Im in a bit of a pickle. Ive got this 350 out of an 88 p/u in a 67 RS and the powerstering pump sticks out about 1/2 inch too far. From other posts on this board, its been determined that I have the wrong balancer to line up with the PS pump. Im running a short water pump, but need a balancer that when sitting on its sleeve measures 2 3/4 inches from table top to top of balancer. The one that came with the enige measures 2 1/4 sitting in the same manor. If it helps, heres a link to the former post. PLease help if you can. To line up with the timing tab, it needs to be an 8" balancer.
http://www.camaros.net/forums/showthread.php?t=158809
I thank you in advance.

Are you sure it is the balancer that is the problem ? How do your other pulleys line up ?
There are 3 different PS pumps. They are 6 cylinder, small block, and big block. Also there are a number of different PS pump pulleys.

the other pulleys line up fine. The PS pump is from inline, but i also purchased a PS pump for a SB and they were the same. (neither lined up...both stuck out too far) The alt and water pump line up on the 2nd groove of a 3 groove pulley. Im kinda sure they should be on the 1st groove. with the PS pump lining up on the 3rd groove. If I had a PS pump pulley the recessed in 1/2 inch, that would be fine too...just need to get a belt on it.

If you have the Harmonic balancer from the '88, it would be for a long water pump, so you would need one for a short water pump.
ALL your pulleys must be for a short water pump. If you try to mix in Long water pump pulleys, you will have problems. I would use the original stuff and get a new pointer for a smaller balancer. They bolt on with two of the timing chain cover bolts. You should be able to get the pointer from your Chevy dealer.

I hope you are not replacing a six cylinder, or you are going to create a lot of problems. :)

This is turnig into a nightmare...does anyone have a part # or a source for me to find the proper balancer for a short water pump setup? Every parts store ive talked to cant comprehend what im trying to get across to them.

I hope you are not replacing a six cylinder, or you are going to create a lot of problems. :)

We did replace an inline 6....is there something about this swap that im missing?

The swap from a 6 cylinder is easy. The only thing is that nothing from the six will work on the V-8. Not the accessory brackets or pulleys. Where did you get that stuff ? If you had everything from the '88 pickup, you could use it, if you changed to a long water pump. My comment was if you are mixing stuff the nightmare will continue. Kid's at the auto parts places, don't know anything about 40 + year old cars.

i orderd all new brackets for a 350 (alt, power steering) from ricks. All were for a short water pump. I compared these parts to my 327 RS and they are the same barckets. Evrything lines up except the darn PS pump.

all SB balancers have the same mounting face, it does not change pulley position. The difference in the balancers is the outer ring thickness and diameter that does not affect the pulley mounting face.

This pulley will work if you have a 8" balancer and short water pump.-

http://www.parts123.com/parts123/yb.dll?parta~dyndetail~Z5Z5Z50000050g~Z5Z5Z5AAZYX~ P95.00~~~~S2O30OXRY819912632224y~Z5Z5Z5~Z5Z5Z50000 050G

OK, You don't have the belt order correct. Is your crankshaft pulley a 3 groove or a 2 groove with an add on pulley ?

Track 1 (groove closest to engine) - to alternator, What else lines up ?

There are different thicknesses of Harmonic balancers.

There are different thicknesses of Harmonic balancers.

Yes but the pulley mounting face is the same, regardless of diameter and outer ring thickness.

Well..with the balncer i just removed, the alt and wp lined up with the 2nd groove on a 3 groove pulley. The way I see it, if I have a 1/2 thicker balancer, they would line up with the #1 groove (closest to the block) and the PS would line up with the 3rd groove. As it is,,the PS pump doesnt line up with squat. Its a 3 goove crank pulley...no add on pulley.

Yes but the pulley mounting face is the same, regardless of diameter and outer ring thickness.

I don't agree, but I do not have proof at the moment.

James,

Can you link a picture off of Ricks site, of that crank pulley ? The stock, short water pumps had a add on pulley.

Tom

the 3 groove was bought off ebay (sorry forgot to mention that) and i cant find a link to it. It said it ws for a short water pump, 3 groove pulley.

I don't agree, but I do not have proof at the moment.

No Offence Tom but, If you ever have the chance to put all small block dampners ( balancers) 6",7",8" truck thin and thick, Z28 thick, 327/365HP thick, etc on a machined surface and measure the distance from where the dampner touches the lower timing gear to the pulley face you will see this dimension is the same. The difference is in the outer vibration ring thickness and diameter. It does not affect the pulley mounting flange.
Trust me on this I have done this as well as lots of engine swaps/pwr steering conversions in the last 40 years and ran into all kinds of pulley alignemnt issues when I ran a Corvette/Camaro Restoration shop for 20 years.

No Offence Tom but, If you ever have the chance to put all small block dampners ( balancers) 6",7",8" truck thin and thick, Z28 thick, 327/365HP thick, etc on a machined surface and measure the distance from where the dampner touches the lower timing gear to the pulley face you will see this dimension is the same. The difference is in the outer vibration ring thickness and diameter. It does not affect the pulley mounting flange.
Trust me on this I have done this as well as lots of engine swaps/pwr steering conversions in the last 40 years and ran into all kinds of pulley alignemnt issues when I ran a Corvette/Camaro Restoration shop for 20 years.
so what your telling me is that, if i buy that pulley you linked earlier, it sits back on the PS pump enough to line up with the 3rd groove furthest away from the block?

so what your telling me is that, if i buy that pulley you linked earlier, it sits back on the PS pump enough to line up with the 3rd groove furthest away from the block?

If you have a 8" balancer and the correct lower crank pulleys yes. The Pulley that I linked is for a deep groove setup, below is the link for a correct crank pulley deep groove add on.

http://www.parts123.com/parts123/yb.dll?parta~dyndetail~Z5Z5Z50000050g~Z5Z5Z5ABZFA~ P95.00~~~~S2O30OXRY819912632224y~Z5Z5Z5~Z5Z5Z50000 050G

I have a Doctors appointment in 10 minutes, gotta go, I will be back. Mike.

OK, I just went out and measured a 6 3/4" short water pump balancer that I have and it is 2 1/4" like your old one. I would say it is the balancer. There is an 8" GM balancer for short water pumps, but it is expensive. A smaller pointer is all you need and use your old balancer.

Here is a link to a pointer at Jegs.

http://www.jegs.com/i/Proform/778/141-200/10002/-1

A pointer is no good for me. I have an 8" on there, and it doesnt line up. its total thickness is 2 1/4 inches. just like the 6" balancer u described.

Trying to get the PS pulley to line up with a groove on the crank pulley. I dont give a hoot about what size balancer is on the engine.

So, we may have proved, what rszmjt was saying. Now we should determine if your 3 groove pulley is for a short or long water pump, and if you have the correct PS pulley.

I will see what I have for pulleys, and post back.

Use this power steering pulley if you have the short water pump and the shallow groove water pump and crank pulleys.

http://www.parts123.com/parts123/yb.dll?parta~dyndetail~Z5Z5Z50000050g~Z5Z5Z5AAZYW~ P62.95~~~~S2O30OXRY819912632224y~Z5Z5Z5~Z5Z5Z50000 050G

Your PS brackets should look like this if you have the short water pump -

http://www.parts123.com/parts123/yb.dll?parta~dyndetail~Z5Z5Z50000050g~Z5Z5Z5AAZYR~ P42.95~~~~S2O30OXRY819912632224y~Z5Z5Z5~Z5Z5Z50000 050G

Use this power steering pulley if you have the short water pump and the shallow groove water pump and crank pulleys.

http://www.parts123.com/parts123/yb.dll?parta~dyndetail~Z5Z5Z50000050g~Z5Z5Z5AAZYW~ P62.95~~~~S2O30OXRY819912632224y~Z5Z5Z5~Z5Z5Z50000 050G

Your PS brackets should look like this if you have the short water pump -

http://www.parts123.com/parts123/yb.dll?parta~dyndetail~Z5Z5Z50000050g~Z5Z5Z5AAZYR~ P42.95~~~~S2O30OXRY819912632224y~Z5Z5Z5~Z5Z5Z50000 050G
those are what i have already. They dont line up.

those are what i have already. They dont line up.

Then you have the wrong crank pulleys etc. I have done lots of PS conversions using these brackets and pully. Sometimes you have to "Tweak" the bracket rearward slightly approx. 1/8" with a big bar for perfect belt alignment.

Here is the correct power steering add on pulley, it bolts onto the front of the lower single groove crank pulley.-

http://www.parts123.com/parts123/yb.dll?parta~dyndetail~Z5Z5Z50000050g~Z5Z5Z5AAWJP~ P50.50~~~~S2O30OXRY819912632224y~Z5Z5Z5~Z5Z5Z50000 050G

So you telling me that if i put a single groove crank pulley on, then put that add on pulley on, it will give me the extra 1/2 length of the crnak pulley that i need?

We need a picture of the crank pulley that you have. I wouldn't buy anything yet. Your PS belt should run on the 2nd groove. Your water pump and alternator on the 1st groove. If you have a/c it should be on the third groove with the add on pulley. You should have a 2 groove crankshaft pulley.

So you telling me that if i put a single groove crank pulley on, then put that add on pulley on, it will give me the extra 1/2 length of the crnak pulley that i need?

If you have the single non deep groove crank pully, then the add on non deep groove crank pulley in the link with the correct brackets and the PS shallow groove pulley linked also should work Fine, however no garantees. As noted can you post pictures of your current pulleys or even part numbers off the pullys? You might currently have some correct parts.

Does your PS Pump use the bolt on pulley with a nut to retain it?

Depending on What options were ordered and if it had an A.I.R. (smog pump) would determine what crank pulley it had, with or without an add on pulley.

ill get some pics and post em as soon as i can

Does your PS Pump use the bolt on pulley with a nut to retain it?

yes..just like the 2nd one u linked to.

yes..just like the 2nd one u linked to.

Then you have the correct PS pump, any numbers on the PS pulley and crank pulley?

no numbers on the crank pulley...its a machined 3 groove...i havent checked the #'s on the PS pulley...its the same pulley that was on the inline 6 PS pump

N40 = Poer steering C60 = Air Conditioning

http://i263.photobucket.com/albums/ii152/tjs69_photos/pulleys/67pulleySBC.jpg

See the above chart: N40 = Poer steering C60 = Air Conditioning
im afraid i dont understand.

no numbers on the crank pulley...its a machined 3 groove...i havent checked the #'s on the PS pulley...its the same pulley that was on the inline 6 PS pump

OK I am pretty the 6 cyl PS pump pulley is wrong, the offset is different from the 1 linked. Most PS pulleys have numbers stamped into them, if you check I will look in the GM parts book tonite and repost.
Also you have the wrong crank pulley for the pulleys linked. The original setup for 67/68 are as posted in the links. The crank pulley should be a single groove at the balancer and then the add on pulley that was linked.

James, Sorry to confuse you... I moved the chart, when you were looking for it ! You should see it above, now !

The crank pulley should be a single groove at the balancer and then the add on pulley that was linked.
Not necessarily ! What options do we have ? Read the above chart !

would it be bad if i pulled the balancer out 1/2 inch?

It won't stay pulled out, and if it did it would gush out oil.

this is very frustrating

Photo of 6" balancer.

http://i263.photobucket.com/albums/ii152/tjs69_photos/pulleys/000_0578.jpg

Photo of Short water pump double groove crank pulley with an add-on sitting on top.

http://i263.photobucket.com/albums/ii152/tjs69_photos/pulleys/000_0579.jpg

Photo of double groove pulley and add on sitting side by side.

http://i263.photobucket.com/albums/ii152/tjs69_photos/pulleys/000_0580.jpg

Photo of double groove and add on face.

http://i263.photobucket.com/albums/ii152/tjs69_photos/pulleys/000_0581.jpg

Photo of a double groove, crank pulley for a Long water pump. Notice how it is extended out, for the Long water pump.

http://i263.photobucket.com/albums/ii152/tjs69_photos/pulleys/8974.jpg

TJS69...can i ask on more favor from you? Could u please measure the thickness of the double groove pulley with the add on pulley seated in it? I plan on taking this measurement, and comparing it to the 3 groove i have now. If they are the same, then the double groove with add on will not solve my problem.

Thank you for the pics BTW.

Sandwiched together , they are almost 2.00". The double pulley alone is 1.300"

Im really begining to think the problem is with the PS pump. Heres why...
I have 2 67's in my garage. one of them has a 327 in it and the other is the one we did the engine swap on and are having all the issues with the PS pump. I measured the PS pump on the 327 and it appears to be a diffrent size. (i measured from the front ridge of the resevior on the pump to the closest side of the pulley and it is 3/8 of an inch closer than the pump we are trying to install on the 350) Or in other words, the pulley on the 327 sits 3/8 of an inch closer to the block than the pump pulley the we have for the 350. It looks like the "neck" of the PS pump on the 327 is shorter than the neck on the PS pump for the 350
If we had the pump from the 327 in the cradle for the 350, the pulleys would line up.
Do you know if there are two difffrent pumps for these engines? If you do...do you have a part # or a link to one of them. All the parts stores around here say that there is no diffrence in the pumps, but there is a 3/8 diff. If you can help I certainly would appreciate it.

I knew the 6 cylinder pumps were different !

The difference between a small block and a big block are just hose connections at the back of the pump.

Here is a picture from NPD (national parts depot) I dealt with them a lot years ago. I had a problem with Rick's then, and now that they are owned by Eckler's their pricing is 2X's what it was.

http://www.npdlink.com

http://i263.photobucket.com/albums/ii152/tjs69_photos/power%20steering/NPD1.jpg