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Opinions on 327 build-up

13K views 23 replies 14 participants last post by  pdq67 
#1 ·
Calling all 327 fans.................May I ask your opinion?

I have a 67 RS 327 convertible Camaro that I am building. As for the drivetrain, I have the Tremek 5 speed with 3:36 posi diff.

I have a question or two before I put the engine together. I am looking for something to cruise on the weekends in. I want to keep the original engine, a numbers matching 327. Should have a sweet, low exhaust note (Z06 Corvette style), decent low end torque, 330 - 350 hp and above all be fun to drive. Smooth throttle response is important. Being a convertible, I am not interested in building a race engine or one with lots of attitude. (I have a 67 RS coupe for that!)

So here is a question or two..

What heads
What Cam
What induction system (willing to look at EFI)
What exhaust system

Other thoughts:
I like aluminum heads and have the Edelbrock Performer RPM 2.02'' Intake heads on my other 327 car with a 670 holley. I am wondering if I would be better off with 1.95" intakes for better intake velocity and drivability or stick with the 2.02s. Also, with a 64 cc combustion chamber I have 9.7:1 compression. Controlling squish to about .45" and aluminum heads gives me great detonation protection. Do you recommend finding a smaller combustion chamber head to increase compression?

I doubt if I will be winding this past 6500 rpm or so. (power all in by 6,000 RPM would work) What RPM do you think balancing the rotating assembly and rebuilding the stock 67 rods (looks like forged) be reliable to?


Thanks for your consideration.
 
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#2 ·
If you have an all numbers matching engine for the car pull it, bag it and tag it as such. Buy a 350 (330 horse or so) HEI equipped crate engine and paint it orange. Install a set of seven rib valve covers and an open element air cleaner with a 275 horse 327 fire power decal and enjoy cruising without a worry.


Larger Dave
 
#6 ·
I agree with Big Dave's suggestion. Why mess with the original engine? By the time you add aluminum heads, roller cam, machine work, balancing, etc, etc; the dollars will have added way up and your original engine will no longer be "original". You'll be better off with crate engine, especially since you say you're looking for cruiser, not custom race engine.

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#7 ·
Question, what good is the #'s matching engine if you're not gonna put it in the car? Other than the obvious (sell-value) it doesn't make sense not to put the original engine back in the car. Sitting in storage doesn't make sense to me.
 
#8 ·
Well, let's say you wanted 500hp and 550ft/lbs. It would be real hard (and expensive) to accomplish that with the original 327 engine, plus you'd ruin the "original" engine. However, those power levels would be real easy with a relatively inexpensive crate 502, and you'd probably save some money too.

And then you would still have the original engine, all wrapped up, ready to be re-installed in case you sold the car to some purist. Lots of those (purists) out there today, as witnessed by the insane values at the recent Barret-Jackson car auction. Most of the big prices seemed to be for original, documented cars. Resto-mods with mix & match engines didn't bring in as big dollars as the all-original cars.

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#10 ·
Thanks for the advice. Your points are well taken and have given me something to think about. As for original parts, I have kept all parts in a safe place for my car, but feel that the original engine should be the one powering it. I will not be abusing it, just having a good time. As for power, being a convertible I will keep it modest.

Thanks
 
#12 ·
LOL @ JimM. :D

One thing about message boards is that eveyone assumes that anyone asking questions is looking for 400-500 hp. In fact, many people like a hassle free, smooth idle and good mpg for thier fun-to-drive "cruiser". 300hp generally gets the job done. In that case, there is absolutely nothing wrong with building a 327.

Bill Bergen... go to the engine section and look at the post from Brian Lewis. He has built a basic 9.5:1 327 w/ an XE256 cam. Should be about perfect for what it sounds like you are wanting.
 
#13 ·
lol @ John...

My #'s matching 400 hp 383 does have a fairly smooth idle, and nearly all of those 500 ft-lbs available at 2000 rpm!

You're very right tho. There are a # of ways to build a bunch of different flavors of nice running 327, done one way they can and will deliver all the grunt a daily driver really needs, and done another they can rev to the moon and leave with the front wheels in the air.
 
#15 ·
Here's what Brian PM'd back to me..

"XE256H : 387/388 torque at 3500/4000, 348 hp at 5000
2500 cruise rpm = 372torque/177hp

Clevite : 388 torque at 4000, 345 hp at 5000
2500 cruise rpm = 363torque/173hp


Looks like the XE256H beats it just just a hair, while maintaining 256/212/262/218 lower duration.

I'll email you the graphs.



Quote:
Originally Posted by pdq67
Hi Brian,

Would you please run the little Clevite cam here;

Clevite PN 229-1998; 258/219/270/229, 114/110, .456"/.479", and lash at .022" and .022".

through D2k using your engine combination b/c I'm really interested in how it would do against the CC XE256 hy-cam.

And get back to me when you have time.

Tyhanks,

Paul, (aka, pdq67)"




Bill, Brian has a dandy little motor, imho!!

pdq67
 
#16 · (Edited)
Here's a 327 buildup from the Feb issue of chevy Hi Performance: http://www.chevyhiperformance.com/t...ction_poweradders/0702ch_edelbrock_performer/

They got 404hp@6000, 382ft/lb @ 4500
Reading between the lines in their article, I feel this combo is probably one step too far above what you are looking for and may lack the low end torque that would make the car fun. The 170cc port size is ideal however maybe just tone down the cam choice from what they used.
David
 
#17 ·
Bill,

Why not go with the Performer RPM set-up by Edelbrock? They say it should generate about 410 HP at about 4500 RPM. I"m currently running this set-up on my 67 RS coupe ( with the exception of the 64 cc heads, haven't saved enough money yet ) Gas milage is about 15 MPG. As of the exhaust system, Flowmasters!!!!! Series depending on how loud you want it sounding. A good set of headers and 2-1/2" pipes to the mufflers and out. Thats my 2 cents. Why try play engineer and try to match components, let the work be done by the pros ( Edelbrock R & D team ). No guess work that way.

Steve
 
#18 ·
410 hp @ 4500 rpm? That's some torque for a 331" motor, about 478#ft. The BMEP would have to be extraordinarily high, something approaching an F1 engine.
 
#19 ·
Great posts on this topic. I appreciate the responses. As several of you have pointed out, I am definitely not going for the ultra high horse power high rpm engine build. A flatter torque curve with strong HP will work fine. Up to 6,000 rpm would be fine. I think I will give the Edelbrock folks a call and see if they have already engineered a system that will provide that for me. Also the Holley folks. I am toying with going with EFI to make it that more drivable. My other 67 Camaro has a much more agressive engine, so I can jump into that if I want to make some noise!

Thanks everyone!
 
#21 ·
FWIW I have a 327 in a 56 Chevy running a solid cam with 225/225 @ .050 on a 108 LSA. Runs real well, even in overdrive it will pull from 1400 RPM without stumbling. It has a mild lope at idle but sounds good and it will pull to 6000 RPM. It gets OK gas mileage about 14-15 around town and 17-18 on the highway in OD. Would probably do better in a lighter Camaro.
 
#23 ·
I had Oregon Cam Grinding do it as a regrind on one of my old cores. This engine was a budget build to get me through a couple of years until I could do a 383. I was pleasantly surprised with this cam. Almost has me thinking of doing another 327 but with better components. Exact specs are 260/260 @ .020" 225/225 @ .050" and gross lift of .436/.436 and 108 LSA THis cam is very easy on the valvetrain and will easily rev to 6k RPM. The low lift may be leaving some HP on the table but it hasn't gone flat yet either. I think the 108 LSA may be helping it breathe a little better and it definitely has a little lope. IMO its a great street cam in a 327.
 
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