Painting dilemma - Team Camaro Tech
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post #1 of 17 (permalink) Old Jun 13th, 19, 04:30 PM Thread Starter
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Mike
 
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Painting dilemma

I am so confused on paint. Last time I painted a car (around 1980) it was so much easier. You pick a color, go down and buy either acrylic enamel or lacquer. But now there epoxy primers, 2k primers, urethanes, single stage, clear coats, URGH... It is all so confusing. So here I am to get the experts opinion... I got the epoxy primer from SPI and the 2k high-build urethane primer from Sherwin Williams. I was wondering what some of you are using? I have been wondering what type of base coat I should use. I assume it should be a polyurethane. Looking at Axalta waterborne and Sherwin Williams solvent based polyurethane. I thought about SPI but they only have a few color selections. I have been reading about all these choices, but it seems like the more I read the less I know.

As always your input and opinions are appreciated.
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post #2 of 17 (permalink) Old Jun 13th, 19, 04:46 PM
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Don
 
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Re: Painting dilemma

I would not recommend a waterborne base especially in humid Florida unless you have access to a heated booth. That stuff is tricky imho...

I use PPG DBC base and SPI universal clear. Motobase is also a good choice.

Don

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post #3 of 17 (permalink) Old Jun 13th, 19, 06:35 PM
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Re: Painting dilemma

PPG BC/CC Concept 2002 Clear, 5coats of each over 600 wet sanded primer. 24 hours dry then wet sand or DA 1000 down to 3000 then buff with wool, 2 foam pads and 3M finishing products.
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post #4 of 17 (permalink) Old Jun 14th, 19, 05:35 PM Thread Starter
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Mike
 
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Re: Painting dilemma

Thanks, I will check these out.
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post #5 of 17 (permalink) Old Jul 7th, 19, 09:22 PM
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Re: Painting dilemma

ditto what the camaro guy said.
I just went through the same thing, i vapor blasted my 69 to the metal, then welded all dent puller and old body side molding holes, did all metal work and filler work, then sprayed with epoxy primer self etching direct to metal, then while wet we put 2 heavy coats of 2k primer, I blocked it several times then 2 more coats of 2k primer and 2 more times blocking. I decided (after consulting many, many guys who do beautiful work), then to use sikkens (u-line) single stage then 2 days later started blocking it ( just to flatten it) with 800 then used sikkens pc clear then 2 days later color sanded with 1200, then 1500 then 3000 wet da polisher then new short wool pad with meguires 100, then black foam pad and meguires 205, then blue foam pad and 3m fine polish, then 2 weeks later re buffed with meguires 205 and black foam pad, then rebuff with 3m polish and blue foam. car had 3 coats of u-line red color and 3 coats of pc clear, just finished the polishing today and it is super slick, beautiful paint.
nearly all the super slick jobs i did 30 years ago i used ppg and later went to ppg concept it is great, but to be honest the 2 slickest ones were a corvette years ago with sikkens basecoat/clearcoat and this camaro with u-line and sikkens pc clear!
My opinion is that Sikkens has the prettiest clear you can get and one thing I learned this time around is that all the paint allowed by the government now is watered down crap compared to the old paints, but with enough work you can even make this thin stuff look great! The only disappointment on my camaro was my fault, i missed a few small areas where the black paint from the stripes got on some sandpaper then on the red, and i missed it when cleaning it up, before clearing it, so now I have 3 or 4 small spots that look like grease smears but they are actually under the clear, CAUTION: the clear will magnify any thing like this, it can be fixed but will require repainting a few sections
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post #6 of 17 (permalink) Old Jul 8th, 19, 03:59 AM
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Re: Painting dilemma

I've been playing with water based base coat which might be something to think about. It will cover in 1.5 coats what normally takes 5. For me it seems to lay down much nicer and evenly.
Follow with your favorite clear coat then cut (1500->3000->5000) & buff (3M stage 1-3).
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post #7 of 17 (permalink) Old Jul 8th, 19, 05:13 AM
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post #8 of 17 (permalink) Old Jul 8th, 19, 05:17 AM
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Re: Painting dilemma

We tried waterborne at the Kindigit paint seminar. The pros there hate it and highly recommend solvent base where available. No need for guys painting their own cars to use it imho...

Don

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post #9 of 17 (permalink) Old Jul 8th, 19, 01:26 PM
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Re: Painting dilemma

Waterborne needs a booth with a pro setup to be used efficiently. I deal with collision shops who have it. They hate it on humid days. Many collision shops use waterborne because paint companies now spend their energy on waterborne to color match factory codes, and decreased labor spent with solvent. Color matches and blending is key in collision work in order to save time. Collision shops I know that have waterborne systems shoot solvent on restorations.

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post #10 of 17 (permalink) Old Jul 9th, 19, 07:07 AM
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Re: Painting dilemma

Ouch - didn't know this would garner responses like a motor oil thread

I suppose in a humid environment it does present challenges. I live in WY where the humidity is generally very low (25-30% avg.).
Waterborne (Spies Hecker) lays down nice, covers very well and flashed off quickly. I'm a novice at best and havent painted a full car with waterborne yet and I certainly havent tried blending it like I have with solvent base but I'm liking it better than solvent where I have used it. Clean-up is real nice.
Restoring a 68 Chevelle now and will paint Forest Green with Spies Hecker waterborne when the time comes. My experience with waterborne has been limited to painting a hood and a few fenders to see what certain colors look like.
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post #11 of 17 (permalink) Old Jul 9th, 19, 09:55 AM
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Ed
 
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Re: Painting dilemma

I always use PPG products whenever I can. Wife works at Lowes and has done 5 years in the paint department. After talking to all the reps personally about auto paint, I won;t buy anything but PPG from the auto parts store.
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post #12 of 17 (permalink) Old Jul 9th, 19, 10:37 AM
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Re: Painting dilemma

PPG DBC for basecoat. Spendy but a great product. I used Concept 2021 Clear when I painted the first time and its a great product. Did some repaint on a few panels a couple years later and used DBC with Axalta AF740 Clear. That clear is from the Aviation industry and is easily the best clear I have ever shot. The gloss is unmatched from my eye it gets very hard after it cures for a few weeks.

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post #13 of 17 (permalink) Old Jul 9th, 19, 12:54 PM
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Re: Painting dilemma

Quote:
Originally Posted by travisch View Post
Ouch - didn't know this would garner responses like a motor oil thread

I suppose in a humid environment it does present challenges. I live in WY where the humidity is generally very low (25-30% avg.).
Waterborne (Spies Hecker) lays down nice, covers very well and flashed off quickly. I'm a novice at best and havent painted a full car with waterborne yet and I certainly havent tried blending it like I have with solvent base but I'm liking it better than solvent where I have used it. Clean-up is real nice.
Restoring a 68 Chevelle now and will paint Forest Green with Spies Hecker waterborne when the time comes. My experience with waterborne has been limited to painting a hood and a few fenders to see what certain colors look like.
No abuse intended but I felt your advice was not good for most hobbyist painters. While you are blessed with low humidity a lot of folks are not and their use of waterborne would be a recipe for disaster imho....

The juice ainít worth the squeeze....

Quality solvent basecoats donít need 5 coats to cover imho.

Don

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1969 Camaro vert LS3 4L65E Ridetech level 2 - sold
1959 El Camino project
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post #14 of 17 (permalink) Old Jul 9th, 19, 02:30 PM
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Re: Painting dilemma

In some states only water based paints can be sold per EPA. Think California for example.

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post #15 of 17 (permalink) Old Jul 9th, 19, 04:20 PM
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Don
 
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Re: Painting dilemma

Low VOC is required but not waterborne per this article:

https://www.onallcylinders.com/2015/...omotive-paint/

Don

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1969 Camaro vert LS3 4L65E Ridetech level 2 - sold
1959 El Camino project
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