Headers! again.. - Team Camaro Tech
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post #1 of 27 (permalink) Old Mar 7th, 00, 07:06 AM Thread Starter
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I know this subject has probably been beaten to death, but i didn't get the answers i wanted.
Does anyone know of a set of headers that will fit a 69 camaro with power steering and a/c - without modifications?
Summit sells a set of stainless steel headers that they claim will work. They are a bit pricey. If i should buy these, should they be hot-coated, even though they are stainless? I'm looking for show quality, etc..
thanks, mike
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post #2 of 27 (permalink) Old Mar 7th, 00, 08:13 AM
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I would go with the Hooker competition headers. I bought a set for my 69 Z. They are metalic-ceramic coated, and they are show quality. Hookers are noted for a correct fit, and mine fit fine and cleared everything. I also installed a Moroso starter heat shield to avoid starter heat problems. They are Hooker #2451-1 for small block, and #2457-1 for big block. Hooker says the small block headers work with air conditioning if you use bracket #10925, and claims the big block headers work as is with A/C. If you are installing small block headers, make sure you have small block engine frame mounts, and if big block, make sure you have the big block mounts. A buddy of mine has a 68 Camaro small block car that he installed a big block engine in, and "bad-mouthed" the headers because they wouldn't fit. I tried to tell him that the proper big block mounts set the engine up higher on the drivers side, and about 2" or so forward to clear the steering box. You might want to check this. Hope this all helps.
Peace69Z/28
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post #3 of 27 (permalink) Old Mar 7th, 00, 10:20 AM
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Although the Super Comps seem to get credit for fitting the best, I have heard others here say they had problems with them - especially around the steering box/pitman arm and air/co box. I think there are minor variations with every car and you just have to try them to be sure - no matter what brand. Worst case you may have to do some minor mods. To be safe just check the fit first and then get them coated.

One other thought - the Doug Thorley headers look like they should fit very easily since they have fewer pipes to contend with. I can't get excited about the chrome look but I've heard you can get them coated now.

------------------
Scott
'69 400SB, Richmond 5-speed; '99 HD Road King Classic
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post #4 of 27 (permalink) Old Mar 7th, 00, 11:05 AM
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I've got an old set of headers on my 69 Z that fit around the power steering box with no problems. I'm pulling them off to go back to stock manifolds and I'll sell them if you're interested. They have some surface rust, but no metal fatique anywhere. They have 4 bolt collectors and I think they're 1-3/4" tubing. $50 if you're interested. You can see if they fit, blast them and send them out for coating.
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post #5 of 27 (permalink) Old Mar 7th, 00, 12:45 PM Thread Starter
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Jeff H:
thanks for the offer. Since your car doesn't have A/C, i'd be a bit concerned about the fit around the box. BTW, why are you going back to orig. manifolds?
Also, does anyone know if stainless requires coating?

mike
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post #6 of 27 (permalink) Old Mar 7th, 00, 01:21 PM
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A agree with Rocky, fit them first and then have them coated. Hooker states that the headers are designed to use factory GM motor mounts. I did and they did not fit. They actually fit better with polyurethane interlocking mounts on my car but still required some clearancing with a persuader. Each car has some variance so it's dificult to say what your experience would be like. I have not seen any headers spec'ed for A/C that were larger than 1 5/8". I have not seen any shorty styles for A/C cars. In other words, your selections are very limited.
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post #7 of 27 (permalink) Old Mar 7th, 00, 04:29 PM
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Are you looking at the Hooker stainless street rod headers? These are the only stainless headers I see in the Summit catalog. I hope they are not, since they will not fit Camaro's. Try Sanderson headers in South San Francisco they make a shorty header that will fit.

Steve R.
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post #8 of 27 (permalink) Old Mar 8th, 00, 07:50 AM
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You're looking at the Summit by Borla ones they advertise - which won't work w/o mods if you have AFR heads.
I just put some Doug Thorleys on my '69 that work killer. No interference with anything, installed in 30 minutes, and don't ring like the cheapies. They look real nice now 'cause the chrome hasn't blued yet. I couldn't be happier with them.
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post #9 of 27 (permalink) Old Mar 8th, 00, 08:02 AM
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Kevin,

What is the tube size and do you have A/C? Are they a full length style?

Thanks
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post #10 of 27 (permalink) Old Mar 8th, 00, 08:15 AM
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I think one of the reasons why some people have problems with their headers while others do not has to do with tube size. I have read many of these header posts and few people put the tube size in their post.

FYI, I have run many engine simulations on my dyno software (Dyno 2000) for different people and large tube headers do nothing for a street engine. They typically only impact the horsepower curve over 6,000 RPMS and even then, its only a couple of extra ponies.

Bottom line, again bigger is not better and you will have fewer problems fitting the small tube headers into your car. My small tube Hooker Comp headers fit with plenty of space around the steering box. BTW, my engine produces over 500 hp.

I think (and someone tell me if I'm wrong) that Hooker Comp headers are small tube and Super Comp are big tube.

------------------
Hugger Orange & white 69 Camaro with supercharged 350, Tremec TKO, and 3.73 12-bolt

[This message has been edited by gheatly (edited 03-08-2000).]
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post #11 of 27 (permalink) Old Mar 8th, 00, 08:23 AM Thread Starter
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Kevin:
Yes, i was talking about the Borla stainless.
What is AFR?
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post #12 of 27 (permalink) Old Mar 8th, 00, 02:21 PM
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gheatly,
Hooker does offer a Super Comp for A/C cars. It is a 1 5/8" tube. Hooker does offer a Comp version but the tube layout is different. I have not been able to find a larger tube for this application. That's why I'm curious about Kevin's new find.
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post #13 of 27 (permalink) Old Mar 9th, 00, 04:58 AM
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I'm confused, I thought the main difference between Comp's and Super Comp's is that the Super Comp's are ceramic coated?



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post #14 of 27 (permalink) Old Mar 9th, 00, 05:25 AM
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The Super Comps for first gen A/C cars is a different design than Comps. I had a set of Comps at one time because they were inexpensive. However, the design of the #8 tube allowed to much heat through the floorboard. They were on the car for 15 min. The Super Comps have a different routing of the RH tubes that fixes this problem. The ceramic coating is an option and does not depict Super Comp only. There may be other differences also but this is the most visual.
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post #15 of 27 (permalink) Old Mar 9th, 00, 07:33 AM
 
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I just put a set of hooker competitions on this week I have a 68 camaro 350 V8 automatic, air conditioning power steering.
They fit just fine no problems at the firewall like I was afraid of.
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