I'm trying to pick out the right cam for my combo using the following assumptions - this will be a 93 octane pump gas engine in a 3200 lb Camaro driven on the street 99% of the time. My goals are still 550/550 at the flywheel.

I was looking at the comp cams 12-770-8 which has .564 max intake lift, duration 236@050 and 274@015 and intake closes at 63* ABDC. Estimated static CR would be approx 10.3 and dynamic CR around 8.4 with a cranking pressure of 168 - if I'm doing the math correctly!

I guess I'm looking for some advice on cam selection and also power estimates - are my goals reasonable and what are some other cam choices out there for this combo.

Thanks in advance..here you go:

4.155 bore with SRP forged -5 cc dished piston
3.75 eagle crank and 6.0 eagle rod
871 block studded mains and improved oil passages
completely balanced rotating assembly
piston measured .006 below deck and will use .032 gasket
vic jr. intake and holley 750 or 850 DP carb
didn't get the aluminum heads yet but assume 76cc comb chambers
also assume heads will flow 275 cfm at 575 max lift (like AFR 210)
M21 4-speed and 3.73 rear gears
solid flat tappet or roller cam with 1.6 RR's
1 3/4 hooker header and 2 1/2 inch exhaust with 40 series muffler

Hey Dave, here's the spec's on my 406. This was the actual sales ad from the engine builder who built and dynoed the engine.

406" SBC roller engine. 1972 Chevrolet #511 400 block with 4-bolt mains. 40 minutes dyno time only on entire engine. Line honed, honed with deck plates, decked to .000", new cam bearings and freeze plugs. Stock, GM 400 cast crank cross drilled, shot peened, and polished. GM 5.7" "pink" rods shot peened and reworked. ARP main bolts, rod bolts, and head bolts. Wiseco forged pistons and file to fit rings. All Clevite bearings, rotating assembly completely internally balanced. Stainless steel fasteners used externally. Moroso oil pump and welded pickup. ARP oil pump stud kit. Moroso 7-quart low profile oil pan. AFR 190 cc aluminum cylinder heads with 2.02/1.60 stainless swirl polished valves. CNC ported by Air Flow Research. Comp Cams #986-16 double roller springs with dampers, 10 degree locks and retainers. Comp Cams XR288HR hydraulic roller cam, .520/.540 lift with 236/242 @ .050", Comp Cams hydraulic roller lifters. Trick Flow chromoley pushrods, Harland Sharp 1.5 full roller rockers. AFR "Hydra-Rev" rev kit installed. Comp Cams true roller timing set. Roller thrust bearing, roller bearing between cam gear and block. SFI approved 168 tooth flexplate, indexed balancer. Weiand aluminum water pump, Moroso electric water pump drive. Edelbrock Performer RPM Air-Gap intake manifold with HVH "super-sucker" 1" carburetor spacer. Chrome fuel-pump block off plate, thermostat housing, dipstick, and tall Chevrolet valve covers with breathers and t-handles. Also including a new set of Hooker #2116 Super Competition 1 ¾" headers. This engine makes 10.45:1 compression and runs on 92 octane pump gas. Made 519 horsepower at 5500 rpm and 544 ft/lbs. of torque at 4500 rpm. Made 513 ft/lbs. of torque at only 3000 rpm.

I'm not running the electric water pump or fuel pump with my car nor the 1" carb spacer. I would think your combination would be real close to your goal of 550/550! This should be an awsome street ride!!

I would assume you'd be close to your goals as well. What's the part # and brand of head gasket you are using? I searched high and low for a gasket less the .039 for my 406 and without custom ordering, I couldn't. If you did, I'd love to know so I can use it!!

550#ft of torque will require a BMEP of about 205, a pretty tall order for a street car.

Dont think its gonna happen with that small a cam, beyond 500hp you gotta stick some
cam in it. Also HP950 would help at that power level. A good set of ported heads, somthing
like a Brodix T1s with 208/160s. And 550hp is going to get choked with a 2 1/2" exhaust,
3" will get the job done. Also dont forget a good fuel system. If you dont take care of
these things, then this motor will go real fast from 550hp to 450hp.

Heres a combo that made 550+hp, and ran 10.0s @ 132 in a 2900lbs Luv truck:

Pump gas 406
11:1
HP950
Brodix intake
Ported Track 1s (307/224)
Comp 255/260 solid roller
1 7/8" headers w/ 3 1/2" exhaust.

It also went 5.71 in the 1/8 mile on a 225hp shot of gas, which is equal to 8.90s

Not saying you need to go this radical, but close to get an honest 550hp, which will put
you deep in the 10s at 3200lbs if your ride hoks well. Also check out Eric68s combo, as
hes makin close to that power.

i agree i think you need more cam and more head work .you should be close to 300cfm at or near 600 lift.concentrate all efforts on intake side .clean up plenum in intake and perform deep port match at intake sealing face in manifold at the very minimum. also i think 1-3/4 header will make more bottom end torque in your application ,and if you go with any head have it checked , ported. most aftermarket heads wont flow what there advertised at. also with a good aftermarket head why run split pattern cam?thats so 70's thinking:) . you'll probably make more power with single pattern, espcially if your not running nos or forced induction.if anything id run more intake duration/lift:thumbsup:

What's the part # and brand of head gasket you are using? the .032 I found is an SCE Pro Copper Head Gasket PN SCE-011153 on summit.com

Dont think its gonna happen with that small a cam, beyond 500hp you gotta stick some cam in it. Also HP950 would help at that power level. A good set of ported heads, somthing like a Brodix T1s with 208/160s. And 550hp is going to get choked with a 2 1/2" exhaust, 3" will get the job done.that's exactly why I need help pickin a cam...I was hoping for some cam suggestions in this thread..I was thinking AFR210 head..I will definitely be going 2 1/2 exhaust and 1 3/4 header..budget restricted ya know

i agree i think you need more cam and more head work. you should be close to 300cfm at or near 600 lift.concentrate all efforts on intake side .clean up plenum in intake and perform deep port match at intake sealing face in manifold at the very minimum. also i think 1-3/4 header will make more bottom end torque in your application ,and if you go with any head have it checked, ported.thanks how bout the AFR210's??

Please tell me that a 3" exhaust isnt gonna cost much more then a 2 1/2", because it will make a bunch more power with a 3". I've seen 1/2 second and 5mph difference by swithing from 2 1/2" to 3" exhaust on a 500+ hp BBC in a 70 chevelle that ran mid 11s. Spend the money on a good exhaust - 50hp loss is a bunch.
Heres the problem I see all the time with peoples combos, they miss the details:
Poor exhaust, stock fuel system, crappy carb/intake, poor/small air filter, cheap stall, poor suspention/tires. And what could have been a 500+ hp engine ends up maybe 400hp and there car runs 12s. All I'm saying is pay attention to the detail...

To make around 550hp, you'll need a cam with around 250duration, I'd also bump the comp. some - close to 11:1. 1.6 rockers to get all the lift yu can on the intake. If youre gonna run a choked up exhaust do a split pattern cam with more dur. on the exhaust, that will help.

Sooper Dave, I think my engine is pretty close to 550 HP and probably 520 'ish on TQ. I am at 11.1:1 compression and use a Comp solid roller 250/254 @ .050 on a 108* LSA. Might be a bit much for a 99% street combo.

I think similar specs with a solid FT cam would make closer to 525HP/500TQ if everything was perfect. I think the AFR 210's would be perfect. I am running Edelbrock Vic Jrs and my engine is probably head limited.

Please tell me that a 3" exhaust isnt gonna cost much...If youre gonna run a choked up exhaust do a split pattern cam with more dur. on the exhaust, that will help.I know but I'm using a 2 1/2 inch exhaust and the 1 3/4 headers...already on the car and nothing in the budget to upgrade those..I have a house and a girlfriend that drain some cash as well...LOL ;-)

Sooper Dave, I think my engine is pretty close to 550 HP and probably 520 'ish on TQ. I am at 11.1:1 compression and use a Comp solid roller 250/254 @ .050 on a 108* LSA. Might be a bit much for a 99% street combo. I think similar specs with a solid FT cam would make closer to 525HP/500TQ if everything was perfect. I think the AFR 210's would be perfect. I am running Edelbrock Vic Jrs and my engine is probably head limited.thanks eric do you have any part/grinds in mind?

Put your money in the heads. I would look to the AFR 195 Eliminators as a good candidate.
You can spend big money on heads like All Pro, Brodix MR2, Pro-filer etc well worth it if you can afford it.
Canfield makes good heads also for the money they are hard to beat too.

Hyd cams especially rollers are easily capable of meeting your goals and are virtually maintanence free. No need for a solid here.

Consider a hyd roller along the lines you originally posted.
I`m partial to Ultradyne/Voodoo cams. Bullet Cams can make the Ultradyne for you and of course, Lunati for the Voodoo

IMO something around 238-242 @ .050, mid/high .500 lift range on 108 sep and with those heads a single pattern could work. Rpm range should allow 6000-6500

4 speeds don`t have the torque multiplication factor that a convertor will give you.
And due to that, I wouldn`t use big ports and I`d stay conservative on the cam to help in the torque dept .

Put your money in the heads. I would look to the AFR 195 Eliminators as a good candidate.

Hyd cams especially rollers are easily capable of meeting your goals and are virtually maintanence free. Consider a hyd roller along the lines you originally posted. IMO something around 238-242 @ .050, mid/high .500 lift range on 108 sep and with those heads a single pattern could work. Rpm range should allow 6000-6500.

So you think the 195's flow enough for 550 hp?


I just got a reply email from comp cams suggesting the following cam based on my combination (below):

Cam Spec Card Inquiry
PART NO. 12-771-8
INTAKE MASTER 4874S
EXHAUST MASTER 4875S
ENGINE CS XR280 R-10
GRIND NUMBER CS XR280 R-10
INT EXH
HYDRAULIC Y/N NO
DUR @.050 242 248
LOBE LIFT .3810 .3850
VALVE ADJUSTMENT .016 .018
ROCKER RATIO .00 .00
MAX GROSS VALVE LIFT .570 .576
DUR @ .015 TAPPET LIFT 280 286
LOBE SEPARATI 110.0
ADVANCE 4
VALVE TIMING
VALVE SPRINGS 977-16
@ .015
INT 34 66
EXH 77 29

THESE SPECS ARE FOR CAM(S) INSTALLED
@ 106.0 INTAKE CENTERLINE


BASED ON THESE SPECS

ENGINE INFORMATION
> Engine Block Type: Chevrolet
> Engine Size: 406 How Many Cylinders: 8
> Bore: 4.155 Stroke: 3.75 Compression Ratio: 10.157
> Piston Type: SRP FORGED Connecting Rod Type: EAGLE 6.0"
> Intake Manifold Type: VIC JR
> Cylinder Head(s) Year: AFR 76cc Head Part Number: 1052
> Head Runner Volume: 210cc Ported Heads: YES
> Intake Valve Size: 2.08 Exhaust Valve Size:
> Rocker Arm Type: FullRoller Rocker Arm Ratio: 1.6
> Exhaust Header(s): Yes
> Exhaust Type:
> Dual
> Exhaust Pipe Size: 2.5
> RPM Range: 1500 to 6500
> Nitrous Oxide: No
>
> _____
>
> FUEL DELIVERY
> Fuel Type: PUMP Fuel Octane Rating: 93
> Carburetor: Yes Carburetor Size: 750
> Port Injection: No
> Electronic Fuel Injection: No Oversize Injectors: No
>
> _____
>
> AIR DELIVERY
> Air Filter: Performance
> Ram Air: No
> Turbocharger: No Supercharger: No
>
> _____
>
> APPLICATION SPECIFICS
>
> How Will This Engine Be Used?
> Performance Street
> Class: n/a
>
> _____
>
> What Type Of Cam Do You Want?
> Solid Roller
>
> _____
>
> What Type Camshaft Are You Currently Using?
> Brand: n/a
> Part Number: n/a
> Specs: n/a
>
> _____
>
> Considering The Current Performance Of Your Vehicle, Do You Want:
> More Torque? No
> More RPM? No
> Is Idling Speed Important? Yes

.

So you think the 195's flow enough for 550 hp?

Absolutely...put the right hyd roller in too. For what you want you`ll be glad you did.

So you think the 195's flow enough for 550 hp?




In my opinion, you need a 210-220cc head flowing in the 280-300cfm range (verified on a local flow bench). 250+ @.050 duration on the cam. 11:1 or more compression.

I may be out of line here but...

I think the XR280 will work fine with what he has for now. Yes it's a missmatch,may not be exactly what he want for HP/TQ,and will give him room to grow when he can afford better heads.
If he had the 11:1 or better compression but a 2000 stall and/or 3.08 gears he still won't see everything that cam "could" do,so it's still missmatched.
When I look at cams I get confused also,so many choices, but what you see in ad's is to "get the max potential".

This is just my opinion,let the stones fly :D

So you think the 195's flow enough for 550 hp?


I just got a reply email from comp cams suggesting the following cam based on my combination (below):

Cam Spec Card Inquiry
PART NO. 12-771-8
INTAKE MASTER 4874S
EXHAUST MASTER 4875S
ENGINE CS XR280 R-10
GRIND NUMBER CS XR280 R-10
INT EXH
HYDRAULIC Y/N NO
DUR @.050 242 248
LOBE LIFT .3810 .3850
VALVE ADJUSTMENT .016 .018
ROCKER RATIO .00 .00
MAX GROSS VALVE LIFT .570 .576
DUR @ .015 TAPPET LIFT 280 286
LOBE SEPARATI 110.0
ADVANCE 4
VALVE TIMING
VALVE SPRINGS 977-16
@ .015
INT 34 66
EXH 77 29

THESE SPECS ARE FOR CAM(S) INSTALLED
@ 106.0 INTAKE CENTERLINE


BASED ON THESE SPECS

ENGINE INFORMATION
> Engine Block Type: Chevrolet
> Engine Size: 406 How Many Cylinders: 8
> Bore: 4.155 Stroke: 3.75 Compression Ratio: 10.157
> Piston Type: SRP FORGED Connecting Rod Type: EAGLE 6.0"
> Intake Manifold Type: VIC JR
> Cylinder Head(s) Year: AFR 76cc Head Part Number: 1052
> Head Runner Volume: 210cc Ported Heads: YES
> Intake Valve Size: 2.08 Exhaust Valve Size:
> Rocker Arm Type: FullRoller Rocker Arm Ratio: 1.6
> Exhaust Header(s): Yes
> Exhaust Type:
> Dual
> Exhaust Pipe Size: 2.5
> RPM Range: 1500 to 6500
> Nitrous Oxide: No
>
> _____
>
> FUEL DELIVERY
> Fuel Type: PUMP Fuel Octane Rating: 93
> Carburetor: Yes Carburetor Size: 750
> Port Injection: No
> Electronic Fuel Injection: No Oversize Injectors: No
>
> _____
>
> AIR DELIVERY
> Air Filter: Performance
> Ram Air: No
> Turbocharger: No Supercharger: No
>
> _____
>
> APPLICATION SPECIFICS
>
> How Will This Engine Be Used?
> Performance Street
> Class: n/a
>
> _____
>
> What Type Of Cam Do You Want?
> Solid Roller
>
> _____
>
> What Type Camshaft Are You Currently Using?
> Brand: n/a
> Part Number: n/a
> Specs: n/a
>
> _____
>
> Considering The Current Performance Of Your Vehicle, Do You Want:
> More Torque? No
> More RPM? No
> Is Idling Speed Important? Yes

I agree with Comp. If your compression is 10:1 I think you need to keep the advertised duration in the 280-285* area.

On the heads. The new 195cc AFR Eliminator heads do flow EXCELLENT according to AFRs published numbers. I believe they are significantly back ordered and cost a few $ more then their old heads. If you feel like waiting, I agree that these would be a good choice.

I agree with Comp. If your compression is 10:1 I think you need to keep the advertised duration in the 280-285* area.

On the heads. The new 195cc AFR Eliminator heads do flow EXCELLENT according to AFRs published numbers. I believe they are significantly back ordered and cost a few $ more then their old heads. If you feel like waiting, I agree that these would be a good choice.


Eric, do you feel this is a 550hp combo? My guess is that a well-built 10:1, 195cc, 280 cammed 406 puts no more than 350-375hp to the wheels - maybe 450 at the crank.

Eric, do you feel this is a 550hp combo? My guess is that a well-built 10:1, 195cc, 280 cammed 406 puts no more than 350-375hp to the wheels - maybe 450 at the crank.

Yea, that would be about 450hp 400sb
You at least have to have some well ported heads, and agressive lobes to make 500hp with a cam around 230duration.

Eric, do you feel this is a 550hp combo? My guess is that a well-built 10:1, 195cc, 280 cammed 406 puts no more than 350-375hp to the wheels - maybe 450 at the crank.

I have a well built 10.8:1, 195cc, 269 cammed 331 that puts 417 to the wheels, over 370 with a 2-bbl carb...

TO ALL YOU GUYS - I appreciate all the input!! But my head is starting to spin. I've heard of 383's making 500 fwhp without being radical...and this is 23 more inches. Is 10.3 static CR too low for that kind of power goal? Can I increase the static CR even more and still run on 93 octane with later intake valve closing? Heads and cam are still open for debate as is the combustion chamber size if I need to increase CR a bit by going with a 74 or 72 cc head. I haven't selected a head yet so which one should I go with - I've allotted some money for a good head....Should I be going with a solid roller or hydraulic roller cam?? I will not be rushing to piece this together I wanna do it right! Geez do I have enough questions!?

While you`re digesting all the above, add an order of AirGap dual plane with an 830 annular Holley on the side ! :thumbsup:

Like I said before things start getting a lot harder above 500hp, my 383 made 490hp with a 224/224 cam, but if I wanted to get another 60hp on top of that then I'd have to throw a lot more cam at it. What you wanna do it very easy with a hyd. roller, as Big Red stated, heck all the stuff I do is hyd. roller, which is great on street cars. If you wanna do this with a mild cam then spend your $$$ with a good head porter. Everybody can claim to have a 550hp sb, but only the mph will tell. You need to be pullin down at least low 120s mph (in a heavy car) to claim that, and not to many people are doing that with a mild sb.

Eric, do you feel this is a 550hp combo? My guess is that a well-built 10:1, 195cc, 280 cammed 406 puts no more than 350-375hp to the wheels - maybe 450 at the crank.

Maybe not quite. probably more like 500. The AFR Eliminator heads flow EXCELLENT and they should make excellent power even with less compression and a smaller cam. For a solid 550 HP you need more compression and more cam IMO.

Maybe not quite. probably more like 500. The AFR Eliminator heads flow EXCELLENT and they should make excellent power even with less compression and a smaller cam. For a solid 550 HP you need more compression and more cam IMO.

Eric - How much compression and duration?

I would say about 11:1 and 248-250* @ .050 and an excellent head like the AFR Eliminator. There are probably more ways to get to 550 HP but I only know about the way I did it (if that makes any sense).

I would say about 11:1 and 248-250* @ .050 and an excellent head like the AFR Eliminator. There are probably more ways to get to 550 HP but I only know about the way I did it (if that makes any sense).

Okay thanks eric I kind get it now - I'm on board with duration. Here are a few hypothetical combinations that would yield DCR < 8.5 obviously the combinations are nearly endless, however I wanna know whats the limit for intake timing on the street and whether or not 170 psi cranking pressure will be too low (in order to increase it I'd have to use an earlier intake timing which would bump up the DCR considerably).

76 cc head = 10.32 SCR + intake timing 63* ABDC = 8.35 DCR
72 cc head = 10.75 SCR + intake timing 69* ABDC = 8.31 DCR
68 cc head = 11.23 SCR + intake timing 72* ABDC = 8.45 DCR

Of the three combinations above - assuming the same lift, LSA, etc. will they all run on pump gas and will the higher SCR make more power than the lower SCR even though the DCR is in the same ballpark?

ttt

Here are the numbers on my 400 inch motor.. I went with steel heads too as I am trying to dress it up as a DZ 302 so it looks somewhat stock.. I did not reach your numbers though close on HP but this is what I have and a link to the actual dyno numbers below. This is a 9.5 to 1 pump gas street motor.
It goes in for headers next week and then I will put some miles on it then go for a wheel dyno pull

400 cubic inch 23 degree small block Chevrolet.
The heads are GM Bowtie castings with 2.050" intake valves and 1.600" exhaust valves. The heads were ported and bowl blended and use a 1.550" 977 Comp spring.
Crower crank (new)
New JE Pistons 9.5:1 Compression and coated skirts.
New Crower steel 6.00" rods
Rotating assembly was independently balanced.
The block was line bored and line honed.
Steel 4 bolt steel splayed main caps.
ARP head bolts and main studs.
Block was decked, bored and block plate honed, deburred.
Block was notched for the big crank.
The cam was degreed, pistons were checked for clearance, etc.
Camshaft is a Comp roller CSXR 286-R-10 with Crower roller Rockers
Comp roller lifters.
Valve adj . 16/1000 on intake and 18/1000 on Exhaust
586 lift
Edelbrock Air Gap intake manifold.
Holley 760 Vacuum Secondary carburetor (new)
7qt Moroso oil pan
Melling 55 HV modified oil pump
Moroso HD steel pump drive 22070
CV ..080" wall pushrods, 8.00" exhaust and 7.950" intake push rods.
H-coated Calico bearings

Dyno sheet
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v600/ChevyThunder/Hugger%20Orange%20X33/dynoss.jpg

I did restamp my deck :)
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v600/ChevyThunder/Hugger%20Orange%20X33/DSC03261.jpg

Here's a 406 I did for Car Craft a few years ago based on Tony Hoffer's advice (Team Chevelle). Ended up swapping the cam for a solid roller and made nearly 600hp on 91 octane. I can dig up the specs if you're interested. The engine was extremely tame with the hydraulic roller that's outlined in the story.
http://www.carcraft.com/techarticles/406ci_chevy_small_block/index4.html

Ended up swapping the cam for a solid roller and made nearly 600hp on 91 octane. I can dig up the specs if you're interested.

I would like to see those, can you post that up, thanks

Tony, I would be interested to see the specs on that solid roller also -- thanks.

Post some info, 600hp would be nice....hhhmmmmm....lol :D

Well, I sure dropped the ball on this post...here are the specs on the solid roller combo (~8 months late)-

Crane Cams, 256/264-degrees duration @ 0.050", 0.672"/0.672" lift (w/1.6 ratio rockers), 108-degrees LSA
Compression ratio: 10.48:1
Intake: Edelbrock Super Victor
Carburetor: Holley 950HP

All other specs are per the Car Craft article.

Dyno results:
rpm lb-ft hp
4,000 499.3 380.2
4,100 503.8 393.3
4,200 514.9 411.8
4,300 522.2 427.5
4,400 533.9 447.2
4,500 539.5 462.2
4,600 541.8 474.5
4,700 545.8 488.4
4,800 548.2 501.0
4,900 549.9 513.1
5,000 548.0 521.7
5,100 547.1 531.2
5,200 545.1 539.7
5,300 544.7 549.7
5,400 541.5 556.8
5,500 537.9 563.3
5,600 534.9 570.3
5,700 530.2 575.5
5,800 525.0 579.8
5,900 519.8 583.9
6,000 513.0 586.1
6,100 507.3 589.2
6,200 501.5 592.0
6,300 493.6 592.1
6,400 486.3 592.6
6,500 477.9 589.4
6,600 469.0 589.7
6,700 462.2 584.7
6,800 451.6 581.6
6,900 442.7 575.4
7,000 431.7 573.0


I am about a month away from installing this motor in my '68 Z. I am still debating whether I should reinstall the hydraulic roller from the original story, or keep the solid roller. Is the solid way too nuts for the street?

i drive my solid roller on the street no problem. with the shaft rockers, they hold their lash very well. some folks think a solid anything is too nuts for the street but to each their own.

Bill, thanks...this motor has Crane Gold 1.6 rockers on it so I am not sure how stable the lash will be over time. I will check it often. Are you seeing any issues on your 434 with valve spring life?

L72, i don't have enough miles yet to see spring problems, but i am sure they will require periodic maintenance. at least more than flat tappet stuff. but i have heard of guys on this forumn claiming many years of street driving on a set of springs. the .670 lift will wear them out faster than my current .582. also depends how often you drive it. to me, a pair of valve springs every year is well worth the power of a solid roller vs. anything else. add a stud girdle to hold lash longer. i fired my motor for the 1st time last november & i checked my lash a few times since then & it hasn't moved at all. i probably have 800 miles & 17 passes on it. bill.

i probably have 800 miles & 17 passes on it

Bill - what was your best et and mph?

Since this thread has been ressurected, have you built it yet? If not this actually might be good timing, cause if you havent, I wanted to give you some info here.

So far on the thread, I saw a lot of mention of the AFR eliminators. Yes, they are excellent, but at the time when this thread started....there wasnt a whole heck of a lot of real world experience/indepentant testing of any kind(may not have been any...I cant remember exactly when these things actually hit shelves). Now though, I just recently saw the first independant tests on these. Well...they may not be the first...but they are the first I myself saw hehe, and it may be a little more info than you had before. Here are the numbers.

28" 4.155 bore (I did not have time to test on a 4.030 but will have another set in the near future I will test with both)

In Ex
.050 - 39.5 23.8
.100 70 55.5
.200 143.1 110.7
.300 205 169.4
.400 257.4 211.3
.500 292 228.2
.550 297 230
.600 302.2 231.9

For those of you that know him, Mike Lewis flowed these things on his bench. And anybody who knows of Mike can verify that these are trustworthy findings. And in case you couldnt tell.....those most definitely are excellent numbers from the 195CC head(yes, them numbers are from the 195's).

If you havent built it yet, I myself would skip on the 550 horsepower idea. Its just going to be a little rad for a 99 percent street driven deal. Also will make more power than a 99 percent street car will ever use anyways.

For a camshaft, there are two Id prefer. They are both lunati solid rollers, designed by Harold Brookshire(I like his stuff). One is the 60132. Check it out here. http://www.holley.com/60132.asp.

Its 243/249 at .050, 110LSA, .578/.585. On a 10:1 engine(10.5:1 at best) itll be fine in a street car running pump gasoline. Still slightly hefty for a 99 percent street driver, but doable. With them excellent heads....Id figure high 400 on the horsepower(say 470). Low 11's easy, and enough driving manners.

If you want a little more wicked, get the next one up in the line. You can see it here. http://www.holley.com/60133.asp

Its 249/255 at .050 with .585/.600 on a 110LSA. Something between 10.5:1 to 11:1 would keep this in the real of most pump fuel. I like both of these camshaft because I just plain like Harold stuff for one, and I like the somewhat small size difference from the intake to exhaust lobe(only 6 degree bigger exhaust lobe for both). Id use the 1.6 rockers ONLY ON THE INTAKE if you use a 1.6 at all(use 1.5 on the exhaust). Either that or use 1.5 all the way around. Them heads will probably like 1.6 intake and 1.5 exhaust with cam specs similar to these.

If you dont like the voodoo, Id look at comparable specs from others. Id have a hard time building a mid 250's roller with 11:1 or better and then trying to disguise it as a 99 percent street car with only 400 cubes. Youd need a hundred more cubes to make it pleasing to drive all the time with specs like that. The 249 cam prolly still would get in the 10's with a good chassis and some real TnT time at the track. Thats my take. Hopefully the head numbers were useful in your decision making.

dave, my best et so far is 11.05 @ 122.7mph. thats out of the box with no engine tuning at all. played with the suspension a little but thats about it. there is a thread i started a few back about "cam suggestions for my 434". looks like my converter is the majority of the problem why i'm so slow. & i need more valve lift. those issues are being addressed soon. bill.

Bill, thanks for the input on the valve springs. I am still on the fence about this solid roller- the specs look more radical than anyone here is running for a mostly street motor.

Bill, thanks for the input on the valve springs. I am still on the fence about this solid roller- the specs look more radical than anyone here is running for a mostly street motor.


Tony -- I run a 259°/266° @ 0.050" mechanical flat-tappet Comp in my 11.1:1 408. It is a tight-lash design on a 106° LSA and I don't find it to be too radical to drive around on the street. The 400's can absorb a lot of camshaft duration before they feel 'cammy' and low-end torque suffers.

Since this thread has been ressurected, have you built it yet?

Yes. Got a great deal on the AFR210 elim heads and I went with a comp cam solid roller, small base circle, billet core, 286/292 adv, 248/254 at .050, 108 LSA, 577/583 but will be using 1.6 rockers all around. The motor hasn't run yet......hopefully soon.

Tony -- I run a 259°/266° @ 0.050" mechanical flat-tappet Comp in my 11.1:1 408. It is a tight-lash design on a 106° LSA and I don't find it to be too radical to drive around on the street. The 400's can absorb a lot of camshaft duration before they feel 'cammy' and low-end torque suffers.

Thanks for the reply - good to hear from you. The specs on this solid roller still look pretty huge for the street - I wish I had something more along the lines of the Comp XR286 or XR292 and I would much rather swap out the cam and springs on an engine stand rather than after it's in the car. How is driveability under 2000rpm, and what kind of vacuum are you seeing at idle?Wish I could remember how this motor idled with the big solid roller but it hasn't been run in 5 years!

Speaking of AFR Eliminator heads, does anyone know what the differance is between the 195 cnc street heads ? Are they a differant casting?

I have two year old set of 195's and thinking about sending them back to AFR to port like the eliminator heads. Comparing the flow numbers between the street version and eliminator version, I see very little differance , in fact they share the race ported numbers. Maybe I just need to have the street cnc version ported? Anybody know? I cant seem to get an answer either by email or sitting on phone line to AFR.