Thanks for the advise I got from multiple searches on this forum. The best was - "use your foot to press the bows into the clips" I don't remember who suggested that one but it worked great. I tried to push them in with my hand but I couldn't get enough force on them.

I still have to glue the corners but here are a few pics of the progress.

Lay it out in the hot sun for a couple hours. That really helps get it nice and soft.
http://i268.photobucket.com/albums/jj28/DaralJ/67%20RS%20SS350/August152010005.jpg
http://i268.photobucket.com/albums/jj28/DaralJ/67%20RS%20SS350/August222010003.jpg
http://i268.photobucket.com/albums/jj28/DaralJ/67%20RS%20SS350/August222010005.jpg
http://i268.photobucket.com/albums/jj28/DaralJ/67%20RS%20SS350/August232010003.jpg

Looks nice. How much time do you have in it?

It looks good.

When its installed if you have any wrinkles or loose spots try misting the area with plain water, then let the car sit out in the sun. This worked well on mine.

Good job, good tip about warming the material.:thumbsup:

I put my head liner in the dryer w/ a couple of fabric softener sheets. Worked great getting the wrinkels out and smelled nice too.:D

Looks nice. How much time do you have in it?
Not that much time really. After a couple hours in the sun, it probably took me about 2 hours to measure and cut for the bows, snap them into the clips and get everything stretched and clamped. Notice that my front and back windows are out which makes this job really easy. I only glued the center of the front and back on Sunday. Each evening this week I have removed the clamps on a section and glued it. Since it is already stretched, that only takes a few minutes. I have everything done now except the back corners. I will glue them tonight.

Leaving it stretched but not glued for a couple days seemed to help get the wrinkles out. Getting it tight was important but also it seemed that stretching it evenly was the key to getting the wrinkles out.

anyone do this AFTER the glass has been installed??

anyone do this AFTER the glass has been installed??
I may be attempting this soon as I have just about run out of $$$$. It looks like it will be a pita with the windows in....

anyone do this AFTER the glass has been installed??

You can do it but part way through the job you will wish you had taken the glass out:)

I think it would be very difficult with the glass in. With the glass out, it was actually very easy. Here are more pictures. I made new sail panels from canvas board that you can get from a craft store.
http://i268.photobucket.com/albums/jj28/DaralJ/67%20RS%20SS350/August232010010.jpg

I put glue on the sail panel tack strip and used 1/4 inch staples in my staple gun to attach the headliner to it.
http://i268.photobucket.com/albums/jj28/DaralJ/67%20RS%20SS350/August252010002.jpg

I used Velcro to hold the sail panels.
http://i268.photobucket.com/albums/jj28/DaralJ/67%20RS%20SS350/August292010002.jpg

I think it would be very difficult with the glass in. With the glass out, it was actually very easy. Here are more pictures. I made new sail panels from canvas board that you can get from a craft store.
http://i268.photobucket.com/albums/jj28/DaralJ/67%20RS%20SS350/August232010010.jpg

I put glue on the sail panel tack strip and used 1/4 inch staples in my staple gun to attach the headliner to it.
http://i268.photobucket.com/albums/jj28/DaralJ/67%20RS%20SS350/August252010002.jpg

I used Velcro to hold the sail panels.
http://i268.photobucket.com/albums/jj28/DaralJ/67%20RS%20SS350/August292010002.jpg

Daral did you have staples in your tac strips originally?

Roger

Looks good! Did keeping the extra bow material help with keeping it in line? figure its time to undertake the headliner....

Yes, My old headliner (not sure if it was original but it probably was considering all the rodent nests in it) had staples in the tack strip. Not very many but you can see them in this picture.
http://i268.photobucket.com/albums/jj28/DaralJ/67%20RS%20SS350/April262007026.jpg

I found the center of the headliner at each bow sleeve and then centered each bow at its location. I marked the ends of the bows and then trimmed the sleeves about 1 1/2 inches more toward the center. You can see this on the pictures in post #1. Keeping the extra bow material probably helped me keep it in line but it also gave me more to hold when I was stretching it. Once all the bows are snapped into the clips they stay in place and line up nicely.

Nice work.

Appreciate it Daral....now just to purchase the headliner and get it in....

Does anyone have a pic of the tac strips?

This may not be the best picture but you can see it attached to the sail panel. It attaches with two screws, one on each end.
http://i268.photobucket.com/albums/jj28/DaralJ/67%20RS%20SS350/April262007031.jpg

This is a pic of my tac strip. My original headline was just glued to this tac strip.

Roger

http://i193.photobucket.com/albums/z177/roger62305/Tacstrip.jpg

Roger - That looks just like mine except the mice removed all that nice insulation for me. In addition to the couple of staples, my old headliner also was glued to the tac strip. Like I said I don't know if it was the original one or not.

Okay...I WONDERED what that little bar was that went across that opening. Mine is just bare metal from being media blasted. I'm sure I can glue a strip of cork or some other filler material into the slot and then glue the headliner to that.

Thanks guys!

i don't think i have those! what can i use in place of originals or are they re-popping them? are they just held on by screws?

Make them out of a thin strip of wood, a piece of panneling, or luan (sp) would work
fine, rememder they won't be seen again.

Jim - use something tougher than cork. Mine have more of a wood consistency to them. John has a good idea...a thin strip of plywood should work. I am not sure luan alone will be strong enough to hold the headliner once it is streched and attached to them. If you glue the luan into the metal strip that should work.

They are held by two screws, one at each end. You can see the screws in Roger's picture.

i don't think i have those! what can i use in place of originals or are they re-popping them? are they just held on by screws?

The only supplier I know of that have these is HBC. Although I will never use HBC there is a link below for the tac strips. If I had to make them I believe I would use some kind if metal. I think a aluminum strip (1/2" x 1/8") would work good. I would be concerned anything made with wood would draw moister and break.

Roger

http://www.heartbeatcity.com/store/product/20790/Camaro-Sail-panel-inner-tack-strips--67-68-69/

Roger, nice trick with the labeling of the bow and location....like that! and I have a question about that....if you move them up/forward a hole, does that move the headliner up also? just curious....

Roger, nice trick with the labeling of the bow and location....like that! and I have a question about that....if you move them up/forward a hole, does that move the headliner up also? just curious....

I marked the hole like that so I could be sure they were in the same place on reassemble. After they were marked I took a picture of each and its a good thing I did because when they blasted the interior the marks went away.
I don't think the critical measurement on the holes is front to back, it is up and down. I never experimented at all. It went back together like it came apart. After I took the pics I also documented it on paper that is below.

Roger

http://i193.photobucket.com/albums/z177/roger62305/HeadlinerBowinfo.jpg

Looks great. Reminds me of doing mine last summer. I was very nervous to try it myself but it turned out great. My headliner was stapled to those tacks strips. I used headliner glue and clipped the material to the strip and let it dry overnight - no problems.

thanks roger....I may try to move them up just to see how it affects it before I totally stretch the headliner out we'll see

Roger,
I wonder how different the measurements are for a 69 roof compared to your 67 roof.

No two cars are the same due to liner, rod and inner structure variables. A '68 I just tore apart does not even maintain consistency side to side. The last liner I installed I did not even reference the previous holes and it went in without a hitch. Marking the holes prior to removal to strengthen installation confidence is certainly not dissuaded. It's nice to see some are taking the task upon themselves and proving it not to be so difficult, which it isn't.

Roger,
I wonder how different the measurements are for a 69 roof compared to your 67 roof.

I couldn't tell you because my 67 is the only car I have restored.

No two cars are the same due to liner, rod and inner structure variables. A '68 I just tore apart does not even maintain consistency side to side. The last liner I installed I did not even reference the previous holes and it went in without a hitch. Marking the holes prior to removal to strengthen installation confidence is certainly not dissuaded. It's nice to see some are taking the task upon themselves and proving it not to be so difficult, which it isn't.

You may be right but I notice in the picture above the bows in Daral's car are in the same holes mine were in. Moveing the bows 1/2" one way or another may not make a difference but I used the original holes and it turned out good.

Roger

I did the same thing Roger did with his bows. I took pictures and made a diagram so I could put them back in the same holes. After 5 years it was easy to forget which holes were used. I also tagged each bow so I knew which order they went in front to back. That was important since they each have an arch that is a little different.

In my 68, the front part of the headliner (bow?) has dropped down. Is it possible to just press it back into position, and how difficult is it to find the spots where it is fastened to to the roof?

And one more question: In the area between the sail panels and the headliner, the glue has come loose.
Are the sail panels glued into position, and is there a special kind of glue to use for this?
Last, are there supposed to be coupe lights on the sail panels? My 67 had them, but not my 68.

If headliner came loose at the mirror, it came off the brackets under the molding.
If the first bow rearward, the bow may have broken/rusted as it is pretty strong to stay in place with a plastic clip.
The material is glued to the sail panel cardboard(?) and retained with upholstery clips.
Sial panel lights are an option, Convenience Package, I think.

68s don't get lights in the sailpanels, that's 67 only.

If headliner came loose at the mirror, it came off the brackets under the molding.
If the first bow rearward, the bow may have broken/rusted as it is pretty strong to stay in place with a plastic clip.
The material is glued to the sail panel cardboard(?) and retained with upholstery clips.
Sial panel lights are an option, Convenience Package, I think.

It came loose at the first bow from the front. The car was restored and a new headliner installed some two years ago, so I think I can rule out rust. What exactly holds the headliner to the bow? Plastic clips?

It came loose at the first bow from the front. The car was restored and a new headliner installed some two years ago, so I think I can rule out rust. What exactly holds the headliner to the bow? Plastic clips?

The bows slide into a sleeves sown in the headliner. What holds the bows upright are plastic clip that attach to the center roof of the car. The bows just snap into these clips. Normally after the bows have been pushed into these clips they don't come out. It is possible that they broke that front clip when they reinstalled that front bow. The link below shows the plastic clip i am talking about.
After you take the rear window and side trim loose the sail panels should come out pretty easily. Most of the time guys use valcor to reattach the sail panels when the headliner is replaced.

Roger

http://www.rickscamaros.com/camaro-headliner-bow-mounting-clip-set-1967-1969.html

The bows slide into a sleeves sown in the headliner. What holds the bows upright are plastic clip that attach to the center roof of the car. The bows just snap into these clips. Normally after the bows have been pushed into these clips they don't come out. It is possible that they broke that front clip when they reinstalled that front bow. The link below shows the plastic clip i am talking about.
After you take the rear window and side trim loose the sail panels should come out pretty easily. Most of the time guys use valcor to reattach the sail panels when the headliner is replaced.

Roger

http://www.rickscamaros.com/camaro-headliner-bow-mounting-clip-set-1967-1969.html

Thanks Roger,

There is a picture on page two of this tread, I just didn't know what I was looking for. The problem I've got is one of two. Either the bow has dropped out of the clip, or the clip has dropped out from the roof.
How is the clip secured to the roof? Does it "click" into place, or do you insert it 90 degrees off, then turn to lock it in the correct position?
If that clip is broken, I'll be stuck with a hanging headliner for years to come.
I only think the middle part is my problem, but how are the bow ends secured to the edge of the roof? It's difficult to tell from the pictures on page two.

Search and you shall find:

YouTube - Episode 4 Complete Camaro Headliner Install Autorestomod.flv

I just checked. The bow has dropped out of the clip, and the clip is still in place. That is the good news. The bad: The clip is forward if the bow, and at the moment it doesn't seem to be possible to slide it backwards into position.
I need to try do this when the weather gets warmer and the headliner softer. It will be easier to work with. Same for re-gluing the headliner to the sail panels.

Pushing the bow into the clip was not easy even if they do line up. I could not do it with my hands. I got on my back and used my foot to get the bow snapped into place.

I'll remember that, Daral.
Thanks!

Just watched that video...
Anyone else think it odd that no one in the video ever wears ANY kind of mask or respirator while spraying the adhesive? lol
I bought a good mask to use when I do some small powdercoating jobs in my basement. One look at the filters after the first small job I did told me everything I needed to know ;)
Still a bit chilly in Mass, with 2-3" of fresh snow this morning and an unheated garage, but when I start working on this later, I'm going to put a small oil-filled space heater in the car for a few hours to warm the headliner up before stretching.

Jim

Did anyone take measurements of their "listing wires"? Mine were removed by someone else, so don't know the order they go back in, and I don't see it listed in the Fisher body manual. Thought I'd seen it here, but can't find it now.
My wires are all painted with a dap of blue on one end, and pink on the other, which struck me as odd, since they seem to by symmetrical.

Jim

Ok...based on combining Roger's info with Hwystarjoe's post, I got the info I need.
Unfortunately, my listing wires were all taped together, and I only have 4. The one Joe refers to as "Middle - thin", is missing...so looks like I need to put an order in to Rick's.
I checked Ground Up, and it looked like they only had bows for 70-71s.

***EDIT***
Just got back from Lowes to pick up other stuff and grabbed a 4' piece of 1/4 steel rod. Can someone send me a pic or at least the dimension of the middle rod?

Jim

Did anyone take measurements of their "listing wires"? Mine were removed by someone else, so don't know the order they go back in, and I don't see it listed in the Fisher body manual. Thought I'd seen it here, but can't find it now.
My wires are all painted with a dap of blue on one end, and pink on the other, which struck me as odd, since they seem to by symmetrical.

Jim

Jim I marked my bows when I removed them so I didn't ever measure them but when I stored them I bunched them together. With then together I could see the difference in lengths. From memery I believe the front two were very close or even maybe the same length. The back two are different lengths and the one near the rear window is the longer bow.
The center bow is prety much a straight metal rod about 2/3rds the diameter of the other bows. There was very slight turn downs on the ends. If I were making that center bow I would shape it the same as the center section of the other bows.
Chech the center support of your car because some of the guys have found that center bow still in the car.

Roger

I have a numbered spare set. Omitting the slender bow, the 1st and second are the same. 3rd and 4th are shaped differently. 3rd is longest. It would be difficult to install them incorrectly. They are spring steel, including the slender one. You're not making them unless you have the means.

Just got back from Lowes to pick up other stuff and grabbed a 4' piece of 1/4 steel rod. Can someone send me a pic or at least the dimension of the middle rod?

Jim
The slender rod is approx .105" and spring steel.

I understand the originals are spring, but I'm also looking at the fact that with the center clips in the picture, the rods are only spanning about 20", and are under tension, without much weight at all on them...
Might be worth a shot.

***Edit***

Roger...good tip. Just checked and there does appear to be a very slender rod still on the roof of the car. There are triangular tabs bent up that hold it in place, and it's just aft of the dome light. Is that the guy I'm searching for? Hope so.

Also, when you snap the rods into the clips, do you cut a slot in the fabric so it's just the rod snapping into the plastic clip, or does both rod and fabric snap into the clip? I've read that the clips are pretty tight, would hate to snap one.

Jim

Roger...good tip. Just checked and there does appear to be a very slender rod still on the roof of the car. There are triangular tabs bent up that hold it in place, and it's just aft of the dome light. Is that the guy I'm searching for? Hope so.

Also, when you snap the rods into the clips, do you cut a slot in the fabric so it's just the rod snapping into the plastic clip, or does both rod and fabric snap into the clip? I've read that the clips are pretty tight, would hate to snap one.

Jim

Jim I am pretty sure you found your center bow. I didn't cut any slit for the center clip but I was using the old clip. the newer clip may be tighter. The thing is you don't want the bow to come out of that clip after you get the headline glued in.
In a earlier post you were talking about the spray adhesive and a respirator. I personally didn't used the spray not because of needing a respirator but because I wanted to control it and I didn't think I could do that with a spray. To spread the contact glue I got a half dozen foam disposable brushes and through them away after using them.

Roger

Roger,
I don't have the equipment to spray...I bought some Weldwood contact cement...a 1qt can. But if I was going to use a spray gun, doing so without a mask is kinda nuts. There's some nasty stuff in there.
I also have the original clips, which are white plastic, and a new set of clips, which are clear plastic. I'll do a test fit with each. I would think the original clips may have become brittle with age...we'll see.

Jim

Roger,
I don't have the equipment to spray...I bought some Weldwood contact cement...a 1qt can. But if I was going to use a spray gun, doing so without a mask is kinda nuts. There's some nasty stuff in there.
I also have the original clips, which are white plastic, and a new set of clips, which are clear plastic. I'll do a test fit with each. I would think the original clips may have become brittle with age...we'll see.

Jim
The contact cement's chemical components will still be airborne upon usage and hardly make a difference whether sprayed or brushed. You will still have your face slammed in the vapors if you brush it, and as soon as you open the can. Spraying glue is not like spraying paint, the disbursement of solvents into the air is different. Wearing a mask is always optional.