[GrayCamaro]

Has anyone started a Clone Registry of known Clone RS, RS-SS, SS , and Z28 camaros from 67 to 69 ? I read this suggestion in a thread on this board.

I think this would be a great idea. If there is not one already started I think Im going to try to put something together like this.

Thanks For any info. I just found this site today and its great !

I think I would start off with the green Z-28 I read about on this board.

I guess the info I would need would be the Vin-Cowl Tag info and possible picture of the car & where it has been offered for sale with dates.

Also if the the Vin and cowl tag has been changed or any stampings remarked.

What do you think ?

What else would help build a data base of known 1st generation Clones ?

[Straight-line-69]

Don't take this the wrong way, but I can't imagine there would be following for a Clone Registry. It would be like a fake diamonds registry,..or a fake Rolex registry. Not sure what the point would be. My opinion. And in your defense, I'm in the minority in believing the clone business is hurting the hobby.

[maizedog]

I can see a use for a clone registry, a location to check numbers before buying a car maybe.

[GrayCamaro]

Its hurting my wallet running around with the desire to purchase a 1st generation Camaro only to find out its a clone.

I think a lot of people would check out the registry to see if the car is listed if they don't have the knowledge on Camaros before purchasing a Clone.

Not to mention that dealers and Grifters would not want this to happen so they can continue to rip people off.

Im the last person Im sure on this board that should try to start a Registry to identify and catalog known Clone 1st generation camaros because my lack of knowledge on the subject. Im willing to try because I know that it would be great for camaro lovers like myself wanting to purchase a camaro and have a resource to check to see if Im getting what I pay for.

If something like this was set up and started to grow I would be willing to bet that over time you would see camaros for sale being listed correctly because of a site like this.

Crooked dealers or individuals want no possible attention being shined on them. They like to fly right under the radar and grift.

If there was a site like this already up and running I would be checking it everynight.

[Straight-line-69]

I like the attempt to expose the darker elements in our hobby and on those grounds I'd probably be in favor.

But I don't believe it would be effective. The best defense against becoming a mark is knowledge. Now that these cars are selling for insane amounts of money, the crooks are coming out of the woodwork.

Fortunately this site and the better Camaro books can arm you with the intelligence to protect your cabbage.

BTW,..did you know that some first gens came without spoilers?...and some even had 14" wheels,..and get this,..some had this crazy new technology called "mono-leaf" rear springs,..and a Powerglide! Yeah,..it wasn't a Z-28, or RS, or Copo, or SS, or nothng. It was called a "base" believed to stand for "bad *** special equipment". If you can find a car with the above,..buy it! It's a rare car these days!!!

[Unreal]

I offered to manage a Yenko Clone registry through the Yenko web site before the VINs were released. One argument against clones has been that the first guy may sell it as a clone, but some subsequent seller may "forget" to disclose that the car is a clone. I offered it as a way for forthright cloners to register their cars.

I was told I could do that on my own, but not under the Yenko registry.

[GrayCamaro]

A registry like this could benefit both Cloners and buyers. For those that would like to register their clones they would have a place to do so and for those that are not in the know might have a place to double check before buying a so called original factory optioned SS etc... camaro.

I don't have a clone problem. I have seen several really nice clones in my camaro quest but its just not what Im after. I have a problem with dealers and individuals selling or trying to sell known clones at ridiculous prices. 35K for a 15K car. Thats why they are being cloned every hour. Being an informed buyer is always the best defense to not getting ripped off but all buyers are not going to take the time to research or surf the web out for answers. They might just check a clone registry before buying.

I have personally looked at over a dozen camaros this year all over the state of Ga. and concluded with my research from the web and sites like this that they were all clones being sold as true factory SS etc...optioned cars.

More than half of the camaro owners at least 8 or 9 out of the 12+ I looked at did not know that they had bought a clone camaro or at least thats what they tried to tell me. I also found it ironic that almost all of these owners have owned their vehicles less then two years. Two years must be the standard time frame for one to find out that what they bought and are now trying to unload is a clone.

[jet_car2000]

WHY?? would you need a site for this purpose?? There are hundreds of people who come HERE for the frist time to ask about a car that they are looking at buying. Myself being one of them and have been hooked since!!!
Just post all the info you can get about the car and the guys here will help
you in any way they can. Some of the guys do keep databases of cars and will let you know if they have any history of it. And if its one none have ever seen you can bet the guys here will help you to see the good points and the bad about the car. Numbers and pictures really help when try to ask about a car. Just my opinion why go any where esle when its ALL right here on the BEST CAMARO site online today!!!!! Frank

[GrayCamaro]

Why ???

To expose fradulent dealers and individuals selling known cloned camaros as the real thing around the world.

To invite bidders on Ebay to check out a link or site on known Cloned camaros before buying or bidding.

To congratulate dealers and individuals via email for making the Cloned Camaro list and trying to rip people off for selling a Cloned camaro as the real thing.

This might come to a shock to some but not all people buying 1st generation camaros know what a trim tag is or have any idea what restamped means or what the correct rivet should look like. Those same people just might take the time to type in a Vin number though to check if there is any known info with that Vin.

[DjD]

Gary - I like your idea but am wondering how you would validate the info you collect? If not accurate it could be a dis-service to the hobby.

On a side note is it my eyes or is the Camaro script backwards on the green car?

[HawaiianCamaro]

THey flipped the pic, the Wording on the tires is backwards as well but now the why? is backwards

[JimM]

I would happily submit my vin, and a digital photo of the VIN tag (the verification dennis asked about) along with my first and last name, current licence plate number and state of registration (further verification that it is in fact my car, and date info was submitted. I did in fact make my car look like an SS, and heaven forbid I'd ever sell it, but I'd NEVER want to see it represented as a real SS.

This registry is a good idea. Many of us who "clone" our cars do so simply because that's the look we want, with zero intention of ever defrauding anyone, even like me with zero intention of ever selling the car. Circumstances change, things happen. It's very possible that sometime in the future my car would end up in the hands of someone who might unknowingly (or even knowingly) represent it as one. A vin registry could help prevent "misunderstandings."

I'd go so far as to suggest it should either be here or at camaros.org.

[DjD]

Jim - your intentions and others would be one case that would work well. What about the guy that doesn't know how to identify a car and decides it's a clone and reports it to the registry. Now we have real cars on a list that becomes impossible to remove because the doubt has been cast. Like I said I like the idea, just want to raise questions to insure it works as intended and not adversly...

[GrayCamaro]

In order to validate correctly I guess one would have to have the space or database to store all the info when the vehicle came up for sale on the web and the reasons that it is a clone based on the cowl tag or vin numbers. I know it would be a major thing to put together but with all the experts on this board the info could be gathered and checked and checked again.

The registry or database would have to have pictures of the car ,cowl tag,Vin number and changed restamps and when and where the car was offered for sale and by who. I would go as far as having any email correspondence with the individual or dealer selling the car . I know there would be some legal issues to consider but I still think it could be done.

I know my limitations. Im a better soldier at gathering any info on camaros for sale on the web and then letting the experts make the final decision on whether its a clone or not.

Let me say one more time Im not a clone snob or hater. I just hate to see dealers and individuals ripping folks off and getting away with it.

[JimM]

If such a thing could work, it would only work as a voluntary effort by the owners of these cars, not as a way that anyone could "fink-out" any questionable car they saw at a show or online or whatever.

With the info that I would provide, anyone could present my name, plate#, vin, and the date to the Illinois dmv and verify that I did in fact own the car in question at that time.

I suppose the million dollar question would be what would happen if someone put in a valid vin but made up everything else, and the prospective purchaser failed to verify the info. Maybe a big disclaimer?