the other shouldn't be a problem. Thank you very much for taking all these pictures and let me tell ya, you're inspiring a lot of us slackers. Keep it up and congrats on the wedding.

captcanuck68
Jan 15th, 08, 09:42 AM
Terry, just got into your... build up saga, and to say a guy in his back yard doing this kind of extensive work, and the quality of it, is more than impressive. And to be self taught just inspires the rest of us!

Have you ever considered getting into the teaching of your skills at a tech school, as there are many out there who could benifit from them.

I too am downloading much of your progress for future reference. Keep up the great work!

cap68

rmcamaro
Jan 15th, 08, 02:38 PM
I am tickled to death that this thread has sparked so much interest . I am just doing what I love to do , having a ball and learning a whole lot in the process and being able to pass it along to like-minded car people for their enjoyment is just icing on the cake .

TerryTerry,

I just posted a link to this thread over at Team Chevelle. Last I checked this was up to "page 2", it's now on "page 8", so I've got some reading to do. :D I figured the guys in the body shop forum over there would get a kick out of this like I am. Thanks for sharing and learning. I'm sure many of us will be using this as a reference in many ways. Keep up the awesome work.

Rod

Motorhead62
Jan 15th, 08, 10:35 PM
That is some amazing metal work you are performing! :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

Good Luck :D

P.S. Do want to sell those aluminum slot wheels? :D

cheby2
Jan 16th, 08, 01:06 AM
Wow ! , never thought this project would stir up so much interest . I've stated this before , but I'll say it again , I really am flying by the seat of my pants on this build , I've never been this deep in a Camaro . I've changed a few body panels over the years , and I've done 4 Camaros , basically tearing them totally down and refurbishing as I reassemble , but none to the degree as this one . I'm serious when I say that it really isn't Rocket Science , just a little experience , a few tools , determination , and not letting ANYONE burst YOUR bubble . There are LOTS of naysayers out there that would love to see you fail , just so they could say "I told you so", but I refuse to let that happen . I , personally , HAVE to set goals on the build , and work toward those goals , sure ,there are lots of bumps along the way , you just have to work through them , and remember , they cannot kill you and eat you , period .

Thanks for all the kind words on the thread , we got in from Co. a couple of hours ago and I am on my a$$ , everything went well and it was a beautiful setting that will be very fond memorys for everyone that was there ,my daughter and her hubby are still up there for the rest of the week . We stayed at 11400ft elevation for four days and it almost killed this ole webbed-toed redneck from south Louisiana ! I've been up there several times , but never at that elevation for the entire time . I hpe to get back to work on the Camaro in the next day or two , but first I need some r&r , it's been a rough week or so . Terry

Mav68erick
Jan 16th, 08, 05:05 AM
im sure the right tools help,.. thats why I spent 50 bucks on the seam busters for my panels the straight and right angles ones.. hope they work good = )

Corvettemaster
Jan 16th, 08, 06:34 AM
Welcome Back Terry!

VMXRACER
Jan 16th, 08, 10:00 PM
Awesome.Just Awesome.

cheby2
Jan 17th, 08, 12:05 AM
Glad to be back Ron, and I am itching to get back to work on the Camaro !

Mav , excuse my ignorance , but what are seam busters ? I haven't heard of them before . And yes , the right tools help , you would be surprised what you can accomplish with a mig welder , a couple of body hammers and dollies , and a little determination . I think the biggest obstical to overcome for all of us is to get out there and do it , a journey of a thousand steps starts with the first step .

Rod , I'm going to have to go over there and check that out , seems car guys like to soak up these types of threads and I really enjoy sharing my experiences and what I learn as I proceed with this build . I hope this build inspires more guys to get out there and do some of the things that they have been wanting to do on their cars . Thanks , Terry

Mav68erick
Jan 17th, 08, 04:35 AM
http://www.sjdiscounttools.com/stc20015sb.html
http://www.sjdiscounttools.com/stc20016.html

I got those, someone else mentioned them when I asked how they sperated panels after spot weld drilling, also ordered a new spot weld drill from eastwood... my hole say type sucked, I tried to use a cutoff wheel side ways and dont like its non uniformity... Yeah also ordered eastwoods starting set of body hammers for 22.00 made in chine = ( but as long as the handle doesnt break Ill be ok!...

cheby2
Jan 17th, 08, 10:11 PM
You use them after drilling spotwelds , ok I see now . I have the holesaw type of cutter , and you're right , it sucks , but I have found that if you take a 1/8 drill bit and make a small indentation in the middle of the spotweld for the pin on the cutter to index in , it makes the cutter work lots better . Some people use a center punch , but the drill bit cut seems to work better for me . I don't have a quality set of body hammers , just some cheapo set I bought years ago , and I do have a couple of specialty hammers i built .

Tomorrow I'm starting back on the Camaro ! I'm having withdrawls and need a fix . Will have some more pics and hope to make some progress . Terry

Mav68erick
Jan 18th, 08, 04:30 AM
I used a punch... but on any sort of radius.. like the the wheel wells from the inside of the car It kept walking.. on the firewall it worked great!..

I got my eastwood 3/8 Endmill style cutter.. tested it out on my Driver side cowl tulip on the firewall, oo cuts nice.. then I grabbed my seam buster.. sure works better then a chisel.. also used an air chisel it works good a little to good.. and if u miss a spot weld it just destroys some of the other metal if your not careful

my holese type had the pin and had a spring behind it thing was from matco and was like 25 bucks for the arbor and 15 for the saw.

KevinK7
Jan 18th, 08, 06:19 AM
Terry,
Absolutely incredible work.
Thanks so much for taking the TIME to photo/chronicle it all for us to enjoy.:beers:
One of the earlier pics seemed to show original paint, ...was that car originally Teal Blue (code L)? (I know you're not going original, but that is an awsome color, ...my '68 in sig).
I will surely be following this along with the rest of the crew :thumbsup:

Kevin

cheby2
Jan 18th, 08, 11:40 PM
Wow! beautiful car Kevin ! My car is F 2(I think?) color code .Island Teal with black vinyl top . I still don't know what color I'm going to paint it , I want to do Cortez silver w/black D90 stripe but I've already had 2 cars painted Cortez ,so I don't know for sure yet .(can't help but love that color)

Didn't get to work on the car today much , so I don't have any pics , maybe tomorrow . Terry

RicheyG
Jan 19th, 08, 10:46 PM
You use them after drilling spotwelds , ok I see now . I have the holesaw type of cutter , and you're right , it sucks , but I have found that if you take a 1/8 drill bit and make a small indentation in the middle of the spotweld for the pin on the cutter to index in , it makes the cutter work lots better . Some people use a center punch , but the drill bit cut seems to work better for me . I don't have a quality set of body hammers , just some cheapo set I bought years ago , and I do have a couple of specialty hammers i built .

Tomorrow I'm starting back on the Camaro ! I'm having withdrawls and need a fix . Will have some more pics and hope to make some progress . Terry

Terry,

I'm having with-draws too, its been in the 20's here at night which doesn't leave much time for warming up. I'm ready to see some updated pictures of your project. They have been my winter fix....... Hope vacation was good for you.

Mav68erick
Jan 20th, 08, 07:07 AM
20s.. its 3 degrees here in Michigan, lucky it isnt windy,

RicheyG
Jan 20th, 08, 09:59 AM
20s.. its 3 degrees here in Michigan, lucky it isnt windy,

I just found out I'm pretty wimpy.....

Mav68erick
Jan 20th, 08, 06:49 PM
Everythings bigger in Texas... even the sissies :D

Corvettemaster
Jan 20th, 08, 08:27 PM
It's 58 degrees here in Florida right now. I have two shirts and a coat on, I don't know how you Northern guys do it. I guess I have just been here to long and my blood has thinned out however there was a time , about thirty years or so that I delt with it too in Connecticut. Now Terry...Get back to work! I need more pics:}

Mav68erick
Jan 21st, 08, 04:28 AM
a COAT!? If it was 55 no wind id be running around in a t shirt and shorts.. I think its funny when you watch the first few supercrosses in cali. and its 60 out and people are wearing big baggy artic looking coats and hats..

alanrw
Jan 21st, 08, 08:54 AM
You guys in the great north have 90 weight running in your veins. We here in the sunbelt have 10 weight.

alan
out of SoCal-65 degrees, where did I leave my sweatshirt?

Camuchi
Jan 21st, 08, 09:40 AM
Thats how we Identify the snowbirds down here.
It is 50 - 60 degrees outside and they are on the beach! We are all inside with the heat up and our jackets on- ha ha.

BTW - watched the Green bay game last noght - HOLY CRAP that was cold.

cheby2
Jan 24th, 08, 12:19 AM
Alright , enough chit-chat , let's get back to work ! LOL I finally got to spend a little time on the Camaro today , got the pass. side inner wheel tub in and fitted the rear panels a bit . Having some fitment problems with the quarter to rear panel , it's like the tail light panel fits too far forward , or the quarters are too long , scratching my head on this one . I have taken numerous measurements off of 2 other cars and I'm still at a loss as to where the problem actually is . I have fitted the roof , panel below the window , both quarters , tail light panel and trunk lid but I still can't quite put my finger on it . Seems like the trunk panel is too short , bringing the tail peice too far forward , but I compared the measurements with the two cars and that doesn't seem to be the case . I'm looking at several possible remedies but just kind of overloaded and had to leave it alone , hopefully will start fresh tomorrow and find a solution to the problem . Terry

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1277.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1278.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1279.jpg

Here you can see the difference
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1273.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1274.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1275.jpg

Lobstah
Jan 24th, 08, 04:49 AM
One of the "tips" I got from my supplier when I purchased the full belly for my car involved the wheelhouses. He said to weld the wheelhouses to the fender FIRST...then do the trunk seam. If you do the trunk first, there isn't much give if you need to pull a bit to get the fender seam right, where if you do the fender first, it's easy to pull enough to close up the seam in the trunk.


Jim

Rhino
Jan 24th, 08, 06:21 AM
Having some fitment problems with the quarter to rear panel , it's like the tail light panel fits too far forward , or the quarters are too long , scratching my head on this one . I have taken numerous measurements off of 2 other cars and I'm still at a loss as to where the problem actually is .


I'm currently having the exact same problem (although not nearly as extreme)
My tail appears to be setting roughly 1/4 inch too far forward, or is a little bit narrower than the original. I say that because once I put my trunk lid on I notice my trunk gaps get much tighter toward the rear. I haven't quite figured it out after a few days of playing with it.

I'm using goodmark quarters and an OER tail panel. Both of which came highly regarded as fitting great when speaking to an auto restoration place in my area. What are you using?

cheby2
Jan 24th, 08, 12:53 PM
Let me clarify this a little . In pic #4 , the overhead shot , the problem area is center of the pic , I can pull the top into alinement . Pic #5 ,same problem , different angle . Pic #6 , from the rear ,the 3/4-1" gap is not the problem , I just can't pull it over without either pulling the tail panel back or shoving the quarter forward .

My quarters are Golden Legion (Goodmark) and the tail panel box has no brand markings . I think the difference in brands is more of a difference in metal quality/thickness , than in actually different stampings . It's not like Taiwan has a dozen huge metal presses , each with their own set of dies for these cars . I suspect that all panels that we're talking about come from the same supplier/facility , but ,I may be wrong . Going to go try to fit it up now , will report results/progress , or lack thereof , tonight . Terry

Mav68erick
Jan 24th, 08, 02:18 PM
doesnt look like the tail panel and quarter are off front to back in the last picture to much.. how bout pix of it in the s ail panel drip railing.. maybe the quarter isnt far enough forward? other than that I think if u got it forward another half inch or so you could run ratchet straps around your quarter panel and suck it in towards the tail panel... I seen someone do it on another board to a firebird, but they did both quarters at the same time

prostreet69camaro
Jan 24th, 08, 03:03 PM
Looks like you need to unbolt the tail panel from the trunk panel and line up the tail panel to your quarters. Do this to both sides and mount the trunk lid next. See how the trunk lid lines up to the tail panel and quarters. If you suck the quarters in with a strap you will bow the quarters out and it might also mess the trunk lid fitment up. Once you have it all alighned to your satisfaction you will probably have the 1" gap between the trunk panel and the tail panel. You might have to section the trunk panel 1" to match the tail panel and add a 1" strip across the trunk panel for the 1".

You might need to hang your doors to check the quarter panel to door gaps and see if the quarters are to far back. That will tell you if you need to move the quarters forward.

Keep up the good work. You will figure it out. Its almost like you have to pre assemble all the pieces before welding for the minor adjustments. But so far it has been lining up very well.

alanrw
Jan 24th, 08, 03:38 PM
What we need is a total body jig located in Kansas (geographical center of the U.S.). Rolling the body into the jig and swinging locater arms into position would define the exact placement of all body panels just like they did in the factory.

Said jig would be located in a pasture so that there could be month long build sessions (just like the baseball fantasy camps only ours would be for real men with sockets and mig welders) People would come with their cars on trailers attached to motor homes. I see it as a Field of Dreams for gearheads.

At night, we sit around the campfire drinking a little beer and telling lies.

If you build it, they will come (in a whisper voice).

alan

Mav68erick
Jan 24th, 08, 04:32 PM
If you build it, Ill drive it for ya

Rhino
Jan 24th, 08, 04:37 PM
Pic #6 , from the rear ,the 3/4-1" gap is not the problem , I just can't pull it over without either pulling the tail panel back or shoving the quarter forward .

My problem is very similar. The quarters seem to be fitting about 1/4 further back than they should at the tail panel, although they fit very good everywhere else.

AutoRodTechnologies
Jan 24th, 08, 05:01 PM
It's so hard to give advice over the computer, i wish one of us could lend a hand at the site, i've had problems with quarter fitment on these before. the last 69 i did had that problem, for some reason i think i moved the tail panel back some, but it has been a long time since we did that car.

alanrw
Jan 24th, 08, 05:53 PM
Chad, what happens to the deck lid when you move the tail pan back? It seems that if you move one thing, 3 other things now go out of fit. Too bad it isn't cut to fit like drywall.

alan

AutoRodTechnologies
Jan 24th, 08, 07:34 PM
Yeah, you are right there, But for some reason I don't think i had a problem with that area. so I probably just had to force it back to get it in the proper location..

Here is a pic of the car I am refering to, I just wish i could remember a little bit more of what was going on with this car.
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c216/chadsbodyshop49119/mycamerapics058resized.jpg

AutoRodTechnologies
Jan 24th, 08, 07:37 PM
You know now that i think about it, I think the problem i had was when i lined the panel up to the inner edge of the quarter (at the back of the quarter) hpe that makes sense. basically right by the back edge of the quarter closest to the trunk

well anyways when i lined that up, i think the tail panel rolled forward as it wen't out from there, so in my case it might have just been more of a issue with the tail panel, where you have a issue of another sort. Wish i was there, it's easier to diagnose when there. and many times you just have to keep fighting the parts till they just line up one time..

Mav68erick
Jan 24th, 08, 07:52 PM
going to your photo bucket page... I see this pic

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1215.jpg

Seems to fit here? so Im gonna asume the wheel well wasnt part of this fit? maybe thats it or did you cange something between then

Dud you put in your rear deck filler piece?

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1209.jpg

here its missing, Dunno If im helping, just it seems to fit now, maybe the new stuff you added is adding up to throw it off a little here a little there sort of deal

Rhino
Jan 24th, 08, 08:13 PM
Seems to fit here?


To me it looks like the top is still just a little too far in. The tail's also a little high in comparison with the quarter. I
If I was to let my panels fall naturally into place this is exactly what they look like near the tail lights. Pushing and pulling them into place before clamping causes the tail panel to align as it should, although throws off my trunk gaps. Tomorrow I may have to take a few pics and post them as well.

AutoRodTechnologies
Jan 24th, 08, 08:27 PM
Looking at those pics, you have it fairly close, a little fighting and clamping should get you there as you stated, but looking at the other pics, i'm really starting to think alot of your problem is your outter wheel well fighting you, on the 68 we just did, i had to take a hammer to the lip and tap it in so the quarter would go over it nicely, if not it would only slide over half way. after that everything fit much better. I'd give that a try if it's holding you up, that is a easy fix.

69METALMAN
Jan 24th, 08, 09:53 PM
Looking at those pics, you have it fairly close, a little fighting and clamping should get you there as you stated, but looking at the other pics, i'm really starting to think alot of your problem is your outter wheel well fighting you, on the 68 we just did, i had to take a hammer to the lip and tap it in so the quarter would go over it nicely, if not it would only slide over half way. after that everything fit much better. I'd give that a try if it's holding you up, that is a easy fix.
Me too on those outers (hammer and dollie)! Terry, again great work but I have to throw in a tip or too before its too late. You must get doors and decklid on this build before you go to much further and you may even already know that so dont think i no everything cause nobody does!My entire build last year was all repro sheetmetal like yours just 1969 instead. When you put doors and decklid on this baby is when it gets real fun! I adjusted doors to qtrs. for days, qtr. to decklid gaps were about a half an inch wide on each side (gotta love it!) Again i dont speak out very often cause i dont care for no-it-alls! After you fit up all of rear and get it close,go ahead and put frt. fenders, header panel, and lower valance on. You cant really put a hood on but measure width of hood and check if it will fit between fenders with nice gaps. Think about it this way, hood has to fit fenders, fenders have to fit doors, doors have to fit good to body and to quarters, and qtrs. have to fit decklid. Front to back theory, instead of inside out. Hope that helps a little.

cheby2
Jan 24th, 08, 10:03 PM
Wow , you guys jumped right on this , thanks . Got a few things handled today but first let me answer some of the questions/suggestions

Mav , the quarters fit at the drip rail good , and they are against the inner structure in the jamb that they weld to , so they can't go forward any .

P/S69 , I did exactly as you described and had the results you described , 3/4-1" off the trunk panel . as far as the quarter location , see above .

Alan , LOL good idea!

Chad , that was my first idea , move the flange on the trunk pan back , but further investigation lead to too many other problems created by doing this , brackets on the trunk pan relocated , possible problems with the brace that holds the latch mech. and fuel pipe issues .

Alan , you don't know how close it was getting to "cut to fit like drywall" !

Mav , in those pics I fit the panels to each other , and there was a gap between the tail and trunk .

Rhino , those pics were a dry fit , absolutely no alinement effort at all , just a first fit to get a look at it .

Chad , I had to do a little hammer work on the outer (where it fits the w/w lip) on the driver side as I was fitting the quarter on while doing the tubs . In the current pics , there is no outer w/w on the pass side and the quarter has the same problems .

Ok , with that done , would you guys like to know what the fix was ?

To be continued .............

Arai
Jan 24th, 08, 10:20 PM
*getting popcorn to await magic answer*

zbo2
Jan 24th, 08, 11:27 PM
i can't believe he's making everybody wait.......

cheby2
Jan 25th, 08, 12:33 AM
All right guys I give , and the fix was ..............(drum roll please) ........... 6 screws ! LOL. After giving it a lot of thought and much putting on ,taking off ,pulling , pushing , hand-wringing , swearing and (forgive me) working on it with a hammer and 2x4 (actually I was on the right track by tring to roll the corners) , I took a step back and disected how this thing goes together and hit on what I wasn't doing in attempting to mount these quarters . I was clamping the quarter at every weld point accept where it rolls around the corner and welds to the trunk dropoff ( you couldn't clamp this due to rear panel overlapping and covering up this area . So I made a center mark on the body and took measurements off the tail panel at a couple of places , then clamped the covered up weld point on the quarters , leaving the approximate distance between the quarters as the tail panel . Then I attached these weld points to the trunk dropoff with three screws on each side , this held the quarter rear weld point in where it is supposed to be and allowed the tail panel to sit against the trunk pan flange (with clamps) . This bowed out the rear/lower portion of the slightly (not a problem , pulled back in easily) .

I think it was more of a spring-back issue (when stamped , a 90* bend will spring back after taken off die) , there are several places on these panels where that is an issue , such as the weatherstrip channel in the trunk where the bends aren't as pronounced as they should be . A little hammer and dollie work should work these into shape .

69metalman , I don't mind advice at all , especially from someone who has been there/done that . I will be trial fitting all sheetmetal before anything is welded on . After I fixed the problem , I got finished with the welding on the pass . w/w outer , so now I'm really just starting to fit the sheetmetal , as everything underneath is done .

How 'bought some pics guys !

Rutt Roe Raggy Uhhhhhh, guys Photobucket is down for site maintenance , can't post the pics , I swear I'm not messing with you ! Will have to wait until tomorrow to post pics :sad: Terry

Mav68erick
Jan 25th, 08, 04:53 AM
I think the srping back or memory of the metal, is where people find fitament issues

KevinK7
Jan 25th, 08, 06:15 AM
Terry,
This thread is GREAT, ...keep up the AWSOME work :thumbsup:

cheby2
Jan 25th, 08, 11:04 AM
Ok , now some pics , first off the pass side tubs

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1296.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1297.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1295.jpg

This pic was before I did any clamping or screwing , trunk lid is close and screwing the bottom does not alter the top edge where it meets on either side .

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1282.jpg

These pics show the screws and with the panel clamped on , now it is close to where it is supposed to be , I can work it with metal tools and get everything to line up better and set the gaps . You can see in the 2nd pic where I cut out a section of the flange in an attempt to line this up , now I will weld that peice back in to correct the error . What's the old saying , "Measure twice, cut once" but hey , I was getting a little ahead of myself , oh well a little backpedelling isn't too bad.

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1290.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1289.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1285.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1287.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1288.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1286.jpg

AutoRodTechnologies
Jan 25th, 08, 12:05 PM
Looking good, nice to see you progressing so smoothly!!

alanrw
Jan 25th, 08, 12:05 PM
And that ladies and gentlemen is the same brilliance that got us on the moon in 1969.

Once you got the 3 screws in each quarter, if you ran a strap around the 2 quarters and slowly racheted it down to bring the upper corners in would it have pulled the upper parts of the quarters into place or were you concerned with the quarters bowing out?

Excellent craftsmanship.

alan

cheby2
Jan 25th, 08, 03:09 PM
Alan , it didn't bow out on the top at all , all the bow was below the middle bodyline and just between the rear and the wheelwell opening . I didn't have to ratchet anything , the screws held the quarters where they needed to be and the tail panel fit in between them . I then had to clamp the tail panel to bring it up tight with the trunk pan .

Corvettemaster
Jan 25th, 08, 05:55 PM
WOW, I was only gone for a short time. I guess I needed to catch up. Good to see your back at it Terry! I am actually in about the same stage as you are and I am running into the same problem. So its got to be the way the panels are stamped since I now have read several post and we all have the same issue. I worked mine for a few hours and got some good gaps bit I can't seem to get the upper edge on the radius of the tailpanel to quarter by the passengers side taillamp opening to fit without a 1/4" gap. I took a break before I did something I going to regret. I'll have to get a picture. I glad your a few steps ahead....where do I send my check?

cheby2
Jan 25th, 08, 09:35 PM
I still have some issues with the quarters and tail panel fitment , but it's much better . I have chased my tail a bit today to figure out just where the problem lies , one of you guys hit on it and I thought I had it covered , but today after reassembling it and checking everything over real well , I realized that the quarters are not fitting over the w/w all the way ......... Thank You Chad :thumbsup:, one of these days I'm going to learn to listen to the voice of experience , instead of roaring full speed ahead .
I reshaped it some today , but still have to work on it more tomorrow . Hopefully I'll have some pics of good fitting quarters to post . Terry

PS Ron I take paypal!

AutoRodTechnologies
Jan 26th, 08, 05:57 PM
Lol.. at least i was good for something, nice to see your still progressing!!

cheby2
Jan 26th, 08, 10:52 PM
I got through triming and reshaping the outer w/w lip and the quarters nearly fell on , everything fits better all around ! I got a late start and didn't get any pics , but tomorrow I am going to do some more adjusting and see what kind of gaps I can get setup . Chad , any pointers on closing up the gaps on the side of the trunk lid / quarter fit ? I also hope to get the doors out and cleaned up , so I can get them fit up and see how the door/quarter fit is . Terry

1969ss
Jan 27th, 08, 01:14 AM
Heres some stuff I found that might give you a few ideas.

http://www.trifive.com/forums/showthread.php?t=8776



Rob

AutoRodTechnologies
Jan 27th, 08, 08:24 AM
I had one where the gap was wide towards the back of the quarter to truck, i took the tail panel off and tapped in the outter edge where welds to the quarter and tapped that area of the quarter out, 1/8" on both panels gives you 1/4" and it's not even noticeable.

Norcoastal
Jan 27th, 08, 08:47 AM
Terry,

I just watched your slide show...man it's down right inspiring! I'm working on my first restoration and my first attemp at welding.

I know that this question has been one of debate for some time now, but I was wondering what welder you're using, and if it's a MIG welder, are you using gas and if so, what blend, Argon/CO2?

My welds don't look as good as yours and when I grind them down, most of the weld snaps off. I have a 110 MIG welder with no gas, but I just picked up a tank and I'm going to attemp to use gas.

Any tips would be appreciated.

Thanks and great job!

67ss350rs
Jan 27th, 08, 12:24 PM
You need gas, argon/co2 it makes all the difference. A 110 welder is fine with a shielding gas set up.

AutoRodTechnologies
Jan 27th, 08, 07:13 PM
a 110 should be fine, but you need the gas.

gonewacky
Jan 27th, 08, 09:52 PM
WOW, I was only gone for a short time. I guess I needed to catch up. Good to see your back at it Terry! I am actually in about the same stage as you are and I am running into the same problem. So its got to be the way the panels are stamped since I now have read several post and we all have the same issue. I worked mine for a few hours and got some good gaps bit I can't seem to get the upper edge on the radius of the tailpanel to quarter by the passengers side taillamp opening to fit without a 1/4" gap. I took a break before I did something I going to regret. I'll have to get a picture. I glad your a few steps ahead....where do I send my check?... Just wanted to jump in here and let you guys know that back in 1977 when I was still driving my 68, I had bought factory qrt panels for $105.00 each.. the drivers side qrt. went on without a hitch.. But,,, the passenger side panel gave me fits.. I could not get the qrt. panel to line up right at the tail panel by the rear tail light area.. So you see,, this area was even a problem back then with original GM factory replacement quarter panels... if you look at the roll, (curve) of the two qrts. at the back top corners, you'll see they are not the same contour... I'm trying to get my door on my pass. side as a guide for my pass qrt. I used 69 door hinges, I think there the same for a 68, but in the parts cat. they show different numbers.. are the different,????...

cheby2
Jan 27th, 08, 11:11 PM
Hi guys , got some of the doors blasted today and ,as usual , it took three times longer than I figured it would . Also took the hinges apart for blasting and rebuilding , hopefully will finish up the blasting tomorrow and get some epoxy on everything so I can resume fitting the sheetmetal up .

Rob , thanks for the link , that opened up a mental block and gives me all kind of ideas for dealing with troublesome areas on this build .

Chad , that's exactly what kind of tip I was looking for when I asked in my last post , I must say , I didn't think about that area , I didn't get to mess with the gaps today , I felt like I needed to get the doors on before I proceeded any more . Thanks , you da man .

Steven , I don't know if I'm the one to ask about welding , I really don't know much about the dynamics of it and any welding skills I have are self taught and have learned through trial and error , I can't stick weld to save my life ! LOL I have a Lincoln SP-100 110v mig with 75/25 Argon/CO2 mix that I've had for 15 or so years , I think it was the first model that came out in that particular model line . I would highly recomend that you convert over to gas , as it is much cleaner in both appearance and integrity of the weld because of the sheilding gas . Also remember to read the manual or instructions on the welder as to the polarity of the gun/ground clamp when changing over to gas from gasless (ask me how I know)

Ok guys I have a few pic for your veiwing enjoyment , not really much but historically car guys are easy to entertain ! Lol Terry

First the blasting pics

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1298.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1299.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1307.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1308.jpg

Next a few pics of the quarter/tail , just clamping them in , no real time lining up things

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1305.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1300.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1301.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1302.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1303.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1304.jpg

1969ss
Jan 27th, 08, 11:47 PM
Your welcome Terry, I spend most of my time on the Chevelle forum, but I have been watching this. My compliments go out to, you are doing some really nice work, plus your putting out these pictures and explaining things as you go, outstanding effort on your part.:thumbsup:

Rob

Z10396
Jan 28th, 08, 01:35 AM
Terry,

I just watched your slide show...man it's down right inspiring! I'm working on my first restoration and my first attemp at welding.

I know that this question has been one of debate for some time now, but I was wondering what welder you're using, and if it's a MIG welder, are you using gas and if so, what blend, Argon/CO2?

My welds don't look as good as yours and when I grind them down, most of the weld snaps off. I have a 110 MIG welder with no gas, but I just picked up a tank and I'm going to attemp to use gas.

Any tips would be appreciated.

Thanks and great job!

I assume you are using flux core wire, correct? When not using gas it is a must. Also, are you sure that your heat and feed are set properly? It sounds like you are not getting enough penetration.

Rhino
Jan 28th, 08, 08:25 AM
Heres some stuff I found that might give you a few ideas.

http://www.trifive.com/forums/showthread.php?t=8776

Rob

Strangely enough, I ended up having to do something very similar last weekend when working on my drivers 80% quarter. The car had original GM quarters on it when I purchased it, although the gaps were far from symmetrical. I've been doing what I can to correct that as I put the new ones on.

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y169/RhinoSS/68%20Camaro/IMG_3474.jpg

Norcoastal
Jan 28th, 08, 08:35 PM
Ryan, it is flux core but man it's tough to stick.

Thanks everyone for the advice on using gas, I'm getting the tank filled this weekend. Any suggestions on size of wire to buy to go with the gas set up?

I'm welding mostly floor panels and the cowl and side tear drops.

Rhino
Jan 28th, 08, 08:54 PM
Any suggestions on size of wire to buy to go with the gas set up?

I'm welding mostly floor panels and the cowl and side tear drops.

For thin sheet metal I prefer .023 wire with an 80/20 argon/co2 mix.

Rhino
Jan 28th, 08, 09:00 PM
Also... something to keep in mind when you're using a 110v wire. If you're using an extension cord it's imperative that it's at least 14 gauge. If it's smaller there's no way it will carry the amps required to form a good weld.

cheby2
Jan 28th, 08, 11:54 PM
I got finished blasting today and got epoxy shot on the doors and hinges . tomorrow will rebuild the hinges and maybe bolt the doors on for a look-see at the fit with the quarters .

Steven , those are good tips about the mig welding , take them to heart , there's a learning curve but in no time you'll be making nice welds .

Rhino , thanks for the pic , I love learning new methods of slicing and dicing to make these old cars better than new .

Rob , Thanks for the kind words , just doing what I love to do and sharing it with like-minded people . You have a killer site , I have spent hours on there , but I have 1 question , do your supports fit tight to your floor ? LOL !

A few more pics (shot these in the dark , so they is what they is LOL)

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1309.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1310.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1311.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1312.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1313.jpg

1969ss
Jan 29th, 08, 12:25 AM
[QUOTE=.

Rob , Thanks for the kind words , just doing what I love to do and sharing it with like-minded people . You have a killer site , I have spent hours on there , but I have 1 question , do your supports fit tight to your floor ? LOL !

There borderline on being tight:)

Rob

Mav68erick
Jan 29th, 08, 07:09 PM
Rob... Just went to your site again to look at all the screws and notices the Heating of the support and Rounded chisel... good Idea!

1969ss
Jan 29th, 08, 08:23 PM
Thanks Tristan

Mark B
Jan 29th, 08, 10:30 PM
hello everyone,

hey cheby2 > thanks for your time and all of the effort that you
are doing with the time line of your restoration of the 68.

mark b

cheby2
Jan 29th, 08, 11:50 PM
Mark B , no problem , I enjoy doing it .

Guys , hung the doors today , overall good fit , pass side fit really well , just a little work needed on the quarter/door gap . Driver side will need a little more work , gap very tight and touches at top 5" or so , door is moved all the way forward and quarter fits too good to move back . I may try to mod the holes on the hinges to gain a little clearance before messing with the rear gap , plus nothing is welded on , so I won't be doing any mods yet . Overall good test fit and gives me the green light to start making things more permanent on this hotrod !

I need to take everything back off , prep and epoxy all the bare spots ,seam seal a bunch of things , then probably spray some sort of undercoat type of material to protect all the hidden areas . THEN I can go about making this thing look like a Camaro again !

Some pics

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1315.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1316.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1317.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1318.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1320.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1321.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1322.jpg

Oh , I also got my harness in yesterday , after putting one of these in my ChevyII , I'll never mess with 40 year old wiring again . It's a EZ Wiring 18 fuse 21 circuit harness that has more than enough to run everything through . Plus killer deal at $185.00 /$202.00 shipped .

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1314.jpg

Mav68erick
Jan 30th, 08, 04:29 AM
And I was excited I got my lower cowl and tulips cut and got to fit the new tulips for ****s and giggles, even though they wont go on till later in the spring after I can sand blast the inner shell = (

ou_sooner
Jan 30th, 08, 06:50 AM
What brand harness is that and where did you pick it up for $185?

AutoRodTechnologies
Jan 30th, 08, 07:00 AM
Wow.. your making killler progress, keep up the good work..

Hatman
Jan 30th, 08, 07:34 AM
It looks like the L.H. QTR. needs to go down in the rear ,that will open the gap on the top in the front . if you do the mod the hinges trick your gap on the bottom of the door will suffer. along with the fender to door gap. Then it looks like you will have to do like alot of have done & slice the L.H. qtr along the top body line & lift up the top edge the weld up the slice gap. As you know take your time because the qtr's will not move very easy once they are welded.

garyb
Jan 30th, 08, 08:48 AM
What brand harness is that and where did you pick it up for $185?

I'm assuming this the brand he's using. http://www.ezwiring.com/

I'm planning on buying that when I get to that point on my 71 Cutlass restoration.

--Gary

Lobstah
Jan 30th, 08, 09:15 AM
Other than the obvious price difference...I wonder how it compares to Painless and AW. AW seems to have gotten the best reviews, but I think a harness from them is about $400-500?

Jim

alanrw
Jan 30th, 08, 12:37 PM
Hmm, in this recent thread, AW got the golden thumbs up.

http://www.camaros.net/forums/showthread.php?t=125989

alan

John510
Jan 30th, 08, 06:37 PM
Hmm, in this recent thread, AW got the golden thumbs up.

http://www.camaros.net/forums/showthread.php?t=125989

alan

For the extra 300$ is it worth it? Anyone else used EZ wire before?

prostreet69camaro
Jan 30th, 08, 06:58 PM
I would try opening up the holes on the hinges. That is what I did.

.gearhead.
Jan 30th, 08, 10:49 PM
Nice progress. Keep em coming.

Jim

cheby2
Jan 30th, 08, 11:43 PM
Alright guys, first off the DS door gap , the qtr. fits too well everywhere , dropping it will create problems at the tailpan , and at the seam with the top behind the window . I plan on opening up the hinge holes slightly and see what I can do about pulling the qtr. back slightly when welding it , I'll more than likely have to split the upper part and move it slightly to set up the gap . I worked on the DS qtr to tailpan fit today and got some more experience with spliting , opening up and rewelding the seam . I've done this before with other projects , just out of practice and takes more time . It's coming out well , should have some pics tomorrow .

Now about the harness , it's a EZ Wiring 18 fuse 21 circuit model , and if you are looking for a reproduction type harness , it is not for you . It is a universal harness with all the circuits to run a fully equipped car (everything under the hood , elec. fuel pump , elec. fan , p/w , guages , all lighting ect. , a/c , headlight plugs , circuit breaker , fusible link and all rear lighting , fuel level ) . You will have to terminate all wires at their destination , it doesn't come with any plugs (except 2 pre-wired GM column ignition switch plugs) so it is not a "plug and play" type of harness . It also is not a through the firewall type harness (doesn't bolt to the firewall and plug in on engine compartment side) , the wires come off the rear of the fuse block and you route them where you want them to pass through the firewall and a grommet is supplied . I used it on my Chevy II and everything was routed through the harness , N2O , line-loc, purge system , elec. fan ect. , I just used circuits that weren't going to be used , such as p/w and a/c circuits .

I don't know how it compares to Painless and AW as far as what you get with it (switches , plugs ect.) , but as far as quality and materials (wires , fuse block ) I think it is on par with the other companies harnesses . It also has the wires marked every 5 inches as to what they are for . It's perfect for my application because I am going to be using some aftermarket items ( A/C , Fan , elec. fuel pump , LS engine ect.) and would have to mod the existing harness or repro harness . Plus the price is killer ! Terry

DougP
Jan 31st, 08, 06:26 AM
Terry -- I continue to enjoy watching the progress on your project car -- your craftsmanship and attention to detail are terrific -- keep up the good work and keep the pics coming :thumbsup:

prostreet69camaro
Jan 31st, 08, 09:30 AM
Cheby2,

The good thing about the harness is it is universal. Plus you can route the engine bay wires through the drivers side panel and then under the drivers fender to hide the wires. I won the same kit at a Goodguys event and it seems like a nice kit. I still have a factory harness in mine but it has been modified and cut through the years. I plan on rewiring it when I finish the pro-touring 69 that I am doing.

I use the Painless kits and they are nice and I have one for the 69. The only difference is the painless goes through the firewall and is for a 69 GM car. It is a universal kit also.

vrdanna
Jan 31st, 08, 03:57 PM
Terry, i see you are in louisiana. are you in the new orleans area?

Corvettemaster
Jan 31st, 08, 05:49 PM
Looking good! What did you end up doing with the pass tail panel to quarter fit to the right upper corner of the taillight opening?

cheby2
Feb 2nd, 08, 01:25 AM
Thanks for the kind words , my pleasure .

Mike , yea , I like the fact that it's universal too since I will be filling the firewall in a lot of places and I like to hide my wiring as much as I can .

Vince , I'm on the other side of the state , just north of Lake Charles .

Ron , I am working on the DS qtr to tail panel fit right now and will be addressing tha pass side next .

Been kind of busy lately , we're having a reception for my daughter and hubby tomorrow night and my lovely bride has been keeping me real busy with that ! Picked up seam sealer and some undercoat/rubberized bedliner type material to possibly spray the insides of qtrs and body structure , going to try out a test panel and see how I like it first . I'm ready to get back on this thing and make some progress . Terry

Pro-Street69Camaro468
Feb 2nd, 08, 03:38 AM
Terry, A buddy of mine told me a few years ago that what ever product you use it should be a two part system. I have stood by this process and have had no problems, as for the under coating and the seam sealer you didn't mention what type but I would recommend something with activators for both of them. They cost a bit more but the cost is effective.

Blade
Feb 2nd, 08, 06:22 AM
Looking great. Thanks for the info for the wiring harness.

mbmmca
Feb 2nd, 08, 08:09 AM
Uhh, "WOW" doesn't seem like the right word to use. I just spent the last 2 hours reading and looking at pics, some of which will be printed and saved for reference, (tail panel) with your permission Terry. Thank you for the detailed info and the motivation. I'm thinking that I really can do this.

Norcoastal
Feb 2nd, 08, 05:37 PM
Terry,

What type of epoxy primer did you use and how was it applied?

cheby2
Feb 3rd, 08, 01:10 AM
Dave , that's good advice , any product that hardens by chemical reaction will be a better , longer lasting product . The sealer/ undercoat I bought was just some cheap product I bought to try out , it won't be exposed to the elements and prep is the deciding factor in how a product performs and lasts . But I will be doing a test panel first to see how well it bonds to the epoxy primer .

MaryBeth , Thank you ! You are more than welcome to print , save , point and laugh , or whatever with any of the pics I post . I am just documenting what I'm doing and how I'm doing it in an effort to share my experiences with like-minded people , and if it helps or motivates someone , then that's just icing on the cake . I like your last statement , just remember "can't never could"

Steven , I use Omni epoxy primer , it's PPG's budget line , it's a 2 part primer with a 2:1 mixing ratio . I've had good luck with the Omni line of products and have turned on a couple of shop owners to it , and they were impressed with it .

Finally got through with all the wedding/reception stuff tonight , so hopefully I can get to work on the car this coming week . Terry

KevinK7
Feb 3rd, 08, 06:51 AM
...let's see, ..Terry is making more progress than most of us could in twice the time, ...and now I see a 3:00AM post!
...Hey Terry, ..you ever sleep ? :D

Once again, ...just incredible progress :beers:

AutoRodTechnologies
Feb 3rd, 08, 09:39 AM
Lol.. they say there is no rest for the wicked right??

cheby2
Feb 3rd, 08, 11:54 PM
Ok , you guys got me ' I'm a night owl , or a vampire LOL , spent half my life working for the railroad with no set work hours , on call 24/7 . I have nights and days mixed up and I'm NOT a morning person ! I hardly ever go to bed before 2:00am and usually get about 6hrs. sleep . Last night was my daughter's reception here in town after getting married 2 weeks ago in Colorado , it was a very busy day and I got home about 1:00am and needed a fix , so I kicked back on the computer for a while ......OR.......There really is no rest for the wicked !:D Terry

Camaro1stGen
Feb 5th, 08, 09:11 PM
Thanks for posting all the photos of the car in it's skelatal state. They really help me to see what lies ahead. I'm looking to do DSE mini tubs and frame connectors, however, I also need new rear frame rails. Any suggestions as to my order of attack? Any information you or anyone else can provide will be greatly appreciated. David

cheby2
Feb 5th, 08, 11:44 PM
David , what condition is your trunk pan ? I would say do the frame rails first if the trunk pan is ok , then frame connectors next to give you a good solid base to work on , then do the tubs . One of the reasons for this order is that you have to notch the framerails during the tub installation . BTW , welcome to the forum , I am a relatively new member here and can tell you that there is a wealth of info here and a lot of good people too .

All right guys I have been working on the tail panel/qtr fit and have made some headway and uncovered more problems also ! But I am forging ahead and handling them as they surface , it has been lots of splitting , moving and rewelding metal , but sometimes that is what it takes . I've pretty well got the sides of the tail panel fitting the qtr , and I am now working on the trunk jamb area (lots of problems here) , it seems as there is a problem at all 4 corners in the stamping of the qtr /trunk jamb area . The corners at the front are very dim (rounded bends , not sharp) and don't match up with the straight sections at all . The rear d/s corner doesn't fit at all and the p/s corner just needed trimming . I took some pics to better explain it .

These 3 pics show the rear and fitment on the ends .

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1323.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1324.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1325.jpg

These 2 show the fronts , 1 of which I've been doing a little hammer &dollie work on

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1328.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1329.jpg

These are the p/s that just needed trimming

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1327.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1334.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1339.jpg

Too many pics , continued next post

cheby2
Feb 5th, 08, 11:57 PM
These pics are from the d/s rear qtr trunk jamb , the 1st is how it was originally

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1326.jpg

this is marked for cutting

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1333.jpg

the cut peice mocked up

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1335.jpg

tacked on

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1336.jpg

filler peice inserted

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1337.jpg

and almost finished with the smoothing .

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1338.jpg

I'm probably going to have to do something simular on the front corners to get them correct , but we're having fun , RIGHT ? When I get these things done I'm going to pop all the metal off and get the floors and bare spots on the tubs and such in epoxy , so the next time they go on it ought to be for welding . Terry

Z10396
Feb 6th, 08, 01:24 AM
Terry, awesome project. I have been keeping tabs on it since your first post. I put on outerwheel housings, quarter panels, tail panel, pass. side rocker and trunk floor, extensions and a dash panel on my '69 project. The only difference is that I have been working the car for fifteen plus years! I bought the car when I was 16 years old so money and time have always had a hand in holding me up. One of these days I am going to scan my old pics and post them!

cheby2
Feb 6th, 08, 10:35 PM
Hi guys , today I worked on getting the d/s trunk jambs up to par .I finished smoothing out the rear corner and attacked the front corner . After much head scratching , I decided I couldn't get it in shape to my satisfaction with a body hammer and dollie , so I decided to cut out the corner and then cut and reshape it and weld it back in . So after beating and banging , making relief cuts , rewelding and shaping , I finally got it to my satisfaction and welded it in . Overall , I'm pretty happy with it , and it fits well . I tried to take some pics as I was fabbing the peice , but my batterys went dead , I was in the zone and didn't break away to put new ones in until after the install . Tomorrow I will tackle the other side and hopefully have like results , Terry

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1340.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1341.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1342.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1343.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1344.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1345.jpg

Arai
Feb 6th, 08, 11:48 PM
Looking good!!!

AutoRodTechnologies
Feb 7th, 08, 07:22 AM
isn't it a good feeling when you finish one step and get move to the next.

cheby2
Feb 7th, 08, 11:26 PM
Yes it is Chad , that's what I try to tell everyone , baby steps , man , baby steps !

Well , I got the other side done today , boy am I glad that's done ! It went about like the d/s did , a lot of work to make it look and function as it should have from the manufactor , but it could be worse , at least they're making it ! It came out pretty well and I am happy with it , so it's on to the next bump in the road . Tomorrow I'll be taking the body panels off , cleaning up the back side of the qtrs where I welded , and getting the floor and tubs ready for epoxy . Terry

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1346-1.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1347.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1348.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1349.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1350.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1351.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1353.jpg

KevinK7
Feb 8th, 08, 06:57 AM
...I'm still following this along, ...in awe of the speedy progress you're making and of course your craftsmanship... ;)
Looking great!

alanrw
Feb 8th, 08, 08:58 AM
Terry, after all that metal work on the trunk rim is done, is that skim coated with bondo and then smoothed out or are you able to grind it smooth for paint?

alan

camarossguy
Feb 8th, 08, 12:08 PM
Terry,

I am embarrassed by your craftsmanship and skill! Keep up the nice work. I've been working on installing a new interior for a year now..

Bobby

ramblin67rs
Feb 8th, 08, 01:21 PM
I think this is great but, You could make it much better if it was a blog. It would seperate your update pots from question and comment posts. It would make it a really good reference for anyone several years from now and will save mucho time for reference purposes.

PS Floyd at firewheel classics is very nice. I live right by there and they make my restoration very convenient.

prostreet69camaro
Feb 8th, 08, 01:58 PM
Terry,
Your doing a hell of a job and I am very impressed. Keep up the good work.

Mike

gameaholic
Feb 8th, 08, 03:26 PM
New Here and just read your post. AMAZING you are doing a great job. My 69 will need simular work but is beyond my ability to go as far as you. I will probably have Hoppkins do the rear, and I will take over from there. Maybe after I finish this one, my first resto, I will be a little more confident on the next one. Keep up the good work!!! definatly an inspiration

cheby2
Feb 8th, 08, 09:24 PM
Aw, ya'll gonna make me blush :o , thanks for the kind words .

I didn't get much done on the Camaro today , I spent all morning sitting in a doctor's office with my wife , she is sick with flu-like symptoms but I've got her medicated now .

Alan , most of my metal work was in what will be the weatherstrip channel , but some of it was where it will be seen . After epoxy primer , I'm sure I will have to use some filler to smooth things out a bit .

Bobby , sometimes I am embarrassed by my chraftmanship and skill too , but then I cover it up with bondo and nobody's the wiser ! LOL :D

Not much today , maybe tomorrow :( Terry

Arai
Feb 8th, 08, 10:20 PM
hehe......I was looking forward to a few more inspirational pics tonight. Now I gotta wait till tomorrow!!! :) Keep up the great job.

cheby2
Feb 11th, 08, 11:58 PM
Guys ,as hard as I try , I can't get anything done on the Camaro . Spent Sat. painting a truck for a buddy , Sun. with my daughter at church functions , today working on a RO machine from my car wash , hopefully tomorrow I can spend some time on the car ! On top of all that , my wife has given me the crud she has had , sinus pressure , fever , cough ,chills and aches :( . I've been eating the meds , hopefully can head this off . Terry

guccieng
Feb 12th, 08, 12:09 AM
i feel your pain. my car is with marquez and co and needed the same work. the repro quarters seem to fit well everywhere except the trunk/rear windshield area. it looks like you did a good job fixing it, which i expect everyone who buys these quarters will have to do. as long as it's done right, right?

show
Feb 12th, 08, 05:33 AM
Looks great. I had to laugh looking over the photos...remembering when I was doing mine and everytime I couldn't find a tool I needed...I'd check the trunk of the Camaro and there it was :yes:

cheby2
Feb 12th, 08, 11:10 PM
You are sooooo right Doug , about once a week I have to slam on the brakes , gather up all the tools , put them back in the box , clean off the bench , sweep everything , and put everything back in it's place , then start over ! This is a working shop , I do everything from fab work , grinding ect. to paint work in here , I try to keep it somewhat orderly but it gets out of hand sometimes . For the last couple of years I've told myself that after I finish this project I'm going to take everything out of the shop , pressure wash it and finish painting it ..........But , these things keep following me home ! Maybe after this one ! Terry

cheby2
Feb 13th, 08, 11:55 PM
Just thought I would post a couple of pics of a mod that I decided to do to help everything to line up better and easier on the tail panel . The rear flange on the trunk pan has always been a compromise , fitment wise , against the tail panel , so after much thought and trying different things , I decided to add some thickness to the flange . I got a peice of 1/8 flat metal , 3" wide , and made a plate to fit up against the flange , cut it to fit the contour and bolt holes , and welded it to the flange . This helped the center part of the tail panel to not pull in too far when clamped to the flange . I know it's not much , but it's all I got guys !LOL . Terry

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1355.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1356.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1357.jpg

Denvervet
Feb 14th, 08, 12:35 PM
That's a great idea for dealing with that problem. I ran into the same issue but found that my quarter was just hanging up under the roof panel and wasn't moved forward enough. I wrestled with that one for a while...now it fit just fine to the trunk pan. Since I replaced the trunk, and all I assumed that I just didn't get it lined up correctly. Keep up the good work and we all enjoy and learn from your posts.

cheby2
Feb 14th, 08, 10:58 PM
Yea , I thought long and hard , checked every gap and flange several times before doing this . I didn't want to do anything that would be real apparent that I had modified it , I think when the tail panel is welded on and the joint seam sealed , you won't see the extra thickness .

Guys , I finally got the trunk , tubs and floor all sanded and cleaned , then shot epoxy primer on ! Another thing off the list ! It's great to see the thing all one color , it gives me a sense of accomplishment and motivates me to get some stuff done . Tomorrow , I'm going to start seam sealing all the joints and getting everything prepped for a sealer on all the surfaces that will be closed up when all the sheetmetal goes on . Terry

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1361.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1363.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1358.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1360.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1359.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b62/sheby2/68%20Camaro/104_1365.jpg

Arai
Feb 14th, 08, 11:42 PM
Looking Great!!!!!

AutoRodTechnologies
Feb 15th, 08, 06:24 AM
That is a thing of beauty my friend!!!

Blade
Feb 15th, 08, 08:41 AM
looking great

327!275hp!Convt!
Feb 18th, 08, 08:23 PM
I’ll bet if you had made a “How To” video/DVD showing this process from beginning to end, you would have found a good niche in the marketplace. Maybe through just ebay sales but, maybe some of the major vendors would have picked it up. I would have liked to have watched the whole process from beginning to end & I don’t even intend on tackling such an enormous task. I think there are videos/DVD’s of similar content but, not as extensive with a first generation. Maybe next time…

Chuck
Feb 18th, 08, 09:39 PM
Car is looking great. Exponentially better than GM did it. That thing will last forever with all the anti-crosssion work you are doing! Are you going to leave the rear deck stock? I like 6x9's in the deck, and they don't work in a stock deck. I would have modified mine when the rear window was out (if I'd a thought of it then). Instead, it was kinda a pain to cut out and drill etc. What about a rear firewall? Just curious. Keep up the outstanding work.:thumbsup:

ahowudoin
Feb 19th, 08, 01:15 PM
Just curious when you plan on welding the shock plate in back?