69 camaro ss or not ? [Archive] - Team Camaro Tech

: 69 camaro ss or not ?


tk modesitt
Oct 12th, 00, 06:26 PM
my wife & i need help to know if our car is a ss or not . please give us all the information you can this is our #'s off the fire wall plate: ST69 12432 NOR143928BDY
TR723 69SDNT
100 X11

OUR VIN # : 124379N699057

Pat's 69's
Oct 13th, 00, 03:17 PM
12437 - V8 coupe
N - built in Norwood Ohio
143928th car built
723- midnight green standard interior
69-cortez silver
S- green vinyl top
10D-built 4th week in Oct.
X11-style trim group (include's SS 350's)
Note ,not all were SS 350"s
You will have to look for certian things on your car such as fuel line's,front power disc brake's,exhaust hanger bracket welded on frame in wheel well,multi-leaf spring's,& 12 bolt rear.

tk modesitt
Oct 13th, 00, 06:40 PM
our car has a 12 bolt rear , multileaf springs , front power disc brakes .
we have been told it came out with a 396
could this be true?

[This message has been edited by tk modesitt (edited 10-13-2000).]

Peace69Z/28
Oct 13th, 00, 06:53 PM
Nope. The SS 396 trim tag codes were X22, or X66. As Pat suggested above, check for number of fuel lines, and the LH rear exhaust hanger frame plate.

Chris396
Oct 14th, 00, 12:30 AM
Weird color combination. Have any pictures?

------------------
'69 RS SS 396 375hp L78 Convertible, M22, 3.31 posi, deluxe interior, gauges, rosewood wheel, AM-FM,fold down seat, tilt wheel, SS wheels, console mounted 8 track player, chambered exhaust
http://albums.photopoint.com/j/AlbumIndex?u=1169124&a=8603468

tk modesitt
Oct 14th, 00, 06:03 AM
thanks guys for all the help, but there arent any numbers on the exhaust hanger. thank goodness they didnt take the fuel lines
it only has one. it did have a rosewood wheel, am/fm , fold down seats , and dual exhaust. you all are the greatest

Rich Fields
Oct 15th, 00, 09:51 AM
If there is only one original fuel line on a X11 car then it didn't have a Q-jet carb (which used a return line in 69) and therefore wouldn't be an SS-350. This doesn't mean you should stop looking for evidence, since you need to make sure that your fuel line(s) are original.

The questioner that mentioned your exhaust hangers was asking if you had the frame rail reinforcement on *both* sides of the car. A 69 SS coupe has these, as does any other factory dual exhaust coupe. Lack of them indicates that the car wasn't a SS-350, but presence of both of them doesn't prove it (necessary, but not sufficient).

Other easy things to examine include the tire sticker and the hood springs.

See the table at http://www.camaros.org/diffs69.shtml

Rich

tk modesitt
Oct 15th, 00, 12:53 PM
Rich our car does look like the fuel line has been replaced , thanks. also the only numbers i can find on the hood springs are a symbol that looks like a reversed "4" beside a " v", also the car does have a cowl inducton hood. thanks for all the replys we hope to find out what we have disappointing or not . this is a win win situation because it is a 69 camaro.forgot to mention it does have the frame rail reinforcement on both sides. and the referance table is great thanks ; question ? our vin shows 12437 that of a Z28 but the X11 puts us in a LM1 or SS L48 , am i reading this wrong?

[This message has been edited by tk modesitt (edited 10-15-2000).]

tk modesitt
Oct 15th, 00, 01:32 PM
Rich,
our hood springs measure 9.325".
We have an SS. We can't THANK YOU enough.
I'm sure we will have more questions later.
Once again THANKS.

Peace69Z/28
Oct 15th, 00, 07:17 PM
tk,
12437 is good for Z/28, SS, and other v/8's. It decodes to Camaro v/8 sport coupe.

Kurt S
Oct 16th, 00, 05:26 AM
I would not assume that the car is a SS. None of the items proved that statement. Hood springs could have been changed and the dual exhaust and disc brakes were optional on any V8 car.
What is the axle code from the passenger axle tube? See the sketch of the location under 'Decoding' on the CRG site.

------------------
Kurt S.
www.camaros.org (http://www.camaros.org)

Rich Fields
Oct 16th, 00, 06:55 AM
Kurt is correct - still too early to jump to conclusions. There is research remaining to be done on this car.

You imply that the original engine is gone, but you didn't say. That true?

You haven't indicated the transmission type. What is/was it?

No documentation at all?

It is always possible in situations like this that it can't be proven one way or the other if it is an SS or not. If your engine and tranny are gone, but your 12-bolt is correctly dated for your car, then you've got a decent story, but still one based on circumstantial evidence.

Rich

tk modesitt
Oct 16th, 00, 12:51 PM
Hey Guys,
This is getting discouraging!
We so far are unable to find the tranny
numbers ,but it is a powerglide.
We contacted the previous owner, the rearend was changed out to a 10 bolt,we
found the casting #'s e038
9793019
The person that owned it before changed a # of things, for racing purposes. I know this
may not be anything, but it has the SS emblems. I appreciate all of your HELP.

Rich Fields
Oct 17th, 00, 12:11 PM
Don't get discouraged. On the other hand, don't fixate on your car being a SS. A lot of fine Camaros aren't SS's (including my L30/M20).

You're correct - SS emblems don't make a SS. My L30/M20 was dressed as an SS when I bought it. http://www.camaros.net/forum/smile.gif

9793019 doesn't mean anything to me as a casting number. If that is the axle casting, it isn't original. A E038 casting date means your axle center section was cast in May of some year ending in 8: 68, 78, etc. No matter what - it isn't dated correctly for a late model 69.

You've got me confused on the axle. Is it a 10-bolt or 12-bolt, and to what axle do those numbers you've quoted apply to? If the axle isn't original then you've got nothing to go on with that line.

Rich

tk modesitt
Oct 18th, 00, 07:43 AM
RICH,
Thanks so much for all of your help.
I know I shouldn't be overly concerned
as to if it is or isn't a SS.I just want to
make sure one way or another. We are about to
begin the process of stripping it down to the
axles and rebuilding it. We have already done
the interior and some other things. I'm
trying to make sure of what I have, so when it's put back together it's done right.
In regard to the axle it is a 10 bolt. They
said it did have the orig. 12 bolt, but they
changed it out.The casting #'s that we gave
was off of the 10 bolt.Any other suggestions.
And once again THANKS for all of the HELP.

Rich Fields
Oct 19th, 00, 04:46 AM
None of the data so far is definitive. Let me summarize and you can tell me if this is accurate.

You've got SS emblems, SS hood springs, a V8 VIN, a Norwood X11 code, front discs, factory dual exhausts. These are all signs of SS-ness, but the first two are easy replacements, and last four aren't unique to SS, as they indicate features that were available on non-SS cars.

You don't have any documentation, your tire sticker is gone, your engine and rear axle are gone, your tranny is a powerglide, and your fuel line isn't original.

A previous owner claims it was a SS, and that it originally had a 12-bolt, but that and 50 cents might buy you a cup of coffee.

At the moment - without more data - you're in limbo. You can't prove it was a SS, but it can't be proven that it wasn't a SS.

Rich

tk modesitt
Oct 19th, 00, 08:27 AM
Rich,
You are correct.We are going to keep
searching. Also could there be any #'s
along the frame anywhere.I don't know if
this will help or not, I forgot it does have a cowlinduction hood. From what I can tell it has never been removed, but I could be wrong.
THANKS AGAIN !!


[This message has been edited by tk modesitt (edited 10-19-2000).]

Michael Lerer
Oct 19th, 00, 09:54 AM
Here is some food for thought. I have a 69 RS Conv. ALL #s matching 350 engine,powerglide trans and 12 bolt rear with mult-leaf suspension. Factory AC, PS, PWR top. It is also an early production Norwood car with NO "X" codes. Back then anyhting is possible..
Good Luck!!

Rich Fields
Oct 21st, 00, 03:44 AM
Michael:

At the risk of extending this thread longer than it warrants, I can't figure out what your point is. Sounds like you've got a nice car, but I don't understand the relevance to the man's question. His problem is that he doesn't have enough data to determine his original vehicle configuration.

Is your point that you've got a non-SS car with SS-like equipment? If you've got an early 69 Norwood car, then, as you probably know, there would be no X-code. A non-SS car that fits your description is the LM1 350ci (non-SS) 4-barrel (low compression) engine. This configuration had dual fuel lines and 12-bolt multi-leafs. This is a documented factory configuration - not an "anything is possible" situation.

Generally, anything is *not* possible. The factory didn't build cars willy-nilly, and the rare examples of unusual non-normative builds can generally be traced to a specific reason.

The "anything is possible" line tends to give people with modified or undocumentable cars false hope, and it is rarely, if ever, true. What is true is that we don't yet know everything that Chevrolet did with the Camaro. But when we find out that Chevy built a given configuration, we've learned that they did it with a plan and purpose, and did it consistently within their production parameters.

Rich