Not sure what happened, but this site, which used to be great hang-out for owners and experts for first gens has changed to include all Camaros. No offense to 3rd and 4th gen owners, but there's very little these cars and car owners have in common with first gen cars and their owners...very little. In fact, I would feel more of connection to a 69 Mustang owner than a 98 Camaro owner. I'm sure I'm not the only one who would feel this way.

I currently have 3-4 new inquiries posted for first gens in the "Tech" section, and there's either no response or perhaps one respondent. 3-5 years ago, this was the best site for 67-69er's,..with real experts who were willing to help out a fellow first genner.

Even attempting a search is now too cumbersome because I must wade through all the post 1970 stuff, which is becoming the majority.

What happened?

Is there another site exclusive to first gen Camaros?

Please advise,..respectfully,

Wes Puckett
Austin, TX
aka, Straight-Line-69

This is still the best site for a 67-69. It has changed a bit due to upgrades and it takes a lil'bit to get used to. Maybe it was where your post was or how it was worded ?

This is still for sure the best place for first gen camaro owners. It's also one of few with a lot of regular, knowledgable members who are willing to help out anyone. The front page of this forum has never specified that it's for first-gen cars only, and when someone searches for anything "camaro" this site's near the top of the list, so a lot of people find us. I don't recall any recent posts going unanswered, but I'll for sure take a peek...

We have alot of members here that run late model engines and electronics in their first gens. We also have members here that own first gens and fourth gens. Fourth gens I think are an excellent modern muscle car and we can all learn something about them here. I welcome the other "camaros" to "Team Camaro".

This place is like a TV set you can skip over what you don't like. Now for your posts with no answers, it just happens that way sometimes. I think since the Hurricane there have not been many people here as they are doing other things and it also a holiday weekend. Aslo as stated above it might be how they are worded.

As an example, I asked a question one time and someone put in I think not many people are responding because they don't want to hurt your feelings. The question was about future values on a 4th gen and what people thought. After I posted that I would not have any hurt feelings and just wanted some opinions, the responces flowed in.............go figure, just a bunch of nice people trying to be nice.

Joe

This is definately the best camaro site around. I have seen questions about all gen camaro's, as well as questions even about Fords and Mopar's. There is a wealth of knowledable, good people here. As stated earlier, just weed through what you don't need and take what you do need, I would still guess that 90% of the interaction here is still related to 1st gens. Too much info is never a bad thing, I only wish I could return a part of the great knowledge I have gained from this site. The best part is it's FREE!! What could be better than that??

Wes - the others have touched on some valid points, let me add a little to what has been said. Other generation Camaro owners come here because there are not many quality sites where they can get help. I use to visit several 4th gen sites when I had my '96 and there are many with potential. The users that frequent them really drag them down with all the bs, korny talk by folks that have never worked on a car let alone a Camaro in their life. The few guys with some knowledge tend to get lost in the muck... I'd venture to say the same is true with 3rd gen forums, maybe more so as the 3rd gen is the Camaro a 16 yr old can afford... So when you see these 3rd and 4th gen owners posting here cut them some slack. Most of their user names standout telling me they have been on other sites where the young crowd prevail and they just didn't get any real help. In the spirit of wanting to help Camaro people the fact that we are a 1st gen site shouldn't stop us when other generation questions get posted and it has no connection to 1st gen questions not being answered...

As for your questions not being answered maybe nobody has an answer. I wouldn't like not getting an answer but I'd rather not get an answer than get 10 bs replies that don't help in the least. I'm going to pick on you for a second, I'm not putting you down by it, just offering observation that may help throw some light under the hood...

1> Your speedo question doesn't give a lot to go on, you say it's stuck at 65 and say the things you haven't done yet to trouble shoot it. Then you end with making it sound like it's going to be a bother on your part "6 hrs out of my weekend" Like I said, don't take this wrong but people like to help others that are interested and enjoy working on and fixing their cars.

2> Next the regulars get tired of typing or even cutting and pasting answers from topics that have been beat to death. I did a search on "proform" in the performance forum and found 132 threads...

3> In your Holley thread you started out kind of insulting the folks you went to first for help. That sends a message to folks here that will stop most from replying as if you don't like what they post you could insult them too. Just one more and I'll stop picking on you ;)

4> You had a great thread going on your headlight problem and and you just left everyone hanging... Did you fix the headlights? If you don't follow up with folks that too can impact if they want to help when you post other topics.

You won't find a group of folks more willing to help without a lot of bs and you won't find a group with more knowledge... Put the site to better use by using the search engine as well as reading what you post before posting it and making sure what you are asking is understandable and leave the negative snip-its out. Then be sure to followup so folks know the actual outcome of their efforts...

Sorry for picking on you a bit, Like I said, I'm not trying to put you down by it. Your message prompted me to look at your posts and the things I picked on seemed to really stand out.

Thanks to all for your input, but I'll hold to my opinion that this site, in it's current state, pales in comparison to what was served up 4-5 years ago. In efforts to please all, this site will please fewer. This site has been diluted and I'm positive folks with real first-gen knowledge have reduced their involvement.

Djd (Dennis),..thanks, but I disagree that the wording of my inquiries is the reason I'm not receiving responses. If I needed an opinion of what cam to run, I'd have received 30 responses from "experts" who basically want to tout the cam they use. But if I ask a very specific question, about a first gen part, system, or fix, it will often be ignored. "Expertise" suddenly disappears. Again, this was not the case years ago.

In response to your items:

1) "Not much to go on?"...please go back and review my inquiry regarding my speedo prob. Again, my speedo is stuck at 65, and I simply asked, do the needles on original speedo's get stuck?"...and "is there an easy fix"? Pretty simple,..yet, to date (inquiry posted 8/30), I've not received a single response and I contend this would not have happened years ago.

2) You say there are 132 previous "Proform" responses. Agreed,..I did the search. But none touched on the question I have. Again, please review my inquiry,..which basically asks about using the Proform main body on a 800 Holley. Since the Holley 800 has larger secondary venturii than the Proform main body, I simply asked, would there be a difference in flow and power? Again, a request for help has gone unanswered for a couple of days now.

3) My Holley post (secondary butterflies open to 85%),..again, please go back read my inquiry. I'd like to know how I've insulted "the folks I went to for help". I positioned myself as "knowing less about carburetion than the boys at Holley", then asked my question. Please explain how this is insulting to anybody?

4) My headlights,..I still don't have the problem conquered but I'm close,..I'm able to activate the hi-beams with a jumber from the switch,..so I'll post my findings asap. For the record, I did receive some good advice for this problem.

Lastly, review my "wipers, but no washers" in the troubleshooting section. Again, I had received no responses to this inquiry before I solved the prob a day or two later.

But I agree with 67 Convertible,..the price is right (free). But still I contend this site would attract much more first gen expertise and response, if it were a first gen site only.

Simply my opinion,..don't shoot me.

No shots fired, I understand what your saying. With more people around sometimes I think questions get lost in the shuffle. Sometimes people just might not have an answer. Keep postin, keep trying to solve your problems and keep helping others around here as this is what makes the site go around. If you don't like the other Gens no problems with me about that. Something else also. Some people just move on. I used to post at Team Chevelle alot. I had a 69 SS396 Chevelle until April of this year. I have been around that forum when it was more of a news page format back in 96 or 97. I had my 67 Camaro at the time also. When Team Camaro started up I was over here quickly. Over the years I have grown to more favor the Camaro site and Camaros and moved away from the Chevelle site. I am sure many others have done the same. We also have many people here that post and contribute that don't have First, second,third or fourth gens, they have Chevelles, GTO's or even Mustang's. It's a world in motion as is this site.

Joe

Wes - Sorry you feel so down on the site, you're intitled to your opinion. I took the time and posted what I did because I care not because I want to shoot you down. The site doesn't like to see anyone not get helped but we can't force answers out of folks.

I disagree on attracting more 1st expertise by not allowing other gen owners to use the site. I can only assume since you reference back 4-5 years ago that you lerked alot here before finally posting in Jan of '04. There are several sites that have started up in recent years, the supercar site, pro-touring and lateral-g to name 3 some of the folks that started out here have migrated on to those sites (none of which are generation or camaro specific) I've noticed the up swing of non-1st gen postings and like I said before, they come here because they arn't getting anywhere elsewhere. We certainly don't have any 3rd or 4th gen experts, mostly a member or two that owns a newer daily driver Camaro along with their 1st gens that help from time to time...

You can use google as well as anyone, find another forum or two and see what transpires. I wish you luck finding a better Camaro site with more experience than this one. I still think it's about how you say it more than what you say. You may not have intended this to be insulting to Holley but I read it that way... I'm sure the boys at Holley know a lot about carburetion, but... I read it as sarcastic like the folks that built the carb couldn't get it right...

Anyway, I'm sorry you are not getting the help you are looking for...

I'll add some input here. The site started as a Camaro site aimed at 67-69's but open to all, for the reasons mentioned. It's been growing and has become a nice place to visit so we are getting more and more questions about other years.

I agree with the comments that it's getting a bit mixed up and have plans to make some modifications so that, while we won't lose our 1st gen focus, we can provide a spot for tech questions (and easy searches) for other gens. I own a 02 now, so have an interest there as well. I've owned a number of camaros from various 'generations' and feel that we should not chase someone away just because they do not fit a specific year. Many of the issues discussed affect more than one group but you are correct, we need to segregate this information and that will be happening in the next few months.

The move to this new forum software, classifieds and such is allowing us the option to add some of these needed changes. Basically we never had the horsepower and top end to make this happen before.

We welcome input and thought. These feelings you (and others) may have are not being ignored, just delayed as time seems to go by so danged fast.

We will have our parts review section running next week though :)

Thanks. Things will be cool.
Al

just my 2 cents i think the people on here are EXTREMELY HELPFUL AND KNOWLEGEABLE (to me anyways i am soo bad at playin mechanic) so id like to thank all of you who post on my threads and help me out i get alot flak for being a stoner lol but i am what i am lol

Djd,..my handle 4-5 years ago was "Sleepy-69" but for some reason at some point, I could no longer log on as "Sleepy-69" and had to change to another name and passcode. Fyi.

It was about a year ago that this site started to be "found" more often by younger guys with newer cars. At that time, I actual expressed an opinion that maybe they didn't belong here, or if they did they shuold have their own special place ("go in the corner kid, you bother me...") The answer I recieved was that "this board is about helping people with thier cars, and these kids are the future of hot rodding." That gave me a lot to think about, and they are absolutely correct. A lot of people today who would like to enjoy cars as a hobby don't have fathers, uncles, or cousins who are into it, like many of us did 30 years ago. These kids, with their "affordable" rear drive V8 musclecars, and their desire to learn about them and "improve" them are the future of this sport. I kinda decided that every time the opportunity arises to help someone out, I will, even with a handle like "bluntz420"...lol.

btb, how many answers did you need to "bend the link till the secondary's open all the way" That is the one and only correct answer after all...

Agree,..I'd rather see our Utes in a 2nd, 3rd or 4th gen than a Honda or Nissan that's been "modified".

Here's the probelm.

First Gens were only built three years, at a total production of about 650,000 cars...of which less than half exists today (2% yearly attrition). Subsequent Camaro's (1970 and up) were built for 32 years and about 3-4 million cars were built, and I'd guess two-thirds of these cars are still around.

This site will easliy be taken over and first gen info will become more and difficult to search for, and first gen experts who are left will go elsewhere.

Again, simply my opinion.

As Al said, new sections are being planned to seperate the gen's better both for searching function and use by other gen owners. I think since the site owners have bent over backwards to help all camaro owners says alot, as well as open to ideas to make it function for all of us better. That also is being done. As long as we ALL help each other when we can, the site can only get better.
Best dang site out there for all of us in my humble opinion.

Agreed....
It's been beaten to death that this is THE best resource for First Gen owners.
It stands to reason that the other generations will want a piece of Team Camaro. :)
It's quite flattering, I'd say. If someone doesn't like what they're getting from one place, they're going to find a place where they do. Obviously THIS is the place.
:beers:
VIVA TEAM CAMARO!!

I like this site , and I am going to agree with SL69 , I have ALWAY'S held the regard that they made the last camaro in 1970 (IT WAS A LATE 69 CAUSE OF THE STRIKE) after that I feel it was disrespectfull to use the camaro name on other transportation (POST 1970 CAR'S ARE BASIC TRANSPORTATION FROM POINT A TO POINT B) this IS a great site but I would love to see it only be for camaro's and camaro owner's ,

one thing that get's me is why they did not make the mighty camaro a few more year's look at the chevy and gmc truck's the body style of those started in 67 alongside the camaro but the truck's ran all the way till 1972 ?? why did the camaro get cut short ??

IMO:
This is the best site for a first gen Camaro owner,future owner or just a buff.
Ive been to other sites,some sites make you feel if you dont have the coin you dont belong there.(something-g) I belong to my local camaro club which is more 3ed and 4th gen camaro,I think that theres about 3 people that have first gens thats visits the web site. But the club and site is open to all camaros.
I dont get the impression that theres a problem with this site, with its people in it and or its responding to threads.
I have also asked questions that took a liitle bit of time to reply to, I just thought it was: i didnt ask in the right prospective or it was a question that not too many people had knowlaged of.Someone will answer . Theres not too many question that has not been asked before that ya cant find in search.
I spend alot of time in the search in past threads for the knowlaged and just scanning. Maybe i can remember if i run into a problem with my car or someone else on this site lists a problem wanting tech information. Just because we (owners, future owners and buffs) of first gens camaros should not elect to reject other camaros cause all camaros are created equal.

As a newbie to this group, I have found the past threads extremely helpful. I hope to contribute where I can. While all things can be better, they can just as easily be worse... How did we all do this before the age of computers? The Knowledge was there, however the "average Joe" had limited access if any. This forum and others are a wealth of knowledge and will encourage others to share this great hobby. :beers:

I agree with straight-line-69 to a point and will back up everyone else that has posted on this subject as well. What I have found is to be patient and wait. While your waiting try to figure out how to fix your problem. You'll be surprised that "YOU CAN DO IT" when it's fixed.

I'm not here a lot for the reason that I like the challenge of finding the answer to a problem without help, but, when I need help I usually stop in to T.C. and type away. It is frustrating at times when you do need an answer, knowing very well that someone on T.C. can answer it, but no one responds. For example, I started a project where I replaced my heater core in my Z a couple of weeks ago. I got some really good responses to that post (and a lot of members viewed it), but when I asked about how long the heater hoses are supposed to be for a 69 Z28, I got zip (and a lot of members viewed the post). I eventually e-mailed John Hinckley (JohnZ) at his home to find the answer I needed. Now, I know there are some Z owners here on T.C. that have completed cars I could have gotten an answer from, but no one chose to respond. Why, I don't know, unless there are no 69 Z28 owners, but I find that hard to believe in any case. Anyway, I think it depends on the moment. If you don't want to reply, you can't be made to. Just be patient, pick up some reading material that you may have that can help with your project or what have you and see what you can do on your own.

I sincerly hope I haven't stepped on anyones toe's here on T.C.

:thumbsup:

This is still the site for 1st gens. But after all, its called Team Camaro, not Team 1st Gen Camaro. If someone is really into camaros, chances are its not just narrowed down to a certain gen. Now when questions get posted here about the later cars, they can either be answered by someone here, or are referred to the other gen-specific sites, such as nasty, which I consider the 2nd gen equivalent to this site.

As far as questions not getting answered, its not because people here dont care. Its just because no one has an answer or just that someone that has an answer missed the thread. If they did, they would provide their insight. Myself, I help out with anything I can or have had experience with. Ive been on several other forum sites, and this one is the best as far as having really good, informative, down to earth people that are more than willing to help, no matter how "dumb" the question may be. We've been there before, and could only wish we had this kind of access to information and advice.

With the young generation of "kids" (which I guess Im included in), whats wrong with them wanting to learn? Sure theres plenty out there that only want to talk trash, but they are weeded out as easy as a bad trim tag on this site. I dont see anyone here allowing that type of stuff here.

69Z28: as far as youre question on heater hose length, the best way is to set them in place where theyre gonna be, and cut to length. Cut em a couple inches long to start until you get what you want. I dont install them until the inner fenders and engine are in place, in order to fit the engine and the bracket on the inner fender with the right curvature.

dave

69Z28: as far as youre question on heater hose length, the best way is to set them in place where theyre gonna be, and cut to length. Cut em a couple inches long to start until you get what you want. I dont install them until the inner fenders and engine are in place, in order to fit the engine and the bracket on the inner fender with the right curvature.

Dave, I already have it done. I needed to know length so I could go to the local parts house when I was ready and just say Hey dude, I need hose such and such 60" long. The problem was I wasn't about to guess what length I needed and end up being too short. That's plain just a waste of money. So I asked for specifics and didn't receive an answer until I e-mailed JohnZ. He responded right away. He's the man. But you know...He's probably really busy with stuff and it would have been easier if I did get the answer from T.C. You know what I mean? No problem though...if you don't get an answer, you go somewhere else.

:beers:

As a third gen owner myself, im dissapointed to hear you feel that way. I Know that the first gen is a rare breed, but what i think is A CAMARO IS A CAMARO and thats the way its going to be regardless of the year, yes the first gen is the heritage of the camaro, but you cant deny that camaros kick ***, no matter what year they are. Thats just my two cents though.

Cudos for voicing your opinion though,
Nick

My $0.02, and to drive a previously mentioned point home a little further:

The difference between this board and many others is that people on here are willing to help and supply good information without a lot of BS. A lot of late model boards that have potential are brought down by a bunch of younger kids that want to do nothing except run their mouth and flex their e-muscles. I know of one or two good late model boards, the rest are not really worth the time. Too much drama and not enough furthering of the hobby.

Here's a possiblilty,..since there were 3-4 million Camaros built after 1969, the first gen info on this sight will become more and more marginalized. And the first gen car owners will find less use for this site. It's already happening.

If somebody set up a First Gen site only, and used this same formatting (also shared by chevelles.com and corvetteforum.com), this current site could sadly lose out.

Here's a suggestion. Since it's decided to please all, there needs to be demarcation between the generations. In esssence, have four different site-mappings, one for each generation of the Camaro.

For an exapmle, check out the corvetteforum.com. At the very top, you're asked to click from a drop down that includes the different Corvette generations, C1, C2, C3, etc. As a Vette owner, this site is hands down easier and quicker to use than the TC site.

Again, merely the opinion of an old man,
Straight-Line-69

Is there no way to have a check box that gives year or generation in question on the post so that you could filter your search? Also, I am getting used to the new format, but I still find the search a little restrictive in that you can't get any result on a two letter string. That's fine for "it", or "an", or "or", but what about "67", "68", "69", etc.? Many guys don't ever type the "19" in the front so you can't type in "1967" (it's our own little Y2K problem) is there any way to make an exception for number strings, or even specifically the year combos from "67" - "02"?

Just a suggestion, but this is still the best Camaro forum by far, and like someone else said... I sure can't argue with the price.

Here's a possiblilty,..since there were 3-4 million Camaros built after 1969, the first gen info on this sight will become more and more marginalized. And the first gen car owners will find less use for this site. It's already happening.

If somebody set up a First Gen site only, and used this same formatting (also shared by chevelles.com and corvetteforum.com), this current site could sadly lose out.


As was stated by WildBill, the difference in this site is our people. There are 3-500 quality people, firstgens fans first, but total car nuts all, who are here weekly or even daily. People who help anyone they can, give opinions, solve problems, and make friends. For those who show up here once a year looking for a quick answer, you usually recieve it, and quickly, but our core group here goes way beyond that. I don't think we're going anywhere else anytime soon.

I`m normally on a Vette site where old Camaros are a afterthought. So I came over here where I might find some friendly early Camaro people. :thumbsup:

I agree Jim, and welcome aboard Ironcross!

As was stated by WildBill, the difference in this site is our people. There are 3-500 quality people, firstgens fans first, but total car nuts all, who are here weekly or even daily. People who help anyone they can, give opinions, solve problems, and make friends. For those who show up here once a year looking for a quick answer, you usually recieve it, and quickly, but our core group here goes way beyond that. I don't think we're going anywhere else anytime soon.

I completely agree, Jim :thumbsup: Doesnt matter what kind of cars we're into (of course mostly 1st gens here), we're "car guys". Between all of us as a group, we've been there before, having come across and experienced pretty much everything, and we're willing to help out our fellow "car guys".

dave