1969 Ralley Sport - vacuum? - Team Camaro Tech
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post #1 of 9 (permalink) Old May 24th, 11, 01:03 AM Thread Starter
FIDEL
 
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1969 Ralley Sport - vacuum?

Hey guys dont seem to be getting enough pressure to the to the head light relay. I do have good engine vacumn. Seems like all hoses are hocked up correctly. What or where do I look for. Thanks
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post #2 of 9 (permalink) Old May 24th, 11, 05:57 AM
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Re: 1969 ralley sport

Cracked/weathered hoses.
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post #3 of 9 (permalink) Old May 24th, 11, 06:47 AM
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Re: 1969 ralley sport

Well you can do my so called Frankenstein test to see part by part what fails the test. You may need to get a testing length of hose if you find your hoses rotten or suspect they leak. You need maybe three ten foot lengths of the same diameter of the vacuum lines running engine to tank and tank to canisters.

Start the test by removing the red stripe and the green stripe hoses from the manual switch on the vacuum storage tank. If the ends of the hose are somewhat even you can shunt the ends of the hoses together and get a good enough seal to test. If all your hoses are crumbling and or show some dry rot, just buy a replacement hose kit and start there, or trim off just enough to get a flat even seal against the other hose end.

Testing the canisters is the first step. Do this while engine is running so standard caution warning of dropping loose hoses into the fan and remember to keep your paws away from the radiator tank unless you like seared flesh.

Start by holding the engine vacuum line up against the end of the green stripe hose, while you keep a finger over the end of the red stripe hose - doors will open if your mechanical canisters and doors are healthy.

Slow, or stuck doors? A good spray of silicone can help sticky doors hinges. And a dry/stuck canister can by coached along by quickly lifting and resetting your finger in a fluttering move over the end of the other hose end. If your doors did not open in the above test or stuck in mid travel, gently push the door(s) open, and test if you can close them with vacuum.

Test closing the doors by reversing the above process - hold the engine vacuum line up against the red stripe hose, finger over the green hose end - doors will close if mechanical issues do not exist.

Again you can coach a stuck door by quickly fluttering your finger on and off the other hose end. I've been told that a sealed but dry rubber ring inside a canister can be lubed with quality silicone spray (one with a straw hose on the tip) by spraying in both ends rotating the canister and then pushing and pulling the actuator rod a few times. I've never needed to do this step. Also if you can't gently push open the doors and gently close them its a good sign that the canister or the door mechanics needs some inspection, lube or replacement.

If you can open and close the doors via this vacuum method, then you have either a leaking manual switch, reservoir tank, or headlight switch. The headlight switch has a rubber slide that can dry out. If you can't open or shut the doors in the above test and the doors can be manually pushed to either open or closed with ease test the vacuum output at the manifold with a gauge. No or weak vacuum? try another port (not the brake booster).

NEXT STEP:
Reattach the hoses to the manual switch on the reservoir tank. Flip the manual switch to open, do the doors move even a bit? Push back to normal do the doors shut. could be check valve.

Testing the manual switch on top of the tank: In the normal position disconnect the small hose connected to the top of the slide (comes from the headlight switch through firewall) - doors will open if the problem is vacuum loss from headlight switch.

Switch: I rebuilt mine twice with some petroleum jelly and a q-tip by removing the bottom cover of the hose bib by bending back the tabs with needle nose pliers but on this third time I bought a replacement switch.

Manual Value: Bought a replacement correct reproduction with manual slide on top - I found that my 1969 original works better then the new one did.

Tank: with manual switch in normal position, all hoses connected and headlights off, turn off engine. Pull the hose from the tank to the manual switch. If tank is holding vacuum you should hear it escape to normal pressure. If not tank is either not getting vacuum (bad small length of hose) or has a leak.

So with this testing process you have narrowed it down to a key component, or decided to go electric due to amount of mechanical issues or poor vacuum due to rebuilding with new performance cam.

If you are sticking with factory - An external vacuum source can help testing if you find weak engine vacuum and want to see if the headlight doors are in working order. A new hose kit is the cheapest fix if mechanically everything seems to be working. Most kits include the check valve and are under 100 bucks. New headlight switches are available but I would only buy the real part with porcelain rheostat as I've seen a few buddy's go cheap and end up buying one a year or so on daily drivers. I replaced the manual valve and was disappointed by the quality - even though it is a licensed GM part.

Hope this helps you determine whats the issue with your RS headlights.
Brian


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post #4 of 9 (permalink) Old May 24th, 11, 11:17 AM
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Re: 1969 ralley sport - vacuum?

Very nice job Brian! Good read as I just received my RS hose kit from Ricks (CI brand).

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post #5 of 9 (permalink) Old May 24th, 11, 11:58 AM
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Re: 1969 ralley sport - vacuum?

Here's a tech article on the '69 RS Vacuum system...

https://www.camaros.net/techref/articles/ftecref001.html

Keep in mind the article follows the assembly manual and other GM documentation with respect to hose stripe color and placement. It is believed the red and green should be reversed at the vacuum relay so you have green on top and red on the lower position.

...Dennis

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post #6 of 9 (permalink) Old May 24th, 11, 02:52 PM Thread Starter
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Re: 1969 ralley sport - vacuum?

That was the best troubleshooting I have ever seen. Can't wait to get home and try it. By the way I have a 40,000 mile survivor 69 pacer. They seem to be reversed at the manual switch.
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post #7 of 9 (permalink) Old May 24th, 11, 06:56 PM
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Re: 1969 ralley sport - vacuum?

I may revise it with some pictures and produce a true flow chart troubleshooting guide but for banging it out before running out the door to work this morning I think you can follow it and get the major parts tested. I found that sometimes you can just shunt the vacuum line to the green stripe hose and they pop open but sometimes you have to block the red hose and flutter your finger over the red hose. Don't know why - maybe be unique to my girl only. I like to hear if others who try this trouble shooting flow chart also have to flutter their other hose to affect a change in door position.

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post #8 of 9 (permalink) Old May 24th, 11, 07:15 PM
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Re: 1969 ralley sport - vacuum?

Quote:
Originally Posted by camfreak1 View Post
That was the best troubleshooting I have ever seen. Can't wait to get home and try it. By the way I have a 40,000 mile survivor 69 pacer. They seem to be reversed at the manual switch.
There is often talk of the AIM having the hose stripe colors reversed, but they follow a traffic control signal on the manual valve, red top, yellow middle, green on the bottom. My original and reproduction valves have R Y and G stamped on the body next to the hose bib for reference, but who could see it once the switch is mounted, left alone with your head upside down resting on the exhaust manifold.

I would love to see some pics of a true survivor Z11. I lost the majority of my before pictures - I took slides back in the day thinking the better quality bla bla bla. So now 20 something years later most are lost, ones left are faded out and worthless for the most part. I know I have some paint issues to straighten up, and I cleaned up my firewall - I actually rubbed off the T P B stamps cause I had no clue back then what they were. Somewhere I have a shoebox with the POP, original q-jet and a bunch of assorted paperwork, but I have no idea where the safe spot I put it in back in 1983 was. LOL its either still safe or long gone.

Brian


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post #9 of 9 (permalink) Old May 24th, 11, 07:27 PM Thread Starter
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Re: 1969 ralley sport - vacuum?

Send me an email and i will send some pics. [email protected] Thanks
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