[DRJDVM]

For all you guys that have had your car re-painted in the last several years....... what type of warranty did you get on the paint job ?????

I'm talking about your "above average" custom paint job..... not Earl Schieb but not "show quality" trailer queen either.... Not a daily driver that will be subject to acid rain, bird crap and hours of full sun every day...

The guy that painted my car is saying 2 years is standard.... that seems pretty weak for a custom paint job on a classic car.... he says it will last a lifetime but will only put 2 years in writing.....

So I was hoping to get some feedback from some of my fellow car enthusiasts that have had similar paint jobs on similar cars

[dawg]

I got 6 yrs from defects
shop used dupont Base coat clear coat.
warranted against things like blistering, rust through,and fading etc.
will not cover scratches and normal wear .

[MARTINSR]

If this shop had simply used ONE brand of paint throughout, took a simple three day course (or so) at the manufactures tech school they would be able to offer you a LIFETIME warrantee.

The shop where I work offers a lifetime warrantee backed by Sherwin Williams. Most quality shops will offer this.
Click here for S-W lwarrantee info

[ 05-17-2004, 06:39 PM: Message edited by: MARTINSR ]

[RSS]

That's what I got, the lifetime warranty. It covers things like peeling, delamination, cracking, checking, loss of gloss caused by cracking, checking or hazing and paint failure. I was more than satisfied with the whole experience. [img]graemlins/thumbsup.gif[/img]

Rick

[sevt_chevelle]

As Martin said the paint manufactor carries a lifetime warranty on the paint.

But you MUST follow the guidelines set fourth by the manufactor. Some products produced by PPG are NOT WARRANTED, the painters must be PPG certified and use procedures that PPG supports. So if you have problems and PPG finds out that the painter isnt PPG certified...goodbye warranty [img]graemlins/waving.gif[/img]

Not sure if they still do this but the last place I was at sprayed Dupont, which had the warranty. Depending on the products applied the warranty time varied. You had the lifetime, 7 yr and 5 yr warranty...Eric

[ldrisner]

I gotta chime in here. You guys are over simplifing things a bit.

Just what is that Lifetime Warranty paint job goint to cost?
You will have to strip it to bare metal, even painting over OEM paint will involve risk. The film thickness along could be a problem not to mention the fact that OEM paint fails over time occassionally.
Any and ALL corrosion, regardless of how slight, will have to be remove by blasting if neccessary.
Then a build up of very expense coating system products. The Labor charge for all this won't be cheap by any means.

Or..You could take a chance and let your local body shop use REASONALBLE measures and accept thier " less than lifetime" warranty.

If you have a very diserable, rare car...by all means go the expensive lifetime warranty route. If however you have what most of us have, a nice old car..but nothing Jay Leno would want, work with a reputable body shop and don't expect him to warranty it until your grandchildren are old.

[sevt_chevelle]

The lifetime warranty varies with the products you use, not how labor intensive it is.
The labor factor between the two is NONE.

For ex with PPG the FIRST step with the LIFETIME is using etch or epoxy on bare metal. The cheaper route or lesser warranty is using a DTM(Direct To Metal)such as the NCP primers. Guess what a gallon of NCP is MORE then a gallon of etch or epoxy!! A gallon of k36/38 primer isnt that much more then a gallon of Kondor which doesnt carry a warranty

The point is why waste all that time,money etc restoring a car only to lessen it with cheap products?? Not spending the extra 500 bucks for quailty paint products to me is pointless. Why take a chance just to save a few bucks, I simply dont get it
Just a fact of life...cheap products yield cheap results...Eric

[BARRY]

As with any paint manufacturer,the LIFETIME warranty is more of a marketing thing than it is a warranty of sorts. I am not saying that they will not stand behind their products, but very seldom do you ever get a bad batch of paint. Most problems occur from surfaces not being prepped correctly, people not following product data sheets, etc. Don't think that the paint company is just gonna give you paint if soemthing happens, they are going to research it through and through, plus you have to keep all of your receipts, no matterhow many years have passed by. The paint job is only going to be as good as the painter and the prep work. And it does make a difference to buy the better products, it's money well spent. Trust me, I know from experience.

[MARTINSR]

Barry, the lifetime warrantee IS a marketing tool, as are ALL warrantees.

The issue of who does it and how it was done is a moot point, the SHOP has trained personal who will "likely" use the correct products properly. The paint manufacture IS going to stand behind the job whether it is over bare metal or an OEM paint job, it doesn't make a difference. The point is that ALL the products were applied as per the manufactures recommendations, that is all there is to it.

"Bad batches" or anything of the sort is NOT going to be an issue, your right. It was my resposiblity when I was a rep to pay out those claims. I did the trouble shooting and I made decisions on who gets what. I paid ONE that's right ONE warranty do to a "Bad batch". All others (and there were plenty) that I paid out were incorrect application. HOWEVER, being it is a marketing tool we offered to sell paint, I covered the claims for the goodwill. Where I work now, we have had S-W come in and look at a few cars, they paid everytime with no questions what so ever. NONE of them were product failure, all where improper application.

Our shop offers the life time warranty and we WILL stand behind it because S-W stands behind it.

[ldrisner]

sevt_chevelle said:

"The lifetime warranty varies with the products you use, not how labor intensive it is.
The labor factor between the two is NONE."


So you are saying the budget Chromabase job I did for a friend last summer would have cost nothing extra to take off all the paint and start from bare metal rather than just sand the existing paint as I did?

Does your body shop make any money being so generous?

This paint job I'm talking about cost the guy $1200 material and a similar amount for labor, it is now a beautiful car making all the shows this summer. I gave him NO warranty as it was a charity job (the labor charge basically paid me a fast food wage). Will it need repainted? Yes. I told him to save his money and be prepared for a major expense next time. To give him the "Lifetime Warranty" would have pushed the price to over 10gs I'm sure. 10 gs he didn't have.

The man can enjoy his car now instead of looking at it like it was for the many years it would have taken him to save the 10 Grand. Maybe the rest of you are filthy rich, my friend and I are not.

So once again Sevt...tell me how I could have striped his car without working my butt off. Labor that someone would pay for in your shop. No labor difference? WRONG

[MrDanB]

Idrisner, I think that you are misunderstanding what sevt was saying. I THINK he means that the labor of either job doesn't even come into play because it's the PAINT that they are giving the lifetime warranty on, not the labor. I personally just painted my first car (69 coupe). I read thousands of posts, a coupe of books and bought very inexpensive supplies. I put months of labor into the sanding/prep, and the paint job looks great! But then I don't have any kind of warranty on it either


Dan [img]graemlins/beers.gif[/img]

[MARTINSR]

Idrisner, as I said, you don't need a $10,000 paint job to be lifetime. At a lifetime warrantee shop, sanding an OEM paint and painting over it will qualify for lifetime.

Just follow the tech sheets, thats all you have to do. [img]smile.gif[/img]

[sevt_chevelle]

Originally posted by ldrisner:
So you are saying the budget Chromabase job I did for a friend last summer would have cost nothing extra to take off all the paint and start from bare metal rather than just sand the existing paint as I did?

This is like comparing apples to oranges! Stripping a car to metal and sanding an existing finish are not the same thing.

Like what I said before the labor rate of appling products that ARE warrantied cost nothing more then appling products that are NOT warrantied or carry a lower warranty, be it you strip to metal or just sand an existing paint job.

Take a look at the pic, its Dupont warranty guide its about 6yrs old but still proves the point.
Variprime is the lifetime pretreatment, then Prime-n-seal shows up in the 7yr warranty. Does it take any longer to apply variprime then prime-n seal?? How about Uro pprime vs chroma fill?? Cant see a labor issue on that one either. Since I no longer spray Dupont I dont know the price difference on the products, going with PPG which I use now, the price is around 250 bucks to use products that PPG warranty vs using ones that are not

Not all products are warrantied by PPG. Take for example painting a OEM bumper. A warrantied product for that use would be K36 for both a surfacer and sealer. Now instead you apply a non warrantied product like SX1060. It doestnt cost any more money to apply, but the material cost is different being that SX1060 is MORE money then the warrantied K36.
Say am painting a '00 Ford 150 hood and it pays 4.0hrs to paint it. I sand it with 400 on a da, apply a sealer and basecoat. Now instead of appling a warrantied clearcoat like 2082, Dc3000 or 2055 I apply some DCD35(NOT warrantied)I still have the same amount of time involved but just thrown my PPG lifetime warranty out the window.

A paint manufactor warranty has to do with the products you use and HOW you use them. How much time you have involved is the shop's problem not the manufactors

[ 05-21-2004, 05:02 PM: Message edited by: sevt_chevelle ]

[ldrisner]

Martin...

The warranted paint applied over OEM is warranted but not the OEM finish under it.If the substrate fails the paint manufact. will not help you. I have an eight year old GM car in the drive as we speak. The paint is coming off and exposing the factory primer. Could I possible expect any one to paint over the OEM finish and warranty it for life? I think not.

Sevt, this is not about junk products verses quality products. My own Camaro went from bare treated metal to DP to K36 To DCC. All quality PPG stuff, applied by the P-sheets.
It is about the prep before the material goes on to make the warranty valid. That's all I'm saying...it's NOT just as econmical to do lifetime as not under certain circumtances. If you are painting a new caddy fender, so be , the lifetime warranty is easy to give and easy to backup. If you are doing an old car such as the many represented by the people on here, it is another story to give lifetime. It does indeed cost more and I feel that blanket statements about the ease with which a lifetime warranty can be given is not fair to some of the less informed members. As I said before, not all these people are loaded with cash..some need to get the paint job they can afford.

Martin, what about your old truck . The top chop truck you did as a young kid. You said it had 1 1/2 inches of mud in the top...should that truck not be treated as a good attempt by a young man just starting out. I'm about your age, I didn't the backbone to under take such a job at that age. You did the best you could and to this day it still looks decent (by the pictures I saw a while back).

Shouldn't some of our team members in similar situations as young Brian be allow to have thier projects...even if it means getting a "cheaper" paint job that the bodyman won't warranty for life?


Let's put this debate in prospective. This forum is for ordinary people who love Camaros. Most of them with limited resources, it not about professional bodyshop owners discussing thier quality control document situation...that's Len Stuart's site.

Have a Good Day!

[MARTINSR]

My God, I have no idea where you are coming from, sorry.
It is very simple, DRJDVM asked about warrantees at a shop. We have answered that question.

If a warranteed shop repairs a car, paints over OEM, bare metal, or what ever, as long as they followed the tech sheets, it IS warranteed, PERIOD . NO, the OEM paint under it isn't, the metal under that, the tires under that and the pavment under that, the paint however IS warranteed, LABOR and materials.
Painting over peeling paint and primer ISN'T in the tech sheets so NO that would not be warranteed.

If you have read my posts to any degree you will see that I am NOT anal about striping cars, I am NOT anal about perfectly butt welding patch panels, I am NOT anal about using every single "correct" color or paint product for your average home hobbiest. Finishing their car and having fun with it is my what I feel should be the priority.

If you see anything wrong with me informing people that there are shops out there that give lifetime warrantees, I just don't get it, I am sorry.

I could lie and say they don't exist I guess, but that isn't me.