These are the AFR 195 CC Eliminators i got today for my 406 sbc. I ordered them in mid December from my engine builder, so it took about a month to get them. The heads are the angle plug L98 Versions. I hope to have the motor together sometime this summer. Shooting for over 500 HP.:D

http://img2.putfile.com/thumb/1/1721174786.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=7511434) http://img2.putfile.com/thumb/1/1721174766.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=7511433)

http://img2.putfile.com/thumb/1/1721174768.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=7511435) http://img2.putfile.com/thumb/1/1721174783.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=7511431)

http://img2.putfile.com/thumb/1/1721174740.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=7511432)

These look better than my 195 Street versions, did you get the 8mm valve stems? Part # ? 1034? Spring id?

Part# 1040. I had 7/16" studs installed instead of the 3/8". I did not change anything else though.

Part# 1040. I had 7/16" studs installed instead of the 3/8". I did not change anything else though.

I got the 1038, cut to 64cc , set with 1.530 springs but 3/8 studs. I do like the idea of the larger stud.

It didn't add but like 20-30 dollars to the cost of the heads, so I said why not? It offers more piece of mind.

It didn't add but like 20-30 dollars to the cost of the heads, so I said why not? It offers more piece of mind.

Do those valve stems look small? 11/32 or 8 mm?

I measured them with my calipers. 8MM

I'm about to buy a set of afr 180-195 cc heads, what all options on these things can you get???
I know you can get the eliminator (street???) or "race ready" heads cnc'd, the street head costs a little more but the race ready heads flow more...
Isn't the eliminator head the newest version, eliminator is the street version right????
I'm a tad lost....

JimM got a set like that, mine are almost 3 years old.

I'm about to buy a set of afr 180-195 cc heads, what all options on these things can you get???
I know you can get the eliminator (street???) or "race ready" heads cnc'd, the street head costs a little more but the race ready heads flow more...
Isn't the eliminator head the newest version, eliminator is the street version right????
I'm a tad lost....

The eliminators are their newest offering, and they are the street head. The new 195 street eliminators flow more than their previous 227 CC head. These flow 280 cfm on the intake side at .600 lift. These heads are awesome:D

The eliminators are their newest offering, and they are the street head. The new 195 street eliminators flow more than their previous 227 CC head. These flow 280 cfm on the intake side at .600 lift. These heads are awesome:D

Yes, I am jealous. But I don't scream all day at 600 lift. I am about 20 cfm short here. Not a big deal.

Yes, I am jealous. But I don't scream all day at 600 lift. I am about 20 cfm short here. Not a big deal.

LOL. I've been saving to build my engine for about 2 years now. I've changed my mind on heads several times in the past, but I think I made the right decision to wait and get these. :yes:

agree.

You guys are getting me all excited :D.
I picked up a set of the old (now) 68cc straight plug 195's for my 385 stroker a couple of years ago.
I was not really satisified with the CNC quality (I'm a picky %$#@!) so after a few conversations with some folks, I sent mine off to Angie at,
http://www.moparengineswest.com/about.htm
Before She got busy she asked me several questions pertaining to how I was going to set up my ride. She is a awsome person to chat with.
385 cubes, 4bolt main, light weight Eagle 4340 steel crank, Eagle 4340 ESP H beam rods, SRP flat top pistons, XE274H cam, RPM intake, 750cfm Rochester carb (SMI stage two), Thorley headers, 200R4 auto trans, 2400 rpm tq converter, 3.42 posi ext....
I still have not fired up my motor yet, Long story slow progress.:sad:
Upon receipt from her, there was no doubt she does a bad ass job. Thank you Angie!:) :hurray::hurray::hurray:
There is more to this story but I don't want to bore you all.
Check out the flow numbers she sent me.

What do you think?
Any guestimates on what kind of power I could expect?

Intake Exhaust
Lift:in Flow:cfm Lift:in Flow:cfm
0.200 132.0 0.200 115.0
0.300 203.0 0.300 171.0
0.400 256.0 0.400 190.0
0.500 280.0 0.500 205.0
0.550 287.0 0.550 205.0
0.600 295.0 0.600 205.0

Those sure are purdy

Yet I do have the 195 Elim head, CNC is nice but I prolly will have port job done next time around. Got my 383 going , while I do feel a punch compared to the old 355 with the same head, I don't feel the punch is enuff. I was expecting more pull but then I have never been satisfied with any motor than my old 468. Time will tell. Don't have lots of miles on the new motor, haven't got to drive it much due to weather, I am going on the Powertour in June so I should know by then what I will do.

The Heads I ordered Wednesday with ZZ4 S/B...quality they look great...they make some HP...Happy Motoring

Andy,

Congrats on the heads. I'm in the market myself.

Were you able to order whichever springs you wanted to match your cam?

What made you go with the L-98 version?

JimM got a set like that
Ya, mine started out just like those before the "upgrades" Had em milled to 60cc to build compression with my d-dish pistons. Also upgraded to the cutest lil HR springs you ever saw, Only 1.29 OD, but 155 lbs seat, 428 lb rate, and these tiny tit retainers that wiegh less than air.

Ya, mine started out just like those before the "upgrades" Had em milled to 60cc to build compression with my d-dish pistons. Also upgraded to the cutest lil HR springs you ever saw, Only 1.29 OD, but 155 lbs seat, 428 lb rate, and these tiny tit retainers that wiegh less than air.

Pretty good spring rate for a small spring. My 1.5 are 160 on the seat @1.860, did not check over the nose.

AFR...............AAAAAAAHHH.............Drool

Andy,

Congrats on the heads. I'm in the market myself.

Were you able to order whichever springs you wanted to match your cam?

What made you go with the L-98 version?

Yes, you can get them with different spring options. Mine are good for .600". I think the basic spring they put in them for solid rollers are .700" lift. I'm going to run the XE284 comp cam in mine, so the basic springs were just right for my cam. Angle plugs will make the plug swaps alot easier than the straight plug castings. The engine builder said I would see a few more ponies with the L-98 versions too. I plan to run the SRP forged dished pistons, and am going to deck the block as well. With the 65 CC combustion chamber, it should yield right at 9.8:1 compression, and on the verge of 8:1 dynamic compression. This should be perfect for a street motor. He has an engine dyno in his shop that he puts each motor on when he finishes assembly. He thinks that I should be in the 510-520 range.

I went down stairs and got my valve covers and put one on one of the heads. I think it looks awesome!

http://img2.putfile.com/thumb/1/1813352844.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=7514767)

http://img2.putfile.com/thumb/1/1813352869.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=7514768)

.......I went down stairs and got my valve covers and put one on one of the heads. I think it looks awesome!

http://img2.putfile.com/thumb/1/1813352844.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=7514767)

http://img2.putfile.com/thumb/1/1813352869.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=7514768)

you got that right!! :thumbsup:

Thanks for the info.

Two things I first notice between my street AFR and these new puppies is the 8mm valve stem and the exhaust ports. My exhaust ports "were" more D port on the bottom opening. I smoothed them some to match gaskets and headers.
I am still using the stock aluminum finned covers.

Angle plugs will make the plug swaps alot easier than the straight plug castings. The engine builder said I would see a few more ponies with the L-98 versions too.

Really? I was under the impression that with standard long tube headers straight plugs were easier.

These heads sure do have me thinking........seems like a damn nice looking and performing head for the price!

These heads sure do have me thinking........seems like a damn nice looking and performing head for the price!

You got that right!:D

Looks nice!

CNC work looks a bit nicer in some spots than my 3 year old AFR 195's.

Straight plugs will make header fitment and plug changes easier. I have pretty decent room with my straight plugs and 1.75" hooker super comps. Angle plugs are supposed to make a tiny bit more power, but they do not make fitment/ plug access easier. I prefer straight plugs and less headaches. The bigger AFR SBC heads and the comp ported heads are only listed for angle plugs now... ie 210cc only come w/ angle plugs per their new catalog (although you may be able to special order). 195 street head comes in both straight and angle.

Looks nice!

CNC work looks a bit nicer in some spots than my 3 year old AFR 195's.

Straight plugs will make header fitment and plug changes easier. I have pretty decent room with my straight plugs and 1.75" hooker super comps. Angle plugs are supposed to make a tiny bit more power, but they do not make fitment/ plug access easier. I prefer straight plugs and less headaches. The bigger AFR SBC heads and the comp ported heads are only listed for angle plugs now... ie 210cc only come w/ angle plugs per their new catalog (although you may be able to special order). 195 street head comes in both straight and angle.

Thats kinda what I thought....I have straight now with 1 5/8" and only have a slight issue with #8, but I dont have to pull the header to get it out.....Not that there are not tons of tube configurations that may or may not make it easier....

as a matter of a fact I just PULLED my plugs today....:(

You guys with the new eliminators need to stick them on a bench, the new 210s are going turbulent at 500" and laying over, and I'd bet the 195 are doing the same thing. One guy had the 210s fixed the turbulance and pushrod pincharea and his 406 picked up 3mph in the 1/8, which would be 4-5mph in the 1/4, which is huge. The short turn needs a bit of work, the cnc in the bowl and small pushrod pinch area too.

Looks nice!

CNC work looks a bit nicer in some spots than my 3 year old AFR 195's.

Straight plugs will make header fitment and plug changes easier. I have pretty decent room with my straight plugs and 1.75" hooker super comps. Angle plugs are supposed to make a tiny bit more power, but they do not make fitment/ plug access easier. I prefer straight plugs and less headaches. The bigger AFR SBC heads and the comp ported heads are only listed for angle plugs now... ie 210cc only come w/ angle plugs per their new catalog (although you may be able to special order). 195 street head comes in both straight and angle.

I have a stock crate 350 in my car now, straight plug heads and they are a pain in the butt to change. It takes a stubby wrench, 3/8" drive, plug socket, 3 different extension lengths, and a swivel joint to change mine out. Hooker's catalog said that my new headers would clear fine with angle plug heads. The new LS1 motors have angle plug heads, the angles are in the same direction for each plug, and they are easy to change with headers. Easier with headers than manifolds.

Hooker's catalog said that my new headers would clear fine with angle plug heads.

Do you mind giving me a part number?
I keep looking up headers for my '69 on the Hooker web page and I keep coming up with footnotes that say "won't fit with angle plug heads."

When I first got my AFR 195, I used the Hooker 2451 header, ony thing I did not like was the left side hung down lower, causing speed bump scrapes. After listening to everyone complain about clearance and port fitments, I went with the Doug Thorley 376Y1c TriY. 3/8's flanges and 14ga tubes. I have the angle plug heads. No issues.

You guys with the new eliminators need to stick them on a bench, the new 210s are going turbulent at 500" and laying over, and I'd bet the 195 are doing the same thing. One guy had the 210s fixed the turbulance and pushrod pincharea and his 406 picked up 3mph in the 1/8, which would be 4-5mph in the 1/4, which is huge. The short turn needs a bit of work, the cnc in the bowl and small pushrod pinch area too.
Got any more details on this turbulance issue? If they flow the numbers they proclaim with turbulance problems, what do they flow when the turbulance is addressed! I am ready for the new 215 raised runner eliminator coming this June?

They dont flow the advertised #s. My friends 210 eliminators went 292, but the # heads go
tubulent around 500", and the #s start dropping a bit after that. The fix is to redo the short turns,
and go over where the cnc lines meet in the short turn. After this (and opening up the pushrod pinch
a bit) you can get the advertised #s. But #s aint everything. If the head is going turbulent and the
fuel drops out of the air stream, and the air speed is way too high at the short turn and pushrod pinch
it wont make good power. The 195s do seam to have the same issues as the 210s.
If you pick up 3mph in the 1/8 (in a 10sec car), that means you were down 50hp... not the kind of
power I'd want to sacrifise.

Here a link to one of the posts on fixing the heads.
http://motorsportsvillage.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2722&start=0

Very good link with alot of information from some very sharp Fellas!!! I really enjoyed the information. Thanks 67rs502.

I am currently looking at getting a set of the AFR 195 Eliminators at the moment. Does anybody know the difference between the new 2007 series heads & the 2006 series heads. I know the new series is 65cc chambers , CNC ported bowls, intake & exhaust runners. What were the previous series ?

Are the new series that much better than the old series ?

The reason I ask is that currently I am running a 406 with flat tops with Dart Sportsman 2's, 72cc chambers with 9.85:1 comp. I want to get the comp up to maybe 10.5:1 & may have to go with the 68cc head as the 65cc head may bring the comp up too much.

I have the 100% race cnc "old" versions #1094's. I think my heads Flo very close to the new street 195's. All I can say is you won't be disappointed with them. They make my 3500+# 355ci mtr nova with 3.73's go pretty well, and it still needs more tuning. I can't wait to put a 406"+ mtr under them as the 4.03" bore is shrouding the 2.05" valves.Good luck with them!

Here's what I'm finding out about AFR's, angle pug heads and fitment in a 69. I emailed hooker headers and their reply was "HI,
thanks for your e-mail
sorry all of our headers are for stock heads
Thanks Ricky."
I called Doug's and they told me they would not fit the AFR heads because of the raised exaust port. They told me I should check Hedman.
Hedman has headers that will fit, but are race headers that have only a "slip connection" on the collector. No flange for bolting up the exhaust. And you have to use a stock width oil pan. Of coarse I have a 7 quart Moroso kick out pan already bolted up. I guess I will have to buy a set of reducers and have them welded on.
I'm still looking around the internet for solutions. If you know of something, please let me know. BTW, I am looking into the Doug Thorley 376Y1c TriY. Don't know yet whether the oil pan with kick-outs will be a problem or not.

Here are a few pictures of the motor.
http://i148.photobucket.com/albums/s27/3SuperSports/heads003-1.jpg
http://i148.photobucket.com/albums/s27/3SuperSports/heads004.jpg
http://i148.photobucket.com/albums/s27/3SuperSports/heads001-1.jpg

Hi very interested in your 406 engine did you have to drill the heads for steam holes?

Here's what I'm finding out about AFR's, angle pug heads and fitment in a 69. I emailed hooker headers and their reply was "HI,
thanks for your e-mail
sorry all of our headers are for stock heads
Thanks Ricky."
I called Doug's and they told me they would not fit the AFR heads because of the raised exaust port. They told me I should check Hedman.
Hedman has headers that will fit, but are race headers that have only a "slip connection" on the collector. No flange for bolting up the exhaust. And you have to use a stock width oil pan. Of coarse I have a 7 quart Moroso kick out pan already bolted up. I guess I will have to buy a set of reducers and have them welded on.
I'm still looking around the internet for solutions. If you know of something, please let me know. BTW, I am looking into the Doug Thorley 376Y1c TriY. Don't know yet whether the oil pan with kick-outs will be a problem or not.

Here are a few pictures of the motor.
http://i148.photobucket.com/albums/s27/3SuperSports/heads003-1.jpg
http://i148.photobucket.com/albums/s27/3SuperSports/heads004.jpg
http://i148.photobucket.com/albums/s27/3SuperSports/heads001-1.jpg

Is that just for the new AFR's ? I have Hooker 2131 1-3/4" Listed for a camaro on my AFR angle plug heads now.

Is that just for the new AFR's ? I have Hooker 2131 1-3/4" Listed for a camaro on my AFR angle plug heads now.

I just bought these last November. I'm not sure if there were any changes or when. AFR's site says that the L-98 angle plug heads have the exhaust port raised .100 over GM L98 heads. Do L98 heads have raised exhaust ports (over any other stock GM head)???

I found an old post on a Nova site (while google searching the situation) a guy with a 72 Nova said that the Doug's D368's fit his car even though Doug's told him they wouldn't. He had the same small block, AFR angle plug setup.
From what I can gather the amount that the exhaust port is raised doesn't seem like enough to make that much difference, but I hate to order headers, fit them and send them back and try the next one.

On my headman's, The 1-5/8 ones blocked the exhaust port by an 1/8" on each corner :mad: . That's why I went with the Hooker 1-3/4".

I would think with the exhaust ports raised .100" the worst you would be faced with would be to oval out the flange holes.

I would think with the exhaust ports raised .100" the worst you would be faced with would be to oval out the flange holes.

It is starting to sound like "fit" is more about the port shape than anything else. Still not for sure though.

After doing some rough measuring of the stock vs. AFR heads, it appears that the exhaust ports are larger, mostly from the top of the opening being "raised". I assume headers will "fit", but will block part of the exhaust opening.
I'm not sure what the problem with the kick-out pan is about. The Hooker 2451's don't seem to come all that close, at least not close enough to cause any problems.

After doing some rough measuring of the stock vs. AFR heads, it appears that the exhaust ports are larger, mostly from the top of the opening being "raised". I assume headers will "fit", but will block part of the exhaust opening.
I'm not sure what the problem with the kick-out pan is about. The Hooker 2451's don't seem to come all that close, at least not close enough to cause any problems.

Raised .100 over stock GM L-98 ,I got the AFR #10610 180 cc 58 cc chamb. Head ,stock loc. exhaust port my engine builder had on his shelf ,brand new.

Do you mind giving me a part number?
I keep looking up headers for my '69 on the Hooker web page and I keep coming up with footnotes that say "won't fit with angle plug heads."

I have the 1 5/8" super comps.
Chevy Camaro/Chevy II/Nova

2130 Super Comp Headers
1967-69 Camaro; 1968-74 Chevy II/Nova SBC 265-400
1-5/8'' x 29'' Primary Tubes
3" Collector
High Temp Black Paint

Hooker 2130 - Hooker Headers Super Comp Headers Details
Will fit with angle plug heads.
Redesigned for better clearance for idler arm. Collector is in original location

Thanks.