69 Firebird
70 Chevelle SS
70 Nova SS
70 Nova piecemeal plane Jane

OK, guys talk me out of it. Why should I not do this. Say whatever comes to your mind. Pick on anything you want. Tell me everything you see wrong or right. I made initial offer (35K - pending I like what I see and have a chance to verify validity, etc) without looking at the cars yesterday. He was asking 18K, 16K, 20K, 4.5K for the cars above respectively. I thought I would be funny and sent the guy and email with a $35K offer (40% discount). He took it. Looks like the cars dropped in priced today to 12K, 13K, 15K, 4.5K. So it's not as of a good deal now, 35K on 44.5K (22% discount) versus yesterday it was a 35K on a 58.5K deal. I did look at them today. WHAT DO YOU THINK? WOULD YOU DO IT? WOULD YOU MAKE A NEW OFFER (of course - but how much)? I have until tomorrow. I will describe each car in separate response..

OK, guys talk me out of it. Why should I not do this. Say whatever comes to your mind.

Mark Jones engine and 700R4.

Also for personal reasons, I do not like Firebirds and prefer pre-'68 Novas and Chevelles.

Here is the 69 Firebird info.
Numbers matching. He has all the original parts that he took of the motor. This is a Pontiac 350 motor. His wife's car and she wanted the motor blue. No rust. Original floors and trunk. 53K original miles.

http://www.mattlekawa.com/pictures/camaro/firebird1.jpg

http://www.mattlekawa.com/pictures/camaro/firebird2.jpg

http://www.mattlekawa.com/pictures/camaro/firebird3.jpg

http://www.mattlekawa.com/pictures/camaro/firebird4.jpg

http://www.mattlekawa.com/pictures/camaro/firebird5.jpg

http://www.mattlekawa.com/pictures/camaro/firebird6.jpg

http://www.mattlekawa.com/pictures/camaro/firebird7.jpg

http://www.mattlekawa.com/pictures/camaro/firebird8.jpg

http://www.mattlekawa.com/pictures/camaro/firebird9.jpg

http://www.mattlekawa.com/pictures/camaro/firebird10.jpg

Here is the 70 Chevelle SS info. "138" code car. 454 but not original as the original was a 396, I think. There is good chance I can get the original block. It's sitting in some farmer's barn and it's cracked. No rust. Original floors and trunk.

http://www.mattlekawa.com/pictures/camaro/chevelle1.jpg

http://www.mattlekawa.com/pictures/camaro/chevelle2.jpg

http://www.mattlekawa.com/pictures/camaro/chevelle3.jpg

http://www.mattlekawa.com/pictures/camaro/chevelle4.jpg

http://www.mattlekawa.com/pictures/camaro/chevelle5.jpg

http://www.mattlekawa.com/pictures/camaro/chevelle6.jpg

http://www.mattlekawa.com/pictures/camaro/chevelle7.jpg

http://www.mattlekawa.com/pictures/camaro/chevelle8.jpg

http://www.mattlekawa.com/pictures/camaro/chevelle9.jpg

http://www.mattlekawa.com/pictures/camaro/chevelle10.jpg

The guy must be about to lose his house or something.

Nova SS 12 bolt, 383 stroker (not original block).

http://www.mattlekawa.com/pictures/camaro/novaB1.jpg

http://www.mattlekawa.com/pictures/camaro/novaB2.jpg

http://www.mattlekawa.com/pictures/camaro/novaB3.jpg

http://www.mattlekawa.com/pictures/camaro/novaB4.jpg

http://www.mattlekawa.com/pictures/camaro/novaB5.jpg

http://www.mattlekawa.com/pictures/camaro/novaB6.jpg

http://www.mattlekawa.com/pictures/camaro/novaB7.jpg

http://www.mattlekawa.com/pictures/camaro/novaB9.jpg

http://www.mattlekawa.com/pictures/camaro/novaB10.jpg

http://www.mattlekawa.com/pictures/camaro/novaB11.jpg

70 Nova piecemeal. Was auto on the column but is not a 4 speed. He has the original trans and column. 350 SBC. No rust in trunk or on quarters.

http://www.mattlekawa.com/pictures/camaro/novaA1.jpg

http://www.mattlekawa.com/pictures/camaro/novaA2.jpg

http://www.mattlekawa.com/pictures/camaro/novaA3.jpg

http://www.mattlekawa.com/pictures/camaro/novaA4.jpg

http://www.mattlekawa.com/pictures/camaro/novaA5.jpg

http://www.mattlekawa.com/pictures/camaro/novaA6.jpg

http://www.mattlekawa.com/pictures/camaro/novaA7.jpg

http://www.mattlekawa.com/pictures/camaro/novaA8.jpg

The guy must be about to lose his house or something.
I don't think so. You should see what else he has that's NOT for sale. He has true numbers matching 69 SS/RS...forgot which options, but super rare. He has 6-7 other cars not for sale...

WTF...You made a offer and he accepted. You are not going to stand behind your offer ?

The Chevelle is ate up with rust under that top behind the rear window and going tdown into the trunk, also the left sail panel you can see bubbles.

Being a Chevelle owner this is nothing new, it's expected. I would be willing to bet the 1/4's are banged up and they have real tendancy for dents whre they hump out at the rear wheels to the trunk. Cruise nites etc and people leaning on the car and they dent in, they are just weak there and you see em with bondo etc. I call em butt dents and they can be a pain if they have been worked wrong in the past. It takea good body man to fix em correctly.

All in all ight not be a bad deal for all of them but i would do a personal inspection. It looks like they all have traction bars and have been raced or attempted to be raced and could be pretty abused and bodys on the subframe cars could be tweaked. On the Chevelle look around at the pot metal head lamp surrounds, they are not cheap to buy for good ones and the aftermarket ones fit like crap....or used too. Look as high and as far in as possible into the rear 1/4's they also rust in the front of the rear wheel at the 1/4 and door jam/rocker area. You will need to look under it in this area. Door hinges on them are usally toast since the door is heavy and people leaning on them getting in and out.

WTF...You made a offer and he accepted. You are not going to stand behind your offer ?
NO...I made an initial offer pending I would look at the cars and reevaluate. Today I looked at the cars and I'm about to reevaluate as the cars need more work than described in the ad and certainly are not as numbers matching as the ad described, especially the Chevelle that was described as numbers matching. Not to mention, the seller reduced the price on 3 of the cars.

You are looking to buy quanity over quality, cars that need a lot of work and $ and in this market, you will likely be in the red on all of them after investing to complete them. Considering none of them is a must have car, I would take the $35k and buy something of quality that I really wanted.

Charlie
69 Camaro RS (see here in classifieds)
70 Challenger

Charlie - Very well said and I do see your point. My 35K offer was based on his original price of each car added all up or $58.5. Now, they add up to $44.5 as he reduced them and if I saw that yesterday, I would have offered let's say $25k-28k.

Are you looking to flip or do you like any one of them....or are you just like me and a little bored so you're thinking it might be a good way to try something out and then get rid of it if you didn't like it? I've been fighting the urge to go take a look at a '67 Fairlane two door for a couple of weeks now.

If I were looking for another car, I'd spend a lot more on the one I wanted before I'd accept a steal on one I didn't. See '65-'67 Nova vs. '62-'64 or '68-'72 Nova.

I think what you need to do is just drop a load of cash on a detached garage like I just did so it'll put you out of the game for awhile.:D

My initial thought was to flip 3 of them and hopefully make enough to come out with a free car out of the deal. The other thing I haven't told you that you touched on is storage. I could take one in my garage, the other three I would have to pay to store. This means each month I pay rent, it takes away from the overall deal. I would keep either the Chevelle or the black Nova SS.

In that case the safe money may just be to work out a good deal on the one you actually want.

Good point Steiner. I was hoping to hear that this may be a heck of a deal and be able to jump on it...but sounds like it may not be after all.

Don't listen to me though. I'm just now starting to get my impulse buys under control and still have relapses. Usually it's too much time surfing craigslist while bored.

If you really think you can get $30k or so out of the three you would not keep then maybe it's worth it. I don't know about CO but here you pretty much have to go through the trouble of getting insurance on them and registering them. Even though you get a prorated amount back once you get rid of them it's a pain. Even a free car would wind up costing me a heap of money though. Vinyl tops scare the **** out of me.

Just emailed the guy and asked why he dropped the price and that I would have to reconsider given the new price. He claims this is easy 50K worth cars but he wanted to bottom it out - not sure what he means by that. Going to bed on that note but feel much better after talking about this on here and confirming that this may not be such a good deal after all. Thanks for all the feedback.

I kept telling myself as well my buddy that came with me over and over again...if it sounds too good to be true then it's probably not...

Looks like a lot of work. I have enough trouble with one car let alone 4. It is ambitous to say the least. It might seem like a bargain, but you don't have to grab a bargain just cause it is, just Make sure you have means and desire to complete 4 projects. I agree. Spend the 35K on one really nice car that you can enjoy. Someone posted in one of the threads that if a deal looks to good to be true, it probably is!

I guess you never know until you get your feet wet, Big Money. I got pushed out of the flip business a few years ago. Bought a brand new motorcycle I thought I could turn an easy 20% profit on in no time. After all the Cycletrader fees, registration and insurance, travel to get it, etc. I made $100 off it when it finally sold. Yet one of many reminders I've gotten that I'm not as smart as I think I am.

I would say if you can get all 4 cars for 25 to 28 you would be doing OK. For 35 grand I think you would only be able to get your money back on them. Just my 2cents. If I was to keep one it would be the black Nova.

have you had these car appraised at all? It only costs 150 bucks where im at my brother sold his car at 18k after getting it appraisded, (68 caharger), the issue here is the cars need work beyond the work that it needs you haveto consider supply and demand..

I dont like the fire bird as its just a generic camaro dont care what any one says, do you havethe protecto plate matching numbers etc if not its just an unfinished proje ct street rod

I wont even go into Novas my dad oned one when i was really young i hate them they look like old used TJ south or the border cars, again what is the demand within the market for Novas or fire birds would you get your money back ,, i SERIOUSLY doubt it..

My FRIEND DONT WALK RUN AS FAST as you can away fro this deal... off supply and deman items are only making $$ because of the overall hobby old mucle car following but you arent looking at a huge backing for either firebird or camaro, many firebirds can be had at 1/2 the cost of their big brother camaro as the firebird is literally a mooch of the assembly line of the camaro...

My initial thought was to flip 3 of them and hopefully make enough to come out with a free car out of the deal. The other thing I haven't told you that you touched on is storage. I could take one in my garage, the other three I would have to pay to store. This means each month I pay rent, it takes away from the overall deal. I would keep either the Chevelle or the black Nova SS.

The first negative: You don't have the storage and will be paying for it. Flipping cars is great if they possess a low initial purchase price, a solid foundation, desirablity, and you have cheap parts inventory from other past projects.
Your posted prices: 12K, 13K, 15K, 4.5K. The first 3 are no bargains. Firebird: Not much of a markup there. The Chevelle needs help and is high. The black Nova needs more coin to complete and paperwork for SS verification, and the origional motor is gone. The blue Nova is, well, that 4.5K price is just ridiculous. Even if the black Nova is nice in real life the stripes have to go for marketablity. If you remove the blue Nova from the equation you are paying 35K for a 40K asking price. Now you need the capital to finish these cars, the shop and the time.

According to your plan for a free car you have to make at least 25K on this deal after expenditures.

I dunno, Matt?... there's a lot of "if's" in this bulk purchase.

It's a pretty soft market out there right now... and to flip at this time?

Depends upon how deep your pockets are..can you do the work yourself, pick up the required parts/materials, pay storage, then in turn find available buyers.

Sounds like the seller is pretty motivated...and as suggested, what kind of car could ya get for laying out 35k, eh?

capt

I'm no Chevelle expert and that may very well be an SS but the TT looks like 13637. The "138" as an SS only applied to 65-68.
http://cdnclassics.chevelles.net/amemodel.htm#70

Wow, just wow...

pretty sure the only way to document a true 70 chevelle ss is with a build sheet!!
lots of rot in that chevelles roof and anyone looking to buy one will see that and walk or offer much less than what your asking!!
not to mention yellow can hide a ton of bondo!!!
look at the frame on the chevelle under where the back of the front fender and the front of the door meet, bad area for rot on 70-72 models
I looked at about 30-40 70-72`s before i bought this one!!

http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a351/Tonystoys123/mean%20green/Picture1259.jpg

This is why I love this site so much. You guys posted some really good reasons why not do this and so far no a single reason to seal the deal. This is also why I wanted to sleep on this as we all tend to get little excited and sometimes make deals that we regret later on. I will take all the good advice and will pass on this deal.

I will take all the good advice and will pass on this deal.


:thumbsup:

one last thought then.. if a guy buys 3 or 4 cars and "flips" them, can he get in a jam with the DMV for not having a seller's license? I guess each state is different but that would be my luck.

BTW, the guy called me tonight with his bottom line counter offer of $28K. I said thanks but no go.

Holy ****. Danger, Will Robinson.

For 28K, I would have been at his house with a trailer before he could even hang up the phone. :yes: It seams, some of you think if the car isn't perfect, you wont even consider it, or view it as junk. :( Trust me there are thousands of entry level car buyers that either don't have the funds to buy a completely finished high dollar car or would rather just build one their own way, & would snatch those up in a heart beat. Personally,I don't see how you would have lost money @ 35K for all four, let alone @ 28K. It is obvious the guy is hurting for money or he wouldn't be calling you.

As always, JMHO
:beers:

For 28K, I would have been at his house with a trailer before he could even hang up the phone. :yes: It seams, some of you think if the car isn't perfect, you wont even consider it, or view it as junk. :( Trust me there are thousands of entry level car buyers that either don't have the funds to buy a completely finished high dollar car or would rather just build one their own way, & would snatch those up in a heart beat. Personally,I don't see how you would have lost money @ 35K for all four, let alone @ 28K. It is obvious the guy is hurting for money or he wouldn't be calling you.

As always, JMHO
:beers:
Nope, not at all as far as thinking something is junk. However, the buyer wants to clear a profit for a free car. And given his particular set of circumstances this would not be feasable with only one bay. $28 grand is not bad if one has a shop to house them all and the capital to build them quickly enough to enter them into the market. Which at this time is not that good. So how long can they sit around until completed to turn that 25K minimum profit? Or how long after completion can one hold out for maximum selling price to achieve that profit?

Nope, not at all as far as thinking something is junk. However, the buyer wants to clear a profit for a free car. And given his particular set of circumstances this would not be feasable with only one bay. $28 grand is not bad if one has a shop to house them all and the capital to build them quickly enough to enter them into the market. Which at this time is not that good. So how long can they sit around until completed to turn that 25K minimum profit? Or how long after completion can one hold out for maximum selling price to achieve that profit?
They would have to be done one at a time, mostly over weekends...it would take me a while. Especially because I haven't done bodywork for a long time. My dad was a limo body man and I worked with him for a while long, long time ago. It would take me a car or two to get it all figured out and dialed in again. If I had a barn, the deal would have been so much better for me....

Just my little opinion. At 28K for all 4 is a steal. A BB 70 Chevelle is worth a lot more than folks think. If done correctly you could end up with the other cars for free.

Wish I had 28K laying around ......... :D

Just my little opinion. At 28K for all 4 is a steal. A BB 70 Chevelle is worth a lot more than folks think. If done correctly you could end up with the other cars for free.

Wish I had 28K laying around ......... :D

X2, If i was presented that deal for $28k i would already own all four of those cars.

The market is FLOODED with GM cars that are already restored, and/or are great 5-footers. Many cars are for sale for a very long time before they sell....

At $28K, and if it's about money (which the flipping game is...), you're losing your shirt and then some on this deal all day long.

You're better off buying 10 '85 - '93 5-liter Mustangs while they're cheap. When the economic mend is complete and people aren't spooked by spending their money, these are the next hot cars.

The best clean one is the bird...the rest need alot of money and attention thrown at them...just my opinion

I don't know about where you live but 28K sounds like a steal. Buy them. Sell the blue nova for a 4K. Sell the firebird to me for 8K and use that to finish the other two. This way you will have a real nice Chevelle SS and and Nova SS for 16K and I have a nice firebird. What do you say? I call dibs and feel free to sell me the firebird or the Nova!

My initial thought was to flip 3 of them and hopefully make enough to come out with a free car out of the deal. The other thing I haven't told you that you touched on is storage. I could take one in my garage, the other three I would have to pay to store. This means each month I pay rent, it takes away from the overall deal. I would keep either the Chevelle or the black Nova SS.

You could store them at my place.:hurray:

You could store them at my place.:hurray:
If you lived in CO, I would take you up on that offer.