Wheres this lost 1969 Z28 ? I have the dz302 [Archive] - Team Camaro Tech

: Wheres this lost 1969 Z28 ? I have the dz302


LOST 1969 Z28
Sep 30th, 09, 03:40 PM
LOST 1969 Z28 Hello im new to the site but a camaro fan and owner for years. I have a DZ 302 that was pulled from a car in central Illinois years back. my goal is to find this car and get the motor and car back together. car and motor were seperated back in 1989 - 1993 . in the jacksonville , Illinois area i have the vin from the block ,also have the casting date and the Dz code. Ive owned this motor for close to 20 years and should have looked for the car years ago. Is this car still alive and around ? any info would be great . Thanks Team Camaro.

69CamaroRT
Sep 30th, 09, 04:31 PM
whats the numbers off the block, and the vin#?

Jonesy
Sep 30th, 09, 04:39 PM
Kind of hard to narrow it down without the VIN.:confused:

LOST 1969 Z28
Sep 30th, 09, 04:43 PM
Cast date j 24 8
on the engine pad v1028dz
vin 19N533226
casting 3932386
std bore.

Jonesy
Sep 30th, 09, 05:01 PM
Its gonna help to give the full VIN. I can tell its a Norwood built car.

So the partial Vin is 9N533226 or 9N543226. November 68 built Norwood z/28. Got any pics of the pad stamping? Whats the casting on the back of the block?

LOST 1969 Z28
Sep 30th, 09, 06:51 PM
Info updated above ,

Brad:beers:

rafbody
Sep 30th, 09, 07:47 PM
Assuming the car is still out there, that will make someone very happy being a pre x code car.

LOST 1969 Z28
Sep 30th, 09, 10:04 PM
you say this would be a pre x code car ? when did they start putting the x codes on ? so your telling me the plate on the firewall will not have x77 or x 33 ? what letters or numbers will be there if any ? i must say this seems to be a great camaro site. thanks guys.

Brad

z28doug
Sep 30th, 09, 10:52 PM
Brad,
I believe the X codes started around mid December of '68. Your block is too early for that.
Hope you can reunite the DZ with the original Z.....
Doug

bertfam
Oct 1st, 09, 08:13 AM
The car's not in the database, but I would recommend posting the numbers on the CRG site anyway. You never know...

Ed

rafbody
Oct 1st, 09, 08:08 PM
you say this would be a pre x code car ? when did they start putting the x codes on ? so your telling me the plate on the firewall will not have x77 or x 33 ? what letters or numbers will be there if any ? i must say this seems to be a great camaro site. thanks guys.

Brad

There will not be any codes on the trim tag. The x codes started the second week of December (12B). Prior to that date there was nothing on the trim tag to decode a 69 Camaro.

LOST 1969 Z28
Oct 4th, 09, 04:49 PM
hey guy thinking of selling this DZ 302 motor. will consider offers. all info on codes are stated above. this block was dipped and magged years ago and may need it again . sitting close to 20 years. was greased on a regular basis. block was checked recently and found to be still stock bore. the parts i have include the block, 1178 crank , factory pistons and rods , pins , pan, 1 pully, stock bolts. NO HEADS ,INTAKE, CARB. PRE X CODE CAR .

Jeremiah
Oct 4th, 09, 05:09 PM
I just looked through my papers but couldnt find anything with a VIN for my old 69 Z/28. It was a Nov. 68 built X77 car, of course no X code on the cowl but it did have the X7 on the rear seat bulk head.

The first owner swapped the engine with a friend due to his being modded before it was traded in at a local dealer. It had only 34k original miles when I owned it. I know this because I found a reciept in the glove box dated 1970 with a signature and I tracked down the owner of the signature and got the story as well as original photos of the car. That car went to Texas when I sold it.

Good luck with your search.

click
Oct 4th, 09, 05:34 PM
Brad, please keep the offers to sell or buy in our classifieds. Soliciting in these forums is against site policy.. thanks for understanding.

theChuckster
Oct 4th, 09, 06:39 PM
Brad, with the high volume of fakes and forgeries, it's worth your time to authenticate the stampings via photos thru some of the experts here to protect/enhance your investment. I personally know of fakes being made even in the 83-89 time frame. Best of luck on your hunt.:beers:

LOST 1969 Z28
Oct 4th, 09, 06:58 PM
ooops sorry

rafbody
Oct 4th, 09, 08:12 PM
Here are a few pictures.

LOST 1969 Z28
Oct 4th, 09, 08:13 PM
pictures on the way guys . please give me your thoughts .

Kurt S
Oct 5th, 09, 07:42 AM
Someone has modified or restamped the pad. That's not an original stamping.

Jonesy
Oct 5th, 09, 08:47 AM
Someone has modified or restamped the pad. That's not an original stamping.
:eek: yep, thats the way it looks to me also :eek:

LOST 1969 Z28
Oct 5th, 09, 09:00 AM
think you guys should take another look. block has been checked to see if it was decked and was not. machine shop says this is the original stamping. what part of this stamping does not look correct ? i believe this stamping is real. looks to me that the dz and the other numbers are stamped at 2 different times on all the blocks ive seen. is this how it was done at the factory ? not sure how it can be modified when the motor was not decked. what part of this looks incorrect ?

Kurt S
Oct 5th, 09, 11:02 AM
Sorry, I already took another look. I'm comparing it to known originals. Looks like the DZ was added afterwards.
The factory stamped them with a gangstamp, they were all stamped at the same time.

LOST 1969 Z28
Oct 5th, 09, 11:48 AM
dont see how the first part would be correct and the dz added. seen alot of dz codes and they all look at least alittle funny at the end of the stamping. these were hand stamped . correct? theres no way every stamp is going to be the same . on some stampings ive seen the width of the letters that arent even the same. dont see how someone could add letters to the pad with out removing the old ones or decking the block and restamping it. block was checked by a 35 year machinest and said it has not been decked and the stamp is real. not to mention 3 other car guys from this shop remembering the motor and car. to many things about this motor are pointing to a correct motor and correct stamping. maybe i need a better over head picture to show this.

KMG69
Oct 5th, 09, 12:00 PM
I think the picture you provided is sufficient. Re-stamp.

LOST 1969 Z28
Oct 5th, 09, 12:07 PM
Think ill take the word of a 35 year machinest on this one. thanks anyway

rafbody
Oct 5th, 09, 12:46 PM
Being a machinist (35 years) the guy should definately know about metal surfaces and whether a block has been decked or not, however that does in no way give him any expertise on the originality of engine stamps. He may have some knowledge but I will take Kurt S and his opinion over most anyone.

TomBo
Oct 5th, 09, 12:51 PM
My opinion is a restamp.

Kurt S
Oct 5th, 09, 01:05 PM
I'm looking at almost 2000 engine pads, with a bunch either this same date or a day or so off. It doesn't match.
Again, the pads were not hand-stamped.

Email Jerry MacNeish if you want a professional second opinion, but I don't post unless I'm sure. This isn't the first time that a car/block with history has been restamped....

You can choose not to believe, but if you sell the block and the buyer isn't happy, they will have recourse.....

LOST 1969 Z28
Oct 5th, 09, 01:11 PM
sounds like kurt s could be hurting this hobby if hes making calls that are not correct. im sure hes good at what he does, but mistakes are made even by the so called experts. ill stick with the people who know the history of the motor in the area and the machinest that did the work on the motor. after all ever seen a picture of a car ,thought it looked a certain way in the picture only to find out the car looks totally different in person. happens all the time. the stamping process was not perfect and any so called expert should know this for sure. theres a z28 in primer on ebay as we speek and the dz on the end of the pad looks different then the other letters/numbers. check 100 zs and there all gonna be alittle different. after all this was the 60's hippies cant stamp straight.

amartinson
Oct 5th, 09, 01:46 PM
I realize you want this stamping to be correct because you are trying to sell the motor, but the facts are the facts. These are not some "so called experts" as you call them. These people are THE authority on these types of issues.

Call/email Jerry MacNeish and see what he thinks. Do a Google search on his name if you are not familiar with him.

The facts are that if guys like Kurt, Jonesy, and Jerry say its a restamp... its a restamp.

You are opening yourself up for litigation if you try to pass the motor off as the real deal.

LOST 1969 Z28
Oct 5th, 09, 02:14 PM
Thanks for the info guys. Ill shot jerry some photos to make sure one way or the other

Jonesy
Oct 5th, 09, 03:25 PM
Good advice to call Jerry M. for a second opinion. :thumbsup:

Jeremiah
Oct 5th, 09, 05:53 PM
sounds like kurt s could be hurting this hobby if hes making calls that are not correct. im sure hes good at what he does, but mistakes are made even by the so called experts.

You couldnt have said it more backwards.

I know a few automotive machinist, they know a lot about there profession and smoking dope/drinking but couldnt tell you a damn thing about block stampings/codes/originality. He probably said it hasnt been decked simply because the numbers are still there.

I do bodywork for a living, I have worked with lots of tech's who have been doing it far longer than I have and still dont know what the hell there doing. Just because someone does something for a living doesn make them an expert in that field... not to mention this one.

LOST 1969 Z28
Oct 5th, 09, 07:03 PM
Looks like someone needs to clean up your comments on the last post. Doesnt seem to be comments that would come from another so called expert. From the comments above sounds like you deal with some shady people with drug and drinking problems. Might want to stick with your body work. THIS WILL BE MY LAST POST AND VISIT TO THIS SITE IF THIS KIND OF TALK IS ALLOWED HERE .

69camcon
Oct 5th, 09, 08:04 PM
Just reading up on this thread and I'm curious about the "broach marks" or parallel lines that are suppose to show up on the pad that were created when the block was being stamped. Are they suppose to be more visible? From what I have heard if you can't really see them then it's a possibility it was decked. Anyone can help me out with this as I'm trying to figure out if a block was deck and restamped myself.

jd502
Oct 5th, 09, 08:09 PM
Looks like someone needs to clean up your comments on the last post. Doesnt seem to be comments that would come from another so called expert. From the comments above sounds like you deal with some shady people with drug and drinking problems. Might want to stick with your body work. THIS WILL BE MY LAST POST AND VISIT TO THIS SITE IF THIS KIND OF TALK IS ALLOWED HERE .


Did you read the post were Kurt said he was looking at blocks that were stamped the "SAME" day as your block. Crazy to come to a site for help and and then trash those who help you.

"THIS WILL BE MY LAST POST AND VISIT TO THIS SITE IF THIS KIND OF TALK IS ALLOWED HERE ." :waving::waving::waving:[/QUOTE]

Jeremiah
Oct 5th, 09, 09:28 PM
Looks like someone needs to clean up your comments on the last post. Doesnt seem to be comments that would come from another so called expert. From the comments above sounds like you deal with some shady people with drug and drinking problems. Might want to stick with your body work. THIS WILL BE MY LAST POST AND VISIT TO THIS SITE IF THIS KIND OF TALK IS ALLOWED HERE .
Im far from an expert, just a little more knowledgable than the people you consider to be.

RamAirDave
Oct 5th, 09, 10:28 PM
Like he mentioned earlier, Kurt doesn't comment if he isn't sure.

Machinists, no matter how good they are or how long they've been doing it, don't have the databases that show the particulars of stampings and how they changed on a daily basis.

JM comes around here every so often, maybe someone has (or will) PM/email him directing him to this thread.

kinsmd69
Oct 6th, 09, 12:51 AM
Where are you located in IL? Im in IL. I would like to come see the stamp. Could you send me better pics of the stamping and of the sides of the block?

click
Oct 6th, 09, 07:48 AM
Brad, you asked for help... you posted photos... the experts in identifying stamps responded. Kurt has never and will never hurt this hobby, he enhances it along with the other folks in here and in CRG when they flush out errors. Your machinist friends are not as versed in this part of the hobby so I will trust Kurt's and Jonesy's replies 100%. I hope you can benefit from all the folks in Team Camaro here. Our goals are to keep the hobby as honest and clean as we can. This is being done with your engine ID now too. I hope you hang around and learn the value of all the people that give input here. Discuss and ask questions about what you dont understand but dont say a valued member here is hurting the hobby, when you have no basis for that comment.

foreverlookin
Oct 6th, 09, 07:59 AM
WOW what happened:confused:?

I don't remember seeing anything offensive in any posts.

al8apexer
Oct 6th, 09, 09:35 AM
Looks like someone needs to clean up your comments on the last post. Doesnt seem to be comments that would come from another so called expert. From the comments above sounds like you deal with some shady people with drug and drinking problems. Might want to stick with your body work. THIS WILL BE MY LAST POST AND VISIT TO THIS SITE IF THIS KIND OF TALK IS ALLOWED HERE .

lol

so how much did you pay for this restamp engine?

is the sting of it not being what YOU think it is hurting your possible re$sale?

not sure what kind of language was used but maybe you had best not return "just in case" it happens again ....

some people, jeesch

amartinson
Oct 6th, 09, 10:30 AM
Geez... cut the guy a little slack. He thought he had a real DZ motor based on what a veteran machinist told him and got a little defensive when he was told here that it was not what he thought it was. I think everyone here can imagine how that must have felt.

He took the advice to have Jerry take a look at it for a second opinion and people are still jumping on the guy. Don't make the guy feel unwelcome just because he had a disagreement.

al8apexer
Oct 6th, 09, 11:01 AM
he has pissed on everyone here that gave him factual advice ... he WANTS to believe he "found" $omething and he refuses to listen to the advice/info given to him

LOST 1969 Z28
Oct 6th, 09, 11:43 AM
please post your pictures of the 2000 dz codes you have on file. im sure there are alot of people out there that want to see this info. cant wait to see how exact all these codes are .

canX11
Oct 6th, 09, 01:48 PM
please post your pictures of the 2000 dz codes you have on file. im sure there are alot of people out there that want to see this info. cant wait to see how exact all these codes are .

I think there is more to to it than just the alignment of the numbers/letters and I doubt he will publish any info re: how they know its a re-stamp....that would be too easy for the Fogerers'....send Kurt a PM and maybe off line he will give you all the details....maybe. Good luck and it sucks if you got "taken" on that block.

69 z11
Oct 6th, 09, 01:48 PM
i must say this seems to be a great camaro site. thanks guys.

Brad

Brad, you seemed to be pretty excited about this site and the experts on here until you got an answer you didn't want to hear. It sucks, but you're not alone, fake stamps are everywhere these days.

I'm pretty sure you wouldn't be questioning the experts if they had validated your engine stamp. You asked, you were answered, take it like a man.

Myfirst 69SS
Oct 6th, 09, 03:04 PM
Brad, you seemed to be pretty excited about this site and the experts on here until you got an answer you didn't want to hear. It sucks, but you're not alone, fake stamps are everywhere these days.

I'm pretty sure you wouldn't be questioning the experts if they had validated your engine stamp. You asked, you were answered, take it like a man.

x2 Amen

Vintage 68
Oct 6th, 09, 05:06 PM
please post your pictures of the 2000 dz codes you have on file. im sure there are alot of people out there that want to see this info. cant wait to see how exact all these codes are .

Do a site "search' for 'DZ + suffix' - you find plenty of them :yes:
That is 'if' you ever come back to this lousy site again.
You're not the first guy to get his corn-flakes dampened on a "Z" car or part on here - an certainly not the last :noway:

As stated in an earlier reply, it's getting easier and easier to find a "DZ" block (and lots of other items and whole cars also) - just hard to find a real one anymore ;)

For future search - the full VIN would have been 124379N533226 if, oh nevermind ...

Kurt S
Oct 7th, 09, 09:09 PM
I took the liberty of asking Jerry:
"There are issues with certain characters and they do not match what I have in my photo data base either. Where are the broach marks too??"