I'm just curious why the custom tranny shops say they can build a 700R4 to take some higher hp up to 650 or more and everyone else says they cant take it? Also why can a 200R4 take it but the 700R4 cant? I'm just kinda stumped.
Thanks,
Mike

Mike,
There are aftermarket parts that can make the 200-4R strong. Billet parts etc...

Call around your area and ask the shops if they can build you a 700r4 to handle your power and ask to see if they will give you a warranty. I am willing to bet none of them will go for that. I know of one guy that had good power (ran in the 11's) and had a 700r4. He is a memeber of this board (onovakind67). He said the trick was to not shift it manually, let it shift on it's own. Other than him I have yet to see another fast car with a 700r4 in it and have it live. I am no tranny expert, I am only relaying what I have learned over the years. I know people have tried and tried to make them live. I think there was a thread here a year or two ago about a guy REALLY trying to get one to live. He was tearing them up pretty regularly. When I went to have one built the guy said NO I won't even build one for you.

I got a 700R4 in mine. Tim at G&L Garage builds them regularly for high HP applications. He showed me how he does it and guaranteed it. If you Email me I can give his # and you can talk with him, he's busy busy guy but he could probably put one together for you or tell you what is needed.

The 700 is limited by a few things. One is billet parts; everyone developed them for the 2004R but the 700 doesn't have as much available. Also, they have an inherit problem with the timing of the WOT 3-4 shift; it takes too long to make the shift and they haven't found a way to quicken that as the problem is in the basic design of the trans. So that' s one of the first things to go with a lot of power.

You can make them live with a fair amount of power, but they cannot keep up with the 2004R or 4L80-E when you start talking big power. I had a 2004R built by Performance Trans behind my ProCharged 540. Even at 828+ rwhp it never hurt a single piece in the trans, even after many full throttle converter locked dyno pulls. The converter eventually died, but the trans was still perfect. It did have all the billet bells and whistles though.

Jody

There is an article in Chevy Hiperformance this month about building a 700R4.They went to B&M to have one built they said 450ft. Lbs of torque is max.

Jody,
I was talking with Steve at Bow Tie and he told me they can build a 7ooR4 to take the power a 200 can? Is this possible? My problem is I'm all set up to do the 700r and did not really want to change over again. Hell maybe I should? I have read the Chevy HiPo but I never had had real good luck with B&M ran some a few years ago. I'm in with Bow Tie as were working on this issue as they built the tranny 3 years ago but at the time 450 was max now their saying 640+ is this possible?

Jody,
I was talking with Steve at Bow Tie and he told me they can build a 7ooR4 to take the power a 200 can? Is this possible? My problem is I'm all set up to do the 700r and did not really want to change over again. Hell maybe I should? I have read the Chevy HiPo but I never had had real good luck with B&M ran some a few years ago. I'm in with Bow Tie as were working on this issue as they built the tranny 3 years ago but at the time 450 was max now their saying 640+ is this possible?


He CANNOT build a 700 to handle the power/torque of a fully built 2004R. Won't happen. Now he may be able to build a 700 that can handle your power range, depending on what that is.

Jody

So then their kinda full of crap huh??? I'm just thinking before I go further maybe I should go 200R, other than a new crossmember and driveline what else would I need to go? I already have the 700R so that should be it?? That kinda really irritates me they say they can do that. I sure dont want to go down this road again, I'm putting out about 450 without the blue button, with about another 125? But this winter I'm planning on going with a 427 small block from World.Thanks for all your help!
Mike

Maybe he means he can build a 700 that can handle as much as HIS 2004R. If he thinks he can build one that stands up to the abuse that the premier 2004R builders can, then he is not up to date at all. Then again, they think they have a crossmember for a 4L80E that fits a 67-69 Camaro; suffice it to say I don't think they have an idea where a 4L80E has it's trans mount, this thing is off by a good 8"!!!!!

Jody

If you are allready set up for a 700r4, I would talk to some people, and get them to put a warranty on one, and keep the 700r4. I have one, put only about 350 HP. Good Luck !

Claiming to be able to do something and actually doing it are two different things. Like I said before call around and get a warranty. I am willing to bet you will not find anyone that will warranty a 700r4 in a high HP application. Get the warranty in writing. Maybe we need to define what "high HP" is. They will live fine behind a 350HP small block. I would not trust one in anything with 425-450HP or any high torque situation. If you drive it very tame all the time it will live. If you plan to hammer on it regularly, you can forget it.

I tried desperately to keep that old thread alive HOPING, JUST HOPING somebody woulda broke enough of them that he figured out HOW to do IT!!

Didn't happen b/c the guy got rid of his car or something like that..

The guy wanted a bullet-proof 600/700+hp 700-R4 that could be down-shifted two gears under NOS JUST to burn his tires while cruising car shows!!! And I think he might have mentioned like his TH400 could withstand but MY memory might be wrong here on the 400??

pdq67

My brother has a 700R-4 in his monte carlo which we drag race through out are whole race season here. his engine dyno'd at 460hp and 440ftlbs of torque and we have run it for 2 seasons already with no problems it was built by a local guy here with tons of drag race trans experience it was $1400 plus core. And my friend has the same trans in his cutlass that dynoed at 580hp at the wheels! and he has had no problems So we have a good trans guy out here thats forsure. :thumbsup:

Well I guess I just dont have the patience or perserverance to try another 700R4 to many nay sayers, Soooooo, I went out and ordered a CPT 200R4 today hope to be back on the road by Friday with the ability to hammer it, I mean if I have to baby this car I might as well have built a trailer queen?? Like I tell everyone I built this car to drive, and to be driven hard sometimes. I just really dont like the fact that it broke on a simple downshift from 4th to 3rd at about 60 or so. Kinda like Jesse james says "if you cant hear it before you see it whats the use????"

IMHO, that's what I like about sticks!!

I blow one up, I fix it myself!!

Blow it up again... I fix it again.......................

Now, I just need a cheap one that can stand at least 580T!!!

pdq67

Is the CPT 200r4 for the guys in Sac?? Bruce at Extreme?? They build some SICK 2004r's. Good luck and keep us posted. Oh ..what converter did you do with?? Manual or standard valve body??

Talk to A&Reds transmission in Wichita, Kansas: http://inter800.com/pages/08351007.htm

They machine a lot of their own special valve body parts and can supply parts to build a 700R4 that can hold up to just about anything. They're the most knowlegable tranny people I have ever dealt with, especially when it comes to GM automatic overdrives.

Nathan

An interesting article on the 700R4

http://www.drwtransmission.com/4L60E.htm

Al,
Great article!!!! The first part would be funny if I had'nt been there! I must agree instead of trying to fix and make the 700R4 work I bailed and went 200-4R. Go ahead call me chicken guys but it is embarressing sitting on the side of the road. Waiting for a trailer. Plus I built the car to drive not ride a trailer.
Mike

Good choice, Mike. I think you'll be happy, and you'll like the better gear spacing, too. Is CPT the Bruce Toelle outfit? If so, he's one of the top 2004R guys in the country. If I was running huge horsepower, he's one I'd consider. I hope my BTOD unit holds up behind my 450ish 383. So far so good

WE4, Bruce..

pdq67

My 700r has about9000 miles with no prob.

BPOS, No CPT is the original and real Art Carr. Hes in Cali, Art Carr transmissions is in Texas. He sold Art Carr but you know how these guys are they cant stay out of it for long so he has turned his attention to 200-4R's.
My BTO went a incredible 1900 miles I also now know that a 700R4 cant handle power I'm pushing about 425 horses. What gets me is all these companies advertising 700 horse 700R4s what ever happened to truth in advertising?

Taking NOTHING away from Bruce, this is why I say "the REAL ART CARR"..

Only b/c I had read/heard about the guy for a lotta years..

Btt warrantee deal, I figure it is b/c some guys can break a hammer and avil!!

A guy may think he is say 425hp and maybe he is producing 525hp on a warranted 450hp tranny sorta deal.. Plus, you know, "I only hit it once with the 175hp pills in the NOS!!"......

pdq67

PDQ, Whos Bruce? No I went with Art Carr after many reccomendations plus I have read enough about the negatives of the 700R4 I just didnt want to take the risk. As far as the engine it is 425 max, based on Desk Top Dyno but we know its less. I'm running a Holley Comander 950 MPI and as of yet I have not even had it tuned completely so I havent even had a chance to get to its full potential. When we dynoed it, that was with a Holley 750. I have not even hit the button. Crap the bottle isnt even in it yet. I'm still trying to get the 950 dialed in. Thats what is the irritant is that it isnt even dialed in or broke in?????
Mike

This guy is one of the 200-4R guru's....., and the Bruce that we were speaking of:

http://www.ptsnctb.com/

Bruce is a very sharp fellow on the 200-4r.

We have done some testing with crogenic treatment of 700 parts. You must start with quality parts , not parts that have 100k miles on them. The parts have not broken.... yet

Tony,
Who are you with? I have this failed Bow Tie 700R4 that I want to get redone if possible for another project.

Dennis, If you read this how has your 700R4 held up behind your 383? Also who built it?
Thanks,
Mike

What is the Real Art Carrs web address?
Thanks,
John
Montana

http://www.cpttransmission.com/

I have a few questions on this thread. My car (1968 Camaro w/327) has a 700R4 and I don't race it. This trans. has supposedly been "tricked up" internally. Is this a good trans for cruising? I mean will it hold up without any problems? It is great for mileage when in OD. My second question is could I "easily" switch out this trans for a 2004R? Will my current cross member work as well as the current drive shaft length?

PS: What I don't like about my 700R4 is it shifts hard-remember I said this car now is a cruiser? Is this due to the big diameter servo? If yes, can the servo be replaced with a smaller diameter assy? I checked the numbers and this trans. is out of an '84 IROC.

PS: What I don't like about my 700R4 is it shifts hard-remember I said this car now is a cruiser? Sounds like a B&M shift kit was installed. Not the way to go, blocked accumulators, oversize feed holes, bad news.

Anyone looking for a 700R4/4L60 that will hold up talk to Dana here:

http://www.700r4l60e.com/

Great guy to work with.

Bob.