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pro comp heads,strike force heads,please read!

59K views 27 replies 18 participants last post by  97Z4C 
#1 ·
hey guys just finishing up with my head bashing.here it goes.the heads need some finish work by a machine shop,valve guides need honed to size on mine.pushrods need to be longer,about half inch,i have the pushrod specs and will post later.i have the strike force heads by pbm which is pro-comp also,both are copies of pro topline.we have a set of pro-topline and cant tell the difference,just a few more sharp edges.you need to use factory guideplates on some heads,i did mine because of the valve tip alignment,shaft rockers will not have this problem.quality control is a weak link in these heads,but not bad at all.not advertising but buy from pbm or a machine shop that can get from pbm.if something goes wrong with heads and they are at fault they will replace.total cost 4 me was $1150 for heads complete,$100 for pushrods,$50 for head gaskets.Performance,well they do perform good but really need good compression and big cam,the 320cc heads are really 332cc so we measured,a little big but i like them.BUT,dart has a really good deal going on with their heads so you might want to check them out.$1900 out the door for darts,which is only a $600 difference.
 
#2 ·
Not to rain on your parade here, but if you can't see and measure significant differences between Pro Comps and Pro Toplines when you have them side by side on a bench, maybe you'd better see your eye doctor. Screw those Chinese commie bastiges, they did no R&D work, they just tried to copy one of the best heads on the market with no idea of why ports, chambers, etc. are shaped the way they are, then made 'em thinner (read: cheaper to make and ship). I wonder why they didn't pick on an American cylinder head manufacturer? Put 'em on a scale, the 5 - 6 lbs of difference should tell you something. I honestly hope these work out for you and you don't drop one of those thin valve seats or push a spring thru the thin tops of the intake ports, I don't wish that kind of expensive lesson on anyone. This is all just my opinion, of course, as well as that of the cylinder head expert at my local performance shop.
 
#4 ·
I did a side-by-side comparison along with my cylinder head guy for about an hour. The most obvious differences were:
1) Helicoils extend into the ports of the Pro Comps by almost 1/4". The helicoils in both were the same length, yet they stop short of the top of the port on the Pro Toplines. Thin castings and rocker stud bosses.
2) There is a boss under the valve springs inside the Pro Comp intake runner. We assumed it was there to help strengthen the thin casting below the spring to keep the spring from busting thru the port roof.
3) ProComps ports are almost 1/4" shorter than the Pro Toplines out of the box. Toplines are a quick gasket match, there's probably not enough material in the top of the Pro Comps to port 'em completely to the gasket.
4) Chamber shape - Toplines are a true kidney/heart shape, ProComps are built-up in the chamber, IMHO they tried to make it look like a modern chamber but had no idea why.
5) Pro Topline deck is .600, Pro Comp is right at .300. Anybody for a heavy shot of nitrous or boost?
6) Valve seats in the Pro Comps are about 1/2 the thickness of the Pro Toplines
7) There were a few spots on the Pro Comps that had what looked like grey putty smeared over them. We picked it out of one and it was covering a porous spot in the casting.
8) Put 'em on a scale. I don't remember the exact weights but there was between 5 and 6 pounds of difference.
Other than our hard earned American cash going into the pockets of Chinese counterfeiters, that about sums up the visible differences.
 
#24 ·
I did a side-by-side comparison along with my cylinder head guy for about an hour. The most obvious differences were:
8) Put 'em on a scale. I don't remember the exact weights but there was between 5 and 6 pounds of difference.
Other than our hard earned American cash going into the pockets of Chinese counterfeiters, that about sums up the visible differences.
This is the part that absolutely blows me away. That is huge in my opinion.
 
#5 ·
they look the same to me.deck height,valve spring thickness,valve seats are a little thinner.need my eyes checked,a little rude isnt it?i am not recommending these heads just letting everybody know my hands on experience.didnt pro-topline get the same crap when they first came out?thing is i think they are more for the budget guy.a set of machined cast heads are around $800 after machine work,budget aluminum heads are a few bucks cheaper and a lot lighter.isnt professional products chinese?they are good stuff if you ask me and i do recommend their intakes.now for a few bucks more,darts are the way to go.i will be doing 320cc dart pro 1 on my engine,just for curiosity.
 
#6 · (Edited)
Didn't mean to rub you the wrong way, it's just that the differences are obvious and glaring to anyone who has checked out the quality castings that are on the market such as Brodix, Dart, AFR, Canfield and others.
On the other point, if you want to promote a bunch of inferior Communist Chinese counterfeit junk, I as an American feel obligated to speak up. You have no idea what they melted down to make those heads, what the seats and guides are really made of or just how porous the heads are since they have no set guidelines regarding manufacturing or even the raw materials that go into them. Same with their intakes that are notorious for gasket leaks because they're not machined right. If yours sealed right, count yourself lucky, there may not be a single one of the next batch that does. We don't have a lot of choices on some of the stuff we buy, a lot of crap comes to us from China that American manufacturers can't compete with because of super low labor rates. Given the choice - and this situation has several - I'll keep my money right here and get far superior products. Don't take this personally - you just struck a chord that has become one of my pet peeves. Folks in this country (or New Zealand with Pro Topline) spent a great deal of time and money in research and development of a fine product, then somebody with no regard for those investments makes a cheap copy and sells it for considerably less. When the original maker can't compete with the price of the knock-off, they're out of business and all that you can get is knock-off junk.
 
#7 ·
Even if the Pro-comp was a great piece, they still did'nt have the R&D costs that Pro-Topline incurred. Just R&C (research and copy)..

Be nice if the Gov. here would stop this stuff from even coming in...its really theft IMO.

Sorry for the rant.
 
#8 ·
ya meanwhile the Chinese are pumping so much money into our gov' in a matter of years china will pretty much own the US. I keep my money in the US as often as possible and they are even talking of importing Chinese cars now. The only sad thing is is that you can actually find some beter products out of Japan or others places because they take pride in their work and work for less than americans but americans dont take pride in their work much anymore and just work for money. Therefore we lose to outsourcing.
 
#11 ·
"and they are even talking of importing Chinese cars now"

Just what we need.... more ricers in the US.
And the sad thing is that Americans are buying then instead of American cars, didnt see that much 10-20yrs ago, now everybody wants to "sell-out" and dont give it a second thought.:sad: I will never own a ricer, even tho the Commies will want us all to drive some gay chineese battery ricers soon. Drive American Cars you'll:thumbsup:
 
#13 ·
The Chinese are playing around with the exchange rates as well, so it will be hard to compete with them. Hopefully consumers will be smart and not buy this cheap knock off stuff, I think that is the only way to end this practice. If uncle sam blocks this stuff from the US, expect china to do the same and thats a huge market for american business. I think they have already knocked off Chevy and Honda already. I think the Chinese called their car a chevvy or something like that. I know they make cheap knock offs of honda engines. Be aware of anything called Chonda.
 
#14 ·
i must have a different set of heads buddy!my heads are pbm strikeforce which i thought was pro-comp.everybody says they are 320cc but mine are 335cc i have measured against pro-topline.maybe the comps are different.i dont know!the helicoils do not go 1/4 inch into the ports i can give a pic if you would like.deck is exactly the same as topline.what do i have?they are pbm strike force boxes.i think they are not the same as comps but similar.but not saying the comps are bad.i can e-mail some pics if someone would like.mine are almost identical to toplines.we have measured also,best machinest i think around these parts and known in 200 miles of my area of ashland ky.i have the etching on bottom of heads around center of bottom bolt holes you talked about but who knows.maybe they got better since the last set your machinest bought.i will take it i have junk,but my junk sure runs good.maybe i will take my junk to track and bash the hell out of it to see if it holds.already sees 6000 rpm on an hourly basis.valve covers come off everyday because you have me paranoid.no probs yet.just for the record,the helicoils on dart pro1 320cc heads extend the same amount as the strikeforce.havent checked deck on them yet but they look close.
 
#15 ·
i see the gasket match thing you mentioned also,so we compared alot of the heads he had and guess what?a well known head manufacturer called edelbrock has the same exact problem,about 1/4 inch to gasket match but it can be done and with confidence it is very thick there and most of us cut on our heads anyway.it was on a set of edelbrock rpm bbc heads and i have pics of that also.dude,if you would read my posts i am only doing this to take some pressure off some guys that have or are thinking about these heads.my machinist wants to know also because he said the same who knows what they melted down to get these,so he wanted a real world test.and guess what they are not that bad,great in my opinion.granted some narrow minded people will go out ant spend major bucks on big name brands but some wont,this is for the people that wont or cant.now i cant say these will hold up to nitrous because i dont have nitrous.if i had nitrous i would not be scared to use it.another thing he has alot of sets of these heads i showed him your post and he opened all the boxes and inspected and there were no gray mystery stuff he seen,no porosity either.IF THEY DO FAIL,i will post it immediately!only thing i question is if they will hold up to high spring rates(read SOLID ROLLER).i think they will with a girdle for piece of mind.and for another piece of mind i am not they regular backyard *******,i have master ase certifications and have been hot rodding for about 15 years not as much as alot of you but i do know what i am doing.my past cars include 2 ford lightnings,5 turbo regals and i still own my 10 sec street turbo t,3 69 camaros all small block and one 400 small 509 engine with nitrous,1997 dodge viper gts and abunch of other cars including imports.i do all my own wrenching and mods.only big block modded cars i have owned is my 454 ss truck and a 71 chevelle.never have i owned a built big block until now.granted i never really built my engine but i bought and went through and did it my way.and here we are.so the news is not from a regular joe.
 
#17 ·
Hi all. I am new to this site but I have my own experience with Pro Comp heads that I would like to share. I have a '70 El Camino with a 6-71 blower and formerly ran aluminum GM Performance rectangle ports. I used these heads for about 7 years without a hitch. I recently went to the machine shop to freshen up the heads and they told me that several of the guides were worn and the bill would be in the $700 range. I looked for some alternatives and found Pro Comp. I did check out several forums to see if there were any reported issues but the only negative things I saw were minor appearance issues or Australian/Chinese bashing which is not issue specific. Well, I have an issue specific complaint that you had better read. After installing the same type valve/spring combo that worked flawlessly on the GM Performance heads I took the car out for it's test drive. About 10 min. in town and then mild acceleration (no more than 3300 rpm) to get to freeway speed and then cruise at 3000 rpm for about 5 miles to get back to my off ramp. By the time I reached my off ramp I started hearing what sounded like mild knocking. Engine rpm at this point is about 1800 rpm. Checked oil pressure and that was at 64 psi. I then went to shut off the engine but before I could there was some really bad rattling and then the engine stopped. We all know it's NEVER good when that happens. Removed the heads and discovered that every single piston had come in contact with the valves and the number two intake valve was actually snapped off and ended up in the number 6 intake port. I have tried two progressively stouter valve and spring combinations with EXACTLY the same result. I won't even tell you about my Pro Comp distributor nightmare but that piece of crap ended up in the trash. I hope my experience helps others not to buy Pro Comp because my experience with both heads and distributors has been a very, very bad one :sad:
 
#19 ·
hi all. I am new to this site but i have my own experience with pro comp heads that i would like to share. I have a '70 el camino with a 6-71 blower and formerly ran aluminum gm performance rectangle ports. I used these heads for about 7 years without a hitch. I recently went to the machine shop to freshen up the heads and they told me that several of the guides were worn and the bill would be in the $700 range. I looked for some alternatives and found pro comp. I did check out several forums to see if there were any reported issues but the only negative things i saw were minor appearance issues or australian/chinese bashing which is not issue specific. Well, i have an issue specific complaint that you had better read. After installing the same type valve/spring combo that worked flawlessly on the gm performance heads i took the car out for it's test drive. About 10 min. In town and then mild acceleration (no more than 3300 rpm) to get to freeway speed and then cruise at 3000 rpm for about 5 miles to get back to my off ramp. By the time i reached my off ramp i started hearing what sounded like mild knocking. Engine rpm at this point is about 1800 rpm. Checked oil pressure and that was at 64 psi. I then went to shut off the engine but before i could there was some really bad rattling and then the engine stopped. We all know it's never good when that happens. Removed the heads and discovered that every single piston had come in contact with the valves and the number two intake valve was actually snapped off and ended up in the number 6 intake port. I have tried two progressively stouter valve and spring combinations with exactly the same result. I won't even tell you about my pro comp distributor nightmare but that piece of crap ended up in the trash. I hope my experience helps others not to buy pro comp because my experience with both heads and distributors has been a very, very bad one :sad:
why were the valves touching the pistons? Was it a head problem or a clearence problem with the cam profile and pistons?
 
#18 ·
Evidently you didn't look very hard for posts on the Pro Comp junk. There are lots of them and they are not cosmetic issues ! They are not 4 year old posts either ! :) :)

Sorry, to hear about your problems ! :)
 
#21 ·
Well I've seen a lot of posting on these heads,and I must say we have a lot of good points and bad points..we are all here for the same thing..MORE POWER!! FOR THE BUCK!!!..everyone has their own ways of thinking,and ideas and can challenge them in this great country...I love hearing the discussion on products here and a lot of people have great facts and numbers..as for me on these heads I must say what is BULLET PROOF...I've seen the best name products break,not performed,and have flaws...as for me I've ran Brodix,AFR,Dart,etc..the Procomp 320 I'm running on one of my dragsters today 468 BB-Chevy,800 lift roller,good rotating assembly,GM block,456 gear. on race fuel pounding the 1/4 mile 8.20 E.T on a small shot of nitrous 7.80 E.T..now I've seen bigger cubic inch motors with Dart,Brodix,AFR,etc not running them numbers...so can we say..is it really what your using...or is it really...(who's building it and is it the right combination)..what do you all think..
 
#23 ·
Gary, so tell us about your heads. Did you start with bare castings, then had them machined and built to specs by a good head builder? Just want to hear more and if the casting seem to have improved.
 
#26 ·
Well 68 camaro...they was new out of the box,I performed gasket match on intake and exhaust ports,I installed a new set of Ferrea valves with performance valve work,a set of Pack springs,titanium retainers,10 deg locks.. top them off with a set of guide plates and roller rockers..as far as port work in the bowls or any other place they are straight out of the box..the casting of the head was very clean and the blending of the intake and exhaust was pretty smooth..no flashing or clumps of worthless aluminum anywhere..I believe Pro Comp has picked up on a lot of reviews and complaints since first coming out with their heads and made some very well changes..I've heard and seen stories of these heads before but not so much lately..I think a lot of times with problems with these heads are improper set-up of springs,and improper push rod lengths at least that's what I've seen,causing coil bind,uncontrollable rocker slop and so on..I've had great luck with them and for my customers..proof is in the pudding as I always say..I will be doing another set with a lot of porting and tricks and will be posting the outcome of the performance they have showed..other than that I hope I answered everything that you wanted to know..
 
#27 ·
^ so they've let a bunch of Americans spend their hard earned money to do their R&D for 'em rather than having a decent product to start with.
Counterfeit Chinese junk. Run 'em if you like but as long as I have a choice, I'll buy heads made here.
 
#28 ·
kinda late getting in on this one but here is my exsperience--i have pro comps on my 468 and its been a nite mare--the reason your valves are dropping is because all the intake valve alignment is all over the place --the intake valves are hitting the cylinder -clay the tops of the pistons and you will see(this is over 600 lift-mine is 710)--the other thing is since valve locations is all over the place -you have to use adjustable push rod guides so roller tips align over stem--3rd they dont flow good enough 454 and larger motors and need to be hogged out but when you do this-there is not enough meat left around stud area to support large amounts of spring pressure--so for me i was stuck when i got them --corrected all the problems --cut pockets on pistons--notched cylinder wall-re balanced assy--mild port work-adjustable guides--and now after 3000 dollars later -it 710hp--o yeah since the valve alignment is all over the place-the stud girdle dont fit-not even pro comps girdle -got the bugs worked out but hatem-the true test is next weekend with a 250 shot over 700 lift roller and no stud girdle to be found to fit---save your money
 
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