The Hugger69 goes ZL-1! - Page 4 - Team Camaro Tech
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post #46 of 213 (permalink) Old Aug 19th, 16, 10:36 AM Thread Starter
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Re: The Hugger69 goes ZL-1!

Quote:
Originally Posted by zman1969 View Post
Hakan, I just looked through your thread and I like it! although I'm disappointed at lower compression but what good is it if you cant get aircraft fuel to run it? What cam will you be using with it? a OE cam might not run that well with the lower compression (I learned that the hard way on my 302) and I would suggest a roller it should pick up some of the power the compession lost and you really need to go 4 or 5 speed in it an auto is just wrong I also checked out your webpage- very nice!
Thanx, Rick!
Yeh, you have to compromise all the time but I think this will be great!
No, I'll run the auto cause I want to!
....stay tuned and I'll reveal the cam any day now!

Btw, thanx times two regarding liking my website, really appreciate that!
...did you catch up on your school-Swedish?

_________________________________________________
Regards from Hakan in Sweden.
1969 Camaro X44, hugger orange, 427 ZL-1, TH350, 4:10 12 bolt Posi, RPO Z87, black/white houndstooth, 14" steel wheels & dog dish, 02D built

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post #47 of 213 (permalink) Old Aug 22nd, 16, 05:19 AM Thread Starter
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Re: The Hugger69 goes ZL-1!

Another little bunch of stuff has arrived at The Huggers nest.....


First these unusual, I do know why, but in my opinion very cool option...the fender guards from GM. I had a NOS set before and now I found another NOS kit so now its complete to the car.
This new box has never been opened since it was sealed in 1968-69:



.. here together with the other kit:



I also did order a complete, 41 pcs, set of chrome plated valve covers that should be very similar to the original part. According to seller they feature the correct height, positioning of the holes, wire loom stands and brackets, most of all they feature the correct drippers as per originals. They do look good enough for me at least...



Some small but good stuff for the starter as well, heat shield and front bracket.



And finally the new cam from Crane. A 10313 that hopefully will do the job!






Here are some spec for the interested:


Description:
Rough idle, performance usage, good mid range HP, bracket racing, auto trans w/3000+ converter, 3800- 4200 cruise RPM, 10.0 to 11.5 compression ratio advised. Good w/Roots supercharger, 15 lbs. max. boost w/8.0 max. compression ratio advised.


Lift: Intake @Cam 3347 @Valve 569
Exhaust @ Cam 350 @Valve 595
Rocker Arm Ratio 1.7

Cam Timing: TAPPET @ .004
Lift: Opens Closes ADV Duration
Intake 34 BTDC 80 ABDC 294
Exhaust 87 BBDC 37 ATDC 304


Spring Requirements:
Part Number 99893
Loads Closed 130 LBS @ 1.850 or 1 27/32
Open 346 LBS @ 1.280

Recommended RPM range with matching components
Minimum RPM 3200
Maximum RPM 6800
Valve Float 7200

Cam Timing: TAPPET @.050
Lift: Opens Closes Max Lift Duration
Intake 10 BTDC 48 ABDC 109 238
Exhaust 63 BBDC 5 ATDC 119 248

_________________________________________________
Regards from Hakan in Sweden.
1969 Camaro X44, hugger orange, 427 ZL-1, TH350, 4:10 12 bolt Posi, RPO Z87, black/white houndstooth, 14" steel wheels & dog dish, 02D built

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post #48 of 213 (permalink) Old Aug 22nd, 16, 05:44 AM
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Re: The Hugger69 goes ZL-1!

Hakan, that cam certainly has a high cruising rpm. 3800-4200 rpm shouldn't be a problem with those 4:10 gears. There's nothing like winding out a big block through the gears of a manual transmission. It is a religious experience! The only problem you will have is keeping gas in the tank! LOL!

1969 SS Garnet Red X55 350 Factory 4 speed
12 Bolt 3.55 Posi
461 BBC TKO600
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post #49 of 213 (permalink) Old Aug 22nd, 16, 07:50 AM Thread Starter
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Re: The Hugger69 goes ZL-1!

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Originally Posted by Matt 69 View Post
Hakan, that cam certainly has a high cruising rpm. 3800-4200 rpm shouldn't be a problem with those 4:10 gears. There's nothing like winding out a big block through the gears of a manual transmission. It is a religious experience! The only problem you will have is keeping gas in the tank! LOL!
I like the way you think, Matt!
....but I'm going to stick with the automatic, at least in the beginning!

_________________________________________________
Regards from Hakan in Sweden.
1969 Camaro X44, hugger orange, 427 ZL-1, TH350, 4:10 12 bolt Posi, RPO Z87, black/white houndstooth, 14" steel wheels & dog dish, 02D built

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post #50 of 213 (permalink) Old Aug 22nd, 16, 09:31 AM
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Re: The Hugger69 goes ZL-1!

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Originally Posted by Hgger69 View Post
I like the way you think, Matt!
....but I'm going to stick with the automatic, at least in the beginning!
You can still have fun with the automatic! It's called power braking! I went from a small block to a big block last year and man is it fun! I just can't keep my foot out of it! That's where the gas problem comes in! LOL!
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1969 SS Garnet Red X55 350 Factory 4 speed
12 Bolt 3.55 Posi
461 BBC TKO600
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post #51 of 213 (permalink) Old Aug 22nd, 16, 02:12 PM Thread Starter
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Re: The Hugger69 goes ZL-1!

Gottcha, Matt!

_________________________________________________
Regards from Hakan in Sweden.
1969 Camaro X44, hugger orange, 427 ZL-1, TH350, 4:10 12 bolt Posi, RPO Z87, black/white houndstooth, 14" steel wheels & dog dish, 02D built

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post #52 of 213 (permalink) Old Aug 22nd, 16, 03:34 PM
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Re: The Hugger69 goes ZL-1!

Check out the Pac 1924 springs, I just put them in my car last week. I doubt you will get to 1.85 installed height, I went to 1.92. They have a great calculator to give you actual numbers, I would break in the cam with the outer springs only, as you are pushing the limit of a flat tappet cam on break in

Pac racing check it out

69 Copo 9560 ZL-1 automatic [email protected], 1.95 on f70-14 polyglas F.AS.T. Race June 2016
69 Copo 9560 ZL-1 4spd [email protected] 1.93 60ft on F70/14
PSMCDR 2014
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post #53 of 213 (permalink) Old Aug 23rd, 16, 01:36 AM Thread Starter
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Re: The Hugger69 goes ZL-1!

Quote:
Originally Posted by 1971ls6 View Post
Check out the Pac 1924 springs, I just put them in my car last week. I doubt you will get to 1.85 installed height, I went to 1.92. They have a great calculator to give you actual numbers, I would break in the cam with the outer springs only, as you are pushing the limit of a flat tappet cam on break in

Pac racing check it out
Youre right there regarding using the outer springs only during break in, good tip!

_________________________________________________
Regards from Hakan in Sweden.
1969 Camaro X44, hugger orange, 427 ZL-1, TH350, 4:10 12 bolt Posi, RPO Z87, black/white houndstooth, 14" steel wheels & dog dish, 02D built

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post #54 of 213 (permalink) Old Oct 12th, 16, 06:05 AM Thread Starter
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Re: The Hugger69 goes ZL-1!

Suddenly things started to happen again.... filled the trunk with stuff and went to my local motor shop:



Now up on the bench are the crank, rods, pistons, flexplate and the harmonic balancer. Ready to get fully balanced.



The heads also came with me this time for a checkup and also to remove the two inner springs before breaking the future motor and cam in.
The shops going to finish the motor like a short block with the crank, rods, pistons and cam installed and Im supposed to finish the motor project home in my garage, kind of scaring and exciting at the same time, huh!
The time frame is not to get the motor done fast, just to get it right!

I just have to get a short glimpse of the casting number...



The original ZL-1 block had #3946052/53. I was surprised to se this new number was ending with a "D", #394605D.
Does anybody know why its a "D" in the end instead of a "2" or "3"? My guess is that there is an issue with the owners rights or similar between Winters Foundry and GM....? Could "D" stand for "Developed"....or Dumbass...or Deamon....or maybe Doomed?


All machinery on the raw casting block is done by Schwartz Machine Company and they also put their own serial number on it:



Its a story that the operators at Schwartz wanted to make a tribute to the famous ZL-1 and therefore engraved the head caps and the rear cam plug with "ZL-1"...true or not but there it is:



Now its up to the shop to make as perfect job as possible and ill get back with an update a.s.a.p.

_________________________________________________
Regards from Hakan in Sweden.
1969 Camaro X44, hugger orange, 427 ZL-1, TH350, 4:10 12 bolt Posi, RPO Z87, black/white houndstooth, 14" steel wheels & dog dish, 02D built

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post #55 of 213 (permalink) Old Nov 2nd, 16, 01:51 AM Thread Starter
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Re: The Hugger69 goes ZL-1!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hgger69 View Post
The original ZL-1 block had #3946052/53. I was surprised to se this new number was ending with a "D", #394605D.
Does anybody know why its a "D" in the end instead of a "2" or "3"? My guess is that there is an issue with the owners rights or similar between Winters Foundry and GM....? Could "D" stand for "Developed"....or Dumbass...or Deamon....or maybe Doomed?
Come on now, guys....someone have a clue, don'tya?

_________________________________________________
Regards from Hakan in Sweden.
1969 Camaro X44, hugger orange, 427 ZL-1, TH350, 4:10 12 bolt Posi, RPO Z87, black/white houndstooth, 14" steel wheels & dog dish, 02D built

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post #56 of 213 (permalink) Old Nov 2nd, 16, 07:16 AM
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Re: The Hugger69 goes ZL-1!

There is a Yenko Block that have 394605Y and that Y probably stands for Yenko.
And you have the D so thats have to stand for Denko .
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post #57 of 213 (permalink) Old Nov 2nd, 16, 07:13 PM
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Re: The Hugger69 goes ZL-1!

Schwartz machine is 10 miles from me and is considered the preferred shop for limited production pieces, this block falls under the NASCAR division of gm and hence the Schwartz machine shop. I called Schwartz and was given the name of the gm employee that they referred all questions to, he is the one that gave me the NASCAR asociation. The block is a piece of jewlrey, every edge is hand deburred and the machining was dead nuts on, I think they left 1-2 thousands for a final hone, my pistons are stock bore and the motor builder was impressed by the as delivered block, btw, he is the engine builder at the new Copo Camaro plant and is as anal as it comes.

Wait until you fire it and watch it grow, the lash grows .012, with a tight lash cam, the cold setting is .006, plan on bending a few like a pretzel when setting them cold.these motors warm up and cool off fast. I cannot keep enough heat in it. I can sit in Woodward dream cruise traffic and it never moves. Run a 195* thermostat

69 Copo 9560 ZL-1 automatic [email protected], 1.95 on f70-14 polyglas F.AS.T. Race June 2016
69 Copo 9560 ZL-1 4spd [email protected] 1.93 60ft on F70/14
PSMCDR 2014
71LS6 vette [email protected] PSMCDR 2012 SOLD
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post #58 of 213 (permalink) Old Nov 3rd, 16, 02:16 AM Thread Starter
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Re: The Hugger69 goes ZL-1!

Quote:
Originally Posted by 1971ls6 View Post
Schwartz machine is 10 miles from me and is considered the preferred shop for limited production pieces, this block falls under the NASCAR division of gm and hence the Schwartz machine shop. I called Schwartz and was given the name of the gm employee that they referred all questions to, he is the one that gave me the NASCAR asociation. The block is a piece of jewlrey, every edge is hand deburred and the machining was dead nuts on, I think they left 1-2 thousands for a final hone, my pistons are stock bore and the motor builder was impressed by the as delivered block, btw, he is the engine builder at the new Copo Camaro plant and is as anal as it comes.

Wait until you fire it and watch it grow, the lash grows .012, with a tight lash cam, the cold setting is .006, plan on bending a few like a pretzel when setting them cold.these motors warm up and cool off fast. I cannot keep enough heat in it. I can sit in Woodward dream cruise traffic and it never moves. Run a 195* thermostat
Wow, that's great to hear, Morgan! ...and thanks for that tip regarding the thermostat!

But my questions still stands unanswered....
1. What does the "D" stand for in the block casting number #394605D? Shouldn't it be #3946052 or #3946053, like the original block or are GM forbidden to use that casting number due to the fact that this is a "replica"?
2. What does the serial number, in my case SMC 1D12-033, given from Schwartz stand for?
3. How many of this new blocks were produced?


Is it possible to get in contact with that employee once again regarding these quests, you think?

_________________________________________________
Regards from Hakan in Sweden.
1969 Camaro X44, hugger orange, 427 ZL-1, TH350, 4:10 12 bolt Posi, RPO Z87, black/white houndstooth, 14" steel wheels & dog dish, 02D built

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post #59 of 213 (permalink) Old Nov 3rd, 16, 05:59 PM
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Re: The Hugger69 goes ZL-1!

Never asked the question on the tag, it took a while for him to call me back and I doubt he would know about production numbers. I may be able to find out more info through diamond/trend, as they know Schwartz , they are 5 miles away from each other.

No idea on the D as the last digit, but something to look into

69 Copo 9560 ZL-1 automatic [email protected], 1.95 on f70-14 polyglas F.AS.T. Race June 2016
69 Copo 9560 ZL-1 4spd [email protected] 1.93 60ft on F70/14
PSMCDR 2014
71LS6 vette [email protected] PSMCDR 2012 SOLD
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post #60 of 213 (permalink) Old Nov 4th, 16, 12:48 AM Thread Starter
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Re: The Hugger69 goes ZL-1!

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Originally Posted by 1971ls6 View Post
Never asked the question on the tag, it took a while for him to call me back and I doubt he would know about production numbers. I may be able to find out more info through diamond/trend, as they know Schwartz , they are 5 miles away from each other.

No idea on the D as the last digit, but something to look into

Thanks, Morgan! Ill be happy with whatever clues you will dig up!


I emailed Schwartz myself but no answer yet...Ill guess companies in US aren't that fond of using email in conversations....we've come a bit further with that here in Europe!

_________________________________________________
Regards from Hakan in Sweden.
1969 Camaro X44, hugger orange, 427 ZL-1, TH350, 4:10 12 bolt Posi, RPO Z87, black/white houndstooth, 14" steel wheels & dog dish, 02D built

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