Ok heres my dilema. I have a rear brake proportioning valve, 4 Leaf/Multi-Leaf, and a EA 10 Bolt. The transmission is a Muncie M20. No protecto or manual. The engine code is V0627KL. (67 Impala SS 327/275 made in June). I have 4 drum brakes which makes me believe that it was originally a L30/M20. Did Flint sometimes take engines marked for other cars and put them in the Camaro. I think this is going to remain a mystery. Oh the tire sticker in the glove box reads: 7.3 something and its ripped after the 3. Then, 26, 28 Cold, 30, 34 Hot. Thats all I could get off that.

What is the location of the proportioning valve?

Its snowing here snake...yes snowing. Thank the big guy that the roads are warm from the sun today and they arent dumping salt. So when it dries out, I'll take off the car cover and slide underneath and answer that, but off memory I think it was centered slightly to the passenger side forward of the gas tank. I'll confirm that tomorrow
www.geocities.com/macgse/68CamaroRS.html (http://www.geocities.com/macgse/68CamaroRS.html)

Baby, I have the same questions regarding what GM did with leftover parts from previous years. I've been talking to other guys about this in gen tech. I've read articles & watched interviews with people who worked with GM back then. One thing that was pointed out was that if there were parts in stock from previous years they were used. GM wasn't going to throw away parts just because they were'nt # correct. As I mentioned before, my muncie is dated 66. My car was built early for 67. Nov. 66 as far as I can tell. As i understand it, all cars like mine (L30/M20) came with saginaws. But one could safely assume it has original trans by date code. As much as I hate using that *** out of U and ME word. Who knows for sure? Another thing I recently found out was employees ordering a new car could follow that car through the assembly line start to finish. Apparantly bolting on option combinations that were not available to public. Which I'm sure adds to the confusion of some of the cars out there. (like a 68 station wagon with a 427, air, tilt, 4-speed and power windows thats been found, all factory installed.) Interesting Huh! I'll just keep praying to the chevy gods for all the answers. See Ya!

For every rule, there is an exception! Since GM was in the business to make car and make money I'm sure they used almost all the old parts at the beginning of the next year before phasing in the new parts. That aside, I thought the L30/M20 combination was a 12 bolt rear with a Muncie 4 speed depending on the gear ratio ordered. Maybe Norwood and Van Nuys each did it differently.

Stevo, you need to talk with Rich Fields about your car. He's the L30/M20 expert. Every documented car has had a Saginaw so far.

Baby68RS, what's the trans code from your Muncie? Also, could you post your VIN, cowl tag, and rearend code?

For as much talk about exceptions, they generally didn't happen. Most cars came down the line like they were supposed to.

And you could order a 427 in any big car in 68. All those options were available if you ordered them.

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Kurt S.
www.camaros.org (http://www.camaros.org)

roger kurt...i have all that...im on my way out now but look for them tomorrow. later.

Hey Kurt, I e-mailed Rich Fields some info on my car. Have'nt heard anything yet. Sent him a photo also. One thing I wanted to bring up and forgot was the 5Y on cowl tag. It's located in same spot the 4 codes are on SS cars. I have seen alot of camaros with it though. Not sure what it means. My car is 67 RS, 275 H.P. 327, muncie 4-speed, 10 bolt posi/308:1, front disc without power.

Baby68rs; For what its worth, I,m looking at a book that shows the KL on the engine pad means the motor is a 327 out of a impala with a hyd.350,1967. The brake valve came on all 1967 camaros that had disc brakes. I own a L30/M20 conv.1967 that has disc brakes/manual. Hope this helps. David

I should have added below that the axle dates need to be confirmed, but the multi-leafs are not original to 67, so it seems like your axle may not be original either. You would need to examine your center section casting date, along with the application stamp. And if the engine has the code that was mentioned, then it is likely that your entire drivetrain has been replaced, making determination of the original configuration more difficult. Rich

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I replied to your email yesterday afternoon, asking for data. Can't say much without some hard data. However, if the tranny is a 66 tranny, then it is for a 66 model year. The year on a tranny stamp is the model year, not the calender year.

Have never seen a Muncie on a L30/M20. There is little that is impossible, but this is so highly improbable that I wouldn't believe it unless it was VIN stamped and appropriately date coded, and even then it would be a unique exception.

If you don't have the 2L 4-speed code on your cowl, then your car could even have been a 3-speed, and thus not a L30/M20 (rather, a L30/M15). Since your car was built in November (I believe you say above), the 10-bolt axle fits, as the early L30/M20s received 10-bolts. The change to 12-bolt didn't occur until circa January.

I'm working on an update to the L30/M20 article for the CRG site, but it is slow going with so many other things going on at the same time.

I'm assuming you know of the trim tag options data at http://www.camaros.org/numbers.shtml where the 5Y code, and others, are explained.

Rich Fields
Camaro Research Group


[This message has been edited by Rich Fields (edited 04-14-2000).]

Rich, just recieved your reply and went to site to figure out the 5Y on cowl tag. Looks like deluxe seat belts. I will get those casting dates to you ASAP. Today were taking her to redding, Cal. for big cruise & show. Will be back late sat. night, unless we do some street racing. Maybe it did have 3-speed. I just can't imagine how they got it rolling with 308:1 in it. I almost burned up my throwout bearing cruising last year with 4-speed. Of course wheel & tire combo is 27" high now. Maybe that's got something to do with it. Thanks Rich, will talk later.

I think that it is unlikely that I have L30/M20, and when I read all the reply's here and in other threads, I think its unlikely that all of them saying they have one, actually do. I hate to say it. But many people have to be mistaken, with 8000 or so that were produced in total. My engine is not a numbers match, just correct. My Muncie and rearend, leaf's, and differential are original. It is a 10Bolt Posi and I am guessing that the gears are high (all my power is over 30 miles per hour during normal driving). So if you can tell me why I have 4 Leaf's, proportioning valve, one gas line, and 10 Bolt Posi with 4 drums. Ya it works but as far as original options offered, its baffling. I think they pulled the engine and put the 327 in. It may have been an SS350 at one time, but what about not having front disk? LOL..the mystery!
www.geocities.com/macgse/68CamaroRS.html (http://www.geocities.com/macgse/68CamaroRS.html)

To add some more on your questions/comments:
Front disks were not required on anything in 68, except Z28. And all 68s had one gas line.
Rich

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I just realized that Baby68RS has a 68, while Steve was talking about a 67. Had to go to the link to see the photos to be sure,
though I guess I should have guessed from the screen name.

The proportioning valve that would be expected on a 68 L30/M20 is in the rear brake line under the driver's door. This isn't what I read is on your car.

The 4-leaf springs were used on Z28, and on L30/M20 with F41 suspension.

A 10-bolt 3.08 would be unusual with multi-leafs, in fact I've not ever seen it on a 68 L30/M20 or Z28. You'd have to post the stamp and casting date on it for us to have any meaningful discussion about it. You say it is stamped EA? I have no idea what that code is - it isn't in any of our axle code tables for any of the Camaro first-gen years. All Camaro axle codes during this period have a first letter of B, P, or Q.

Rich Fields
Camaro Research Group


[This message has been edited by Rich Fields (edited 04-14-2000).]

Baby68RS, could that EA stamped on your axle tube be PA which would be 3.08 open.

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Bryan Shook
Favorite Quote - Some people have shrinks. Some people have their garage.
My Father's 1968 RS 327! (http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Speedway/6673/camaro.html)
My First Generation Camaro site (http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Speedway/6673/firstgen.html)

68RS - you need to really post the #'s to see what is going on.

We have never seen an original 67-8 with a Muncie and a 10 bolt. Muncies went into the hi-po models and they all got 12 bolts.

Thanks!

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Kurt S.
www.camaros.org (http://www.camaros.org)

68RS I have had a very hectic week and just got some time to sit down at the keyboard.
I am curious about the proprtioning valve and four wheel drums. The valve I believe is only included on disc brake equiped cars. It would seem strange to me that the valve was added or the discs were swapped for drums.

Don't quote me on this...but I have a friend who's '69 Camaro has a rear Prop. valve and I believe he said it originally had 4 whl drum brakes. ???? I will ask him tomorrow.

Steve

Are you sure you guys are talking about a proportioning valve and not a distribution block?
My 67 has a block under the drivers side seat as well but I thought that was incase you had something take out your rear lines that you would still have brakes up front. Sort of like a surge protector.

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Tim
67 ss/rs, MODIFIED
www.geocities.com/sixt7ssrs/
AOL-IM - sixtsevnss

My fathers L30/M20 has 4 non power drum brakes. It has a block located directly below the master cylinder and also a prop valve located near the rear of the drivers side front subframe. It is is on the outer side of the subframe.

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Bryan Shook
Favorite Quote - Some people have shrinks. Some people have their garage.
My Father's 1968 RS 327! (http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Speedway/6673/camaro.html)
My First Generation Camaro site (http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Speedway/6673/firstgen.html)