Hi Guys,
Just got my 67 back from having the 327 rebuilt and it has now developed a new problem. It SEEMS that after driving it during the day and after it gets hot it will not start once it is shut off. I drove it yesterday to a restaurant, came back and tried to start it and it was dead. The interior lights come on, the radio works, the headlights come on, all electrical items function but it will not start.

I went back this morning to have it towed and it started right up. WHAT IS WRONG? Thanks in advance for any help.

Probably starter heat soak. Get a heat shield for it or get a mini starter.

yup, i had the same problem on mine. installed a heat shield, helped out a whole lot. may also want to think about a remote mount starter solenoid, i believe summit sells a kit. good luck.

Heat soak is more of a magazine myth. Problem is usually caused by:
An old worn solenoid or old battery cables in the car.

Actually it's not a myth John. When the windings get hot, their resistance increases and efficiency is greatly reduced. Also, as most things heat up, frictonal drag increases. But conductivity losses are the primary cause.

-dnult

The fella I bought my 69 RS had the same problem with the 327 he had just rebuilt for the RS at that time. Not the origional motor. He tried swapping out the starter, voltage regulator, alternater and even replaces the battery and cables. Seemed that it started fine when it was cool and ran like gangbusters. But when it got up to operating temperature and was shut off, it wouldn't start. Just dragged when kickin er over. But it started up fine with a jump in that condition so he cut me another $50.00 off the purchase. Gusee what I found was wrong?............................................ .................................................. ...........hmmmm!!!!!!!........................sti ll thinking?.....scratchin my head and still thinking.......................................... .OK! The distributor was 180 off. YEP ! Restabbed it and set the fireing order. Vola!!!
Iz waz a happy smile.gif new owner of ARADRS. Woohoo!!!


camsdad
AKA
ARADRS

I have to believe that John Muha is right about this. If heat sink is the problem caused by windings losing conductivity... that would happen the very first time a car was driven off of the show room floor. graemlins/clonk.gif The problem only seems to happen years later which indicates more of a wear or fatigue problem. Kevin
--------------------------------------------------
68SS 396/375 L-78

I think heat soak comes more from the addition of headers, and the way the header goes by the starter. Mine was almost resting on the starter before I changed to a mini starter.

Yup! Headers it is. Makes a huge difference.

-dnult

BTW later after my wife blew up that 327 motor, she has 2 driving pedal to the metal modes, fast and faster. graemlins/waving.gif LOL! So I rebuilt it as a HP 355CID (Has large crank journals). Then I experienced the hot start problems. Like others, the headers were the culprits. A starter heat shield and a remote solenoid solved the problem for me.

Camsdad
AKA
ARADRS

The Ford remote starter relay will probably fix it.

The problem is made worse by voltage drops in the factory wiring harness. The ignition switch, clutch/nutral safety switch, fusebox terminals, numerous soldered, twisted or "black tape" wiring repairs all contribute to the voltage drops. By the time you add in the extra heat from the headers to the solenoid windings which increases the voltage requirements, you have dropped too much voltage to get the GM solenoid to pull in.

The test to see if it will help is to use a screwdriver across the starter wiring terminals to see if it will engage the starter when turning the key will not work. If you can get it to crank using a screwdriver, a Ford remote starter relay will help.

I installed a Moroso heat shield on my 302 a few weeks ago and it is not helping the hot engine starting problem. The Ford starter relay will be going in when it comes back from the paint shop.

Here is one way to wire it but there are others. You first run the factory purple wire (that used to be connected to the starter) to the "S" terminal on a grounded Ford relay. Then run a jumper wire from the fat battery wire connection on the starter to one of the fat terminals on the Ford relay(leave the battery cable connected to the starter). The other fat terminal on the Ford relay gets a jumper to the "S" terminal on the GM stater (where the purple wire used to be connected). These 2 jumpers need not be any heavier gauge than the GM purple wire. Now when you turn the key, the juice will flow to the Ford relay which will then send a full 12V to the starter, which will be enough voltage to pull the GM solenoid in, causing the starter to crank and away you go. smile.gif

The key to this is that the Little Ford relay requires far less voltage to energize as compared to a hot GM starter solenoid and the relay allows you to bypass the numerous voltage drops in the vehicles electrical system and send a full 12V to the solenoid. Sort of a "band-aid" solution but much cheaper than an aftermarket mini starter which is just a different, more expensive "band-aid" solution. :D Either one works.

-Mark.

Newbee here,but been around a long time,Have owned and built a lot of camaros.

I`ve used the ford solenoid several times, and it works very well. hth.

Troy,

I had the same problem on a p/u with headers. Would never start hot unless i jumped with a screw driver. A friend of mine told me GM realized they had a problem and the solution was a weaker spring in the starter solenoid. I got one ,put it in and the starter worked fine ever since, even in Phoenix in the summer! :rolleyes:

OK maybe the headers cause a big problem for some depending on the design of the headers. BUT... do we have to keep using four letter "F" words???LOL FOR....FO.. I just cant!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

fords got the trucks and gm has the cars!!!

GM realized they had a problem and the solution was a weaker spring in the starter solenoid Really?!?! That sounds like it could work. And to think I fixed it with a mini starter and all I needed was a weaker spring. I'll have to try that in the next car I do.....Although there's nothing like jumping in the camaro at the gas station with everyone watching you and having to "jump" the starter with a screwdriver because the damn thing won't turnover!! :D

Camsdad, your initial problem was most likely a timing problem. If your distributor was in 180 off it wouldn't run at all. Unless of course the plug wires were all moved 180 too. But that wouldn't change anything.

I had the same problem after rebuilding my 327 and turned out that the cylinders were bored incorrectly and the pistons were too tight in the bore. When the engine warmed up, the pistons expanded a bit and it wouldn't want to start. After a few thousand miles it got better and better