Looking locally at a brand new ZZ502 purchased last Feb. The motor is still in it's original crate and packaging. The person selling it was going to use it in his 69 Camaro that he's been building. He decided to scrap the project, sell the car, motor, transmission, etc as he needs the money. He is asking $7500 for the ZZ502. This is same motor that can be purchased on Summit.com (http://www.summitracing.com/parts/NAL-12496962/) for $9045.95 plus shipping (~$400). The motor sat in his garage for the last year. This was going to be his "baby", so he has been turning the rotating assembly once a week for the last year.

Good deal, bad deal, what would you do? I am in the need of a new motor for my 68 that recently wasted a 454.

I dont think it is that great of a deal. I bought one from a guy still in the crate for $5500.00.

Your still saving 1500.00 plus 400.00 shipping. Sometimes you come across good deals amd sometimes great deals.

Your still saving 1500.00 plus 400.00 shipping. Sometimes you come across good deals amd sometimes great deals.

Exactly. $5500 was a great deal and one your likely not to find again. You can spend $9500 with shipping or spend $7500 on this one which is essentially brand new as well. If your looking for a 502 i say jump on it. I would.

OK, so the deal just got a little better. $7500 includes brand new still in a box GM Performance Parts Serpentine Belt Drive System (http://www.jegs.com/i/GM-Performance/809/19172806K/10002/-1?parentProductId=752514) ($582 +s/h on Jegs) details on the kit below. Also not part of the deal but for sale are brand new still in a box Hooker headers (http://www.summitracing.com/parts/HOK-2457-1HKR) Full-Length, Steel, Ceramic Coated, 2" primaries, 3.5" collector ($400 on Summit + s/h). He wants $200 for them. So I am thinking about making an offer:

Would offering $7000 cash for all of it make it a better deal?

Same stuff would cost me $10,482 + ~$500 in s/h or let's roundup and say $11,000.
That's 63 cents on a dollar.

What would you do?

Serpentine Belt Drive System:

# Secondary air injector pump bracket
# Idler belt pulley bracket
# Water pump kit
# Water pump pulley
# Crankshaft pulley
# 100 AMP Generator assembly (remanufactured)
# Generator connector (with lead)
# Drive belt tensioner assembly
# Belt (fan, water pump, A/C assembly and generator)
# Generator and power steering bracket
# Power steering pump
# Power steering pump pulley

7 grand would be a no brainer and a heck of a deal in my opinion. I think even 8 grand would still be a very fair deal. This is all new stuff after all.

Now thats a screaming deal... Get it like it and build on it, the 502's with a little porting can work wonders down the road.

Sounds like a good deal. I have looked at a ZZ502 from these guys: http://sdparts.com/details/gm-performance-parts/12496962
its $8700 so if its the same engine and you are already set up for 502 HP $7000-$7500 would be good if he can show you a receipt. Keep in mind you will not have the 12 mo warranty most of these crate motors carry. Also does he already have the correct pan?

---------------------

I purchased a 376/480 LS3, with wiring harness and ECU for $6,200 from someone abandoning a project. Your deal doesn't sound that good, particularly for Jurrasic technology. :D

LOL.....those LSX motors sound like oversize V6's. :D

LOL.....those LSX motors sound like oversize V6's. :D

and make power like oversize big blocks.

I have nothing against folks who like nostalgia engines. There's a place in our hobby for all kinds and nothing says nostalgia like excess weight, low power for displacement and poor fuel economy. After all, there are still 15 or 20 people out there who still love Ford flatheads. :D

and make power like oversize big blocks.

I have nothing against folks who like nostalgia engines. There's a place in our hobby for all kinds and nothing says nostalgia like excess weight, low power for displacement and poor fuel economy. After all, there are still 15 or 20 people out there who still love Ford flatheads. :D

Them fightin' words... :stirpot: :D

Well...here is my thought and initial decision. Kind of do want this 502zz but then I don't. Gen VI does sound good and I always wanted to build (again) or be part of it. At the same time I’ve always been told that cash makes the deals, especially in today’s economy. Going to send the guy an email and offer $6K for all of it. What’s the worst case, I really don’t want it and he really needs the money....seems right?

Just heard from the seller, Gen VI is gone...

Just heard from the seller, Gen VI is gone...

Clearly a sign from God you are meant to go LSx. :thumbsup:

BBC power, sub-SBC weight, AND you can actually afford to drive it around the block.

and make power like oversize big blocks.

I have nothing against folks who like nostalgia engines. There's a place in our hobby for all kinds and nothing says nostalgia like excess weight, low power for displacement and poor fuel economy. After all, there are still 15 or 20 people out there who still love Ford flatheads. :D
Not when you have one of these... :D It will make LSX power in a more radical combination in ball park weight.

http://i200.photobucket.com/albums/aa251/Payback1969/EngineRoadTrip017-1.jpg

That does look so good...

Not when you have one of these... :D It will make LSX power in a more radical combination in ball park weight.

http://i200.photobucket.com/albums/aa251/Payback1969/EngineRoadTrip017-1.jpg

Power's made in the heads. Ported LS7 heads are flowing 380/240 @ 0.650. The LSX specific heads are supposed to be even better. Six bolt (2 cross bolted) mains versus 4 vertical bolt mains?

Please, you're arguing - at the dawn of the car age - that you've got a better buggy whip! That sort of looks like a stock LSx block, only much more expensive. :yes:

PS - All in good fun.

The $7.5K wouldve been a pretty good buy on it. We had one shipped in at around $8500, included new carb, HEI, starter, Al WP. Acc and brackets were extra, though the cast iron GM acc brackets are heavy and ugly (not my call :noway: )

Trust me Mike, I know I'm chasing a ghost. I'm not an old guy at 32, but I still like the look and sound of a big block. Those LS7's make effortless power with puny cams. I like to be different and feel I can compete. We'll meet soon enough. :thumbsup:

Trust me Mike, I know I'm chasing a ghost. I'm not an old guy at 32, but I still like the look and sound of a big block. Those LS7's make effortless power with puny cams. I like to be different and feel I can compete. We'll meet soon enough. :thumbsup:

I watched the Optima show today, and I must say that Penny and JackAss sounded pretty good. It's nice you like the BBC, but as a person who had one in my 1966 Chevelle (in 1966), I guess I'm not quite as nostalgic.

As for meeting up, heck, I'm a geezer with slow reaction time and poor vision. You could take me on a moped. :D

LOL they do sound good. I guess it's a roll reversal. I like old school and you like new. I'll have plenty of power to make it happen with my engine builder. It will just be less reliable and fuel effiecient.

Get a 502 shortblock, zero-deck it, a set of AFR heads milled down, good cam. You'll spend about the same or a little more, and make an easy ~100-150hp over the ZZ502.

Matt - if you can get if for the right price:thumbsup:

I've been looking at some crates too - a heads up on a couple things-

You'll need a new 4qt pan for your Camaro
http://paceperformance.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=22752

In 2009 GMPP started machining the blocks for clutch linkage (Z-bar) and mechanical fuel pump.

If the ZZ502 is a left over '08, it may not have those. If you are sticking with the auto and add a electric FP its no big deal.

Never mind...guess I should read the whole tread before posting!!

Tom

it's Good deal.

make sure you get all the original purchase paper work. Or copies.

PM sent.

Might be able to get warranty extended if engine has never been installed.

Al

Just to close out this thread as we sort of switched to my other 505 build thread (http://www.camaros.net/forums/showthread.php?t=173045)....So I made a $6K cash offer via email on the zz502, headers and serpentine setup. I was expecting the guy to tell me to take a flying hike. He countered with $6500. I am pretty sure I could have counter with $6250 and made the deal. This was a smoking deal but I've decided to go with a local engine builder that's going to build me a 469. For a little more, I'll get a lot more engine (hp/tq)

Wow, $6500 for all that would have been a real nice deal.

Just to close out this thread as we sort of switched to my other 505 build thread (http://www.camaros.net/forums/showthread.php?t=173045)....So I made a $6K cash offer via email on the zz502, headers and serpentine setup. I was expecting the guy to tell me to take a flying hike. He countered with $6500. I am pretty sure I could have counter with $6250 and made the deal. This was a smoking deal but I've decided to go with a local engine builder that's going to build me a 469. For a little more, I'll get a lot more engine (hp/tq)


You might be getting more hp/tq

But your getting "less engine"! IMO

ZZ502
4 bolt block 100% virgin new
Billet Hydraulic roller cam
Forged steel crank
Forged steel rods
Forged aluminum pistons

Aluminum Oval port head with
2.25 stainless valves & 1.88 exh valves

All 100% virgin new!

For 6500.00 ?? That was a no brainier.

Complete!

IMO
Al

Let it go Al.....:D

I purchased a 376/480 LS3, with wiring harness and ECU for $6,200 from someone abandoning a project. Your deal doesn't sound that good, particularly for Jurrasic technology. :D


So why did you put that hunk of aluminum :D in a jurrasic car, as you called it, why didn't you keep it in at dated car from the era it came from, A jurrasic motor with the right parts can make that (LS) vega motor look like its on its face :yes:....don't take offence ,as you call our Technology jurassic, I think new technoligy in a jurassic car is the easy way out .. Happy motoring

So why did you put that hunk of aluminum :D in a jurrasic car, as you called it, why didn't you keep it in at dated car from the era it came from, A jurrasic motor with the right parts can make that (LS) vega motor look like its on its face :yes:....don't take offence ,as you call our Technology jurassic, I think new technoligy in a jurassic car is the easy way out .. Happy motoring




Jerome,,,he must be one of them young guys.

Here is my 502,,,come on LS motor.

http://i268.photobucket.com/albums/jj16/prostreet69camaro/Picture004.jpg

http://i268.photobucket.com/albums/jj16/prostreet69camaro/Picture005.jpg

http://i268.photobucket.com/albums/jj16/prostreet69camaro/DSC_6194-2.jpg

So why did you put that hunk of aluminum :D in a jurrasic car, as you called it, why didn't you keep it in at dated car from the era it came from, A jurrasic motor with the right parts can make that (LS) vega motor look like its on its face :yes:....don't take offence ,as you call our Technology jurassic, I think new technoligy in a jurassic car is the easy way out .. Happy motoring



LOL, the only thing Jurrasic about the car is the body - front & rear suspension, transmission, engine cooling, instruments, wiring, sound, HVAC, seats, interior, etc. are all being updated. While my sub-500 pound, 376 cubic inch engine only puts out 480hp (through factory exhaust manifolds), a little porting on the heads and a slightly more aggressive cam easily get it up to a nicely streetable 500RWHP or more.

My interests are (a) long haul touring, e.g, SoCal to Maine, and (b) going around corners. No SBC/BBC was going to deliver the combination of fuel economy and power I was looking for, and the low weight and good power of the LSx engines is a big plus for handling. If you're happy driving 1/4 mile at a time, more power to you. Me, I like driving 700 miles at a time.

Finally, contrary to speculation, I don't need to be nostalgic, I drove these cars when they were available new on the Chevy dealer's lot.

LOL.....those LSX motors sound like oversize V6's. :D

And the v10 vipers sound like UPS trucks.
Go get them Todd..with the zl1.:cool::beers:

And the v10 vipers sound like UPS trucks.
Go get them Todd..with the zl1.:cool::beers:
Right, that aluminum block will make ALL the difference as compared to those aluminum block LSx's. :thumbsup:

Folks, NA power is made in the heads, FI power is made with strength - keeping the heads on and the bottom end intact - either way the LSx stuff has the old BBC stuff beat. :yes:

Welcome to the 21st century.

I just traded a 350/400hp and $2500 for my Victory. I'm currently in Iraq and plan on building a LS motor when I get back which will be backed by a tremec. I don't think there is anything wrong with the old school small blocks or big blocks. My buddy is currently running a 496 with a turbo that makes 1200hp to the wheels so power out of the old motors is not the issue. I just have never built a LS motor and would really like to try one out, just don't know if it will remain FI or not.

I just traded a 350/400hp and $2500 for my Victory. I'm currently in Iraq and plan on building a LS motor when I get back which will be backed by a tremec. I don't think there is anything wrong with the old school small blocks or big blocks. My buddy is currently running a 496 with a turbo that makes 1200hp to the wheels so power out of the old motors is not the issue. I just have never built a LS motor and would really like to try one out, just don't know if it will remain FI or not.
Hey...your idea does sound good...:thumbsup: Iraq?

Some like the old iron, some like the new stuff. Many like both. No sense in arguing. :thumbsup:

Some like the old iron, some like the new stuff. Many like both. No sense in arguing. :thumbsup:

Thats very true...

Some like the old iron, some like the new stuff. Many like both. No sense in arguing. :thumbsup:

Thats very true...

Isn't that the very essence of bench racing - it's the Chevy family version of Ford vs. Chevy. :thumbsup: I'm certainly not getting upset about this - it's all in good fun (of course I have the better side in this debate). :beers:

There is no doubt that the LSX technology trumps all the old stuff. You can get away with a pretty mild hydraulic cam setup with the light weight internals and killer heads. All while getting great gas mileage. That really can't be argued.

I wanted a big block in my 69 Camaro. It's just the look I want for my car. Going to the ZL-1 block takes 150lbs off the nose vs. the steel block I had in there. It takes my combo down to the 500lb mark. Within 100lbs of a LSX. While big blocks have been slapped in Camaros since the begining of there existence, not many guys are doing it in our circle jerk.(Pro-touring) I like to be different and want to compete with something old school.

There is no doubt that the LSX technology trumps all the old stuff. You can get away with a pretty mild hydraulic cam setup with the light weight internals and killer heads. All while getting great gas mileage. That really can't be argued.

I wanted a big block in my 69 Camaro. It's just the look I want for my car. Going to the ZL-1 block takes 150lbs off the nose vs. the steel block I had in there. It takes my combo down to the 500lb mark. Within 100lbs of a LSX. While big blocks have been slapped in Camaros since the begining of there existence, not many guys are doing it in our circle jerk.(Pro-touring) I like to be different and want to compete with something old school.

I think an all aluminum big block is sexy as all get out. When you're done, it should be about the same weight as a SBC, only with much more power and torque. So far as I'm concerned the only "rule" in all of this is build it to suit yourself, not someone who's not writing the checks.

Todd are you going to the March 22 session at Buttonwillow? I'd really like to get a clsoe up look at your car.

You got that right Mike. I'm not sure, the Super Chevy show/autocross/drags are the same weekend. Then there is an local SCCA autocross on the 27th and looks like Rtth's West on April 3rd. I'm not sure what to do at this point. The car will be back together in time. I'm scheduled to dyno the new motor next Monday. :thumbsup: I'll be over your way at least 2 times this year.

All in good fun ,gotta love it all....Happy motoring :thumbsup: