I started installing the poly bushings and cross-shafts in the a-arms last night and got to thinking about the Guldstrand mod I did.

I know from reading here that because I chose to redrill the cross-shaft mounting holes that the alignment shims for the rear bolt will need to be trimmed in order to fit properly over the hump in the a-arm mount.
Or I think I've read where people have hammered that hump down a little to flatten the area out so that shims fit better. Either way, SOMETHING has to be done to that area.

My question is, what if NO shims are needed there? My cross-shafts hit that hump and won't mount flat against the shaft mount. Do I have no choice but to get the sledge out and hope my aim is on? ;)

Thanks.... I can't believe I'm actually opening boxes and INSTALLING things! Man those Prothane's look nice in my a-arms with new shafts! graemlins/hurray.gif

I'd be very surprised if you needed no shims. Even with the GW offset shafts, I have many in order to get 1* negative camber. No G mod but I think any kind of performance alignment is going to have enough shims you needn't worry.

I agree with Rick. I have not seen a Guldstrand Mod car that did not need rear shims. To get -1* and a bunch of castor you will need shims. For a street car on radial tires -1* is about right.

If you find that you don't need shims you can grind off a bit of the cross shaft where it hits the frame.

I trimmed the upper tower corners off to clear the stock A-arms. Aftermarket tubular arms require no tower mods.

Ok then... good to know. I wasn't aware of that fact. I'll count on providing the shop with lots of shims.

I thought about what you said Carl about grinding the edge of the cross-shaft last night, but that scared me. It would have to be close to .125" which SEEMS excessive to me. Maybe it's not really. But I guess that doesn't matter if shims are used. I'll play with it tonight and see just how many shims it takes to move the shaft away from that hump. Just purely out of curiousity.

I cut the towers also. I almost cried having to do something like that, but it's unavoidable if the whole tower isn't lowered. You can't really tell now anyway unless you KNOW what you're looking for.

At this point in the project, I'm starting to get nervous and nit-pick the tiniest details. Doing 100% of this car myself leaves a lot of grey areas that I'm just not familiar with. I wonder what people that aren't familiar with the two TC's, Pro-Touring, the Nova sites, etc. do when they have questions? ;)

Thanks for the heads-up guys!

Back to the arms themselves....

Without a press, and without being over-charged at a shop to press them in, what are some ways I can get the lower arm bushings in? They're wicked tight! Auto parts stores don't loan them.

I used a 2x4 between the legs on one of the upper arms and brought them together with the shaft. The other side went together like butter.

How about a length of all-thread and washers\nuts to pull them in? If that doesn't work, what else might work?

I justified buying a press!

Before I bought it, I put the lowers in using a long bolt, many washers and a large socket if I remember right. Some were pretty tight and I was standing on the arm with a piece of pipe over the rachet handle! What about a big vice?

I can't imagine a shop charging that much. Some times I used to get it done free at my local Saab place where I buy parts. They'd give it to a mechanic to do when they weren't busy.

Yeah, ya wouldn't think that a shop you've used many times with many vehicles would charge me at all! But when I told him it's only the bottoms and that they're halfway in already, he still quoted me an hour of labor. :rolleyes:

I'll go buy a huge socket. I'd forgotten about doing it that way. I already have some all-thread and a couple nice, hefty breaker bars.
I used a piece of 2x4 with a 1.25" hole cut in it to do one of the uppers. Worked perfectly. I just don't have a large enough hole saw to do the same for the larger lower bushing.

I've installed 4 sets of upper and lower A-arm bushings and leaf spring bushings (two convetional and two del-a-lum sets) using the bench vice. The leafs were REALLY hard to put in. I still joke with Torker that he broke my vice, but it still works OK.

Greasing the screw thread on the vice makes the job a bunch easier.

Use a large socket to press the bushing in and to use as a backing plate. A small piece of angle iron works to keep the lower arms from collapsing. Clamp the part as close to the center of the jaws as possible.

You will not need more than two short shims on each side.

Joe
if your gonna go to the flea market with the wife this weekend you are welcome to borrow my BJ press
Paul

Paul
Thanks for the offer but I'm exhausting my own feeble attempts first.

In fact, I "exhausted" my bench vice today. Snapped that baby right in two! I've been working out and I KNEW I was gaining some strength, but I didn't know I was THIS strong! Gotta find a stronger vice. :rolleyes:

The "loaner" ball joint press from AutoZone will work to install the lower bushings. Be sure to use a socket or piece of angle iron to keep from collapsing the side lips. You'll also need a piece of pipe or wood to keep the arms from collapsing (side to side).

Please consider that now might be the time to buy onna them cheap, Chinese, Harbor Freight Tool, 3/4" socket sets in the big red carry box for like $45 + shipping ...

If you use three 3/4" sockets, it will more then pay for itself imho b/c they cost like $12 or more from Sears as singles..

He, He!! AND you sure won't break the 3/4" ratchet busting loose stuck lugnuts...

pdq67

Randy, I called AutoZone and they either didn't know they had them, or they really don't. I'll try calling them again.... only a different store this time.

PDQ, they cost $14 and up at Sears. Plus tax. ;) That's what I've been using. The forward, lowers need at least a 1 7/8" socket to fit the bushing shell through. And that's cutting it close.
I picked up a beefier vice last night. Let's see how long this one lasts. graemlins/thumbsup.gif

Here's the link (http://www.autozone.com/servlet/UiBroker?ForwardPage=/az/in_our_stores/loan_a_tool/steering_suspension/ball_joint_press.jsp) on their website. I used an impact gun to run it up. Maybe not the best solution, but it worked. smile.gif

I've borrowed that style ball joint press from Autozone here to press universals out & in just a few weeks ago. So they should have it.

HwyStarJoe, I'm looking at doing the Guldstrand mod same way as you to my '72 Nova. I had the exact same questions as you before I did any drilling or cutting. My drivers side had no shims on the front and only one thin one on the rear.

Thanks guys for the question and answers before I even asked.

I wonder what people that aren't familiar with the two TC's, Pro-Touring, the Nova sites, etc. do when they have questions?Same thing we did before the internet. Those of us that are mechanically inclined would figure it out sooner or later. Although it may have taken some experimentation and we may have made a mistake or two along the way.

What get's me is the people who post a question, get a good answer, but it's not what they want to here. So they go ahead and do it wrong and then bitch when they have problems.

[ 06-18-2004, 08:09 PM: Message edited by: Pauls72 ]

Lawrenceville? I got a tattoo recolored there about 10 years ago. ;)

I hear ya Paul. Following the advice I've gotten here has never failed me yet.

I ended up taking the lower arms over to a friends friend this morning that's got one sweet shop at home. He pressed the shells in for me in about 20 seconds with his 25 Ton press. :cool:
This is him at Indy last week.... his crew is his wife!
http://img20.photobucket.com/albums/v59/HwyStar/Steve_at_Indy.jpg

HwyStarJoe,

Just a thought on your original topic of the first shim while you have it apart - what I did was grind the first shim to fit and then welded it on. Now I don't have to worry about the shop losing that shortened shim. After welding on the first shim I ground the hump slightly to be flat for a full size next shim. Have never had a problem with needing no shims.

Ray

Hey Ray, thanks....

When I assembled the front suspension this weekend, I found that without grinding or modifying either the edge of the shafts or that hump, the shims seemed to work just fine by letting them slide down over the shaft bolt as far as they could. The further away from the mount they got, the further down they'd fit over the bolt.
When I got to the second side, I ran out of shims which leaves a huge gap between the shaft and the mount. I put 3 shims on each bolt (until I ran out). One each of the 3 different thicknesses. I just did this to use them really. I haven't done a preliminary alignment or anything yet. I'm sure they'll need to be moved around.

I guess what I'm getting at is I really didn't see an urgent need to trim a shim, or modify the edge of the shaft or the mount hump. Am I asking for trouble in that sooner or later the shims may work themselves loose by not sitting all the way down over the bolt? It achieves the same goal, and they're secure.

I forget the torque value offhand but I wouldn't think they'd work loose or you'd have bigger problems once the nuts are torqued down. But, when you get the final alignment done, you may find trimming of something necessary since all alignments aren't created equal.

The problem exists on the rear hole only and that side usually has a bunch of shimms on it if you use much caster in your alignment setup. I found a thick shim and trimmed that one shorter, I keep that one against the subframe. I did screw up once and put a different shim there and later the shimms all fell out while on an off-ramp? I can still hear the tinkle of the shimms as they hit the headers! At the time I had a big fat stack of shimms on the rear bolt.

If the engine is out it's a good idea to flatten the rear bolt area, it might take some heat and and a hammer.
David

Gotcha.... I have to do some paint touch-up on the frame anyway. I cringed a LOT while assembling everything because I KNEW I was gonna ruin the paint. No biggy.... :cool:

I put the shims in with the thickest against the mount, then worked my way out also. I'll do some modding and keep the shims that way.
Thanks!