430 hp 500 # trq=16 second car? - Team Camaro Tech
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post #1 of 13 (permalink) Old May 26th, 00, 03:22 PM Thread Starter
 
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We took our chevelle to Bandimere Speedway for the first time to practice for high school drags and we were disapointed. Itís a 1970 SS396 with 454 making @ 425 hp and @500+ lb trq. Complete engine specs here
We weighed it with a ful tank of gas and driver @ 4000 lb.
Here are the times

R/T.......0.347 heheh
60í.......2.052
330.......7.023
1/8.......10.533
MPH.......69.88
1000.......13.571
1/4.......16.139
MPH.......87.98

---It has 4.11 rear posi 12 bolt with BFG
---295/50/15 on 8Ē corvette rims
---Tourque Converter 2000 stall
---750 Quadra Jet not Holley DP with .5" spacer


I really want to get in the 14s bad before the high school drags

When high school drags come we will uncap the exhaust and maybe advance the timing, maybe take out rear seat and passenger. Maybe that'll help?

PLEASE HELP

Rob


[This message has been edited by Buddy (edited 05-26-2000).]

[This message has been edited by Buddy (edited 05-26-2000).]
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post #2 of 13 (permalink) Old May 26th, 00, 05:54 PM
DjD
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Are your secondaries opening? With all that torque did you have a traction problem? Give us some more info!

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post #3 of 13 (permalink) Old May 26th, 00, 07:20 PM
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How much timing are you runing?What size is the exhaust?Did you check and see if your throttle is opening all the way?
I just checked your combo on the desktop dyno with the info you gave and it said low 14's another thing I noticed on your specs was the rocker ratio you have 1.55 it should be 1.7 should it not?

[This message has been edited by craggar (edited 05-26-2000).]
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post #4 of 13 (permalink) Old May 27th, 00, 06:23 AM
 
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Something is way wrong... or you arent pumping as much horsepower to the rear wheel as you think
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post #5 of 13 (permalink) Old May 27th, 00, 08:18 AM
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Yes,something sounds wrong here.Judging by your 60' times traction didn't seem too bad,but that is a very low E.T./MPH for that combo IMO.I would try to uncork that exhaust also,but you are going to have to tune the carb in for this change to get the best results.See if you can do this before the H.S. night.Good luck!

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post #6 of 13 (permalink) Old May 27th, 00, 02:39 PM Thread Starter
 
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-Secondaries are opening my dad thinks the jets are to small, and we haven't fined tuned the 750 dp to yet because lack of time so we just slapped on our oringinal choice of carb. a 750 Q jet it is tuned somewhat
-Traction Problem HAHAHAHHAHAHA I wish, the only problem I have is never being able to get em to squeel besides shifting!
-Timing: only done it by ear so don't know, tomorrow we will do it by light since my dad is borrowing one
-Rockers: I'm an beginer so I don't know much about them, maybe they are 1.7

Hopefully ole "Q" (quadrajet) will pull us into the 14s
I really want to get there

Rob
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post #7 of 13 (permalink) Old May 28th, 00, 10:56 AM
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i saw in your set up ( with a full tank ) i hope you don't run it this way,too much weight.your really gonna have to tune it up a lot, 60' ain't bad,i would also check your tranny for slipage.also you say it dosen't spin off the line,something amiss?...i run a 68Camaro (3400lbs,1/4 tank,with driver) 400sb,750vs,making est 400hp,350th w/ shift kit ,2.73 posi and with 245/60/15's have run a best of [email protected] good luck and keep us posted. (p.s. yes the rear is getting ditched,gotta 4.10 to put in,some day?)

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post #8 of 13 (permalink) Old May 29th, 00, 08:44 AM
 
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I saw your combination and even with the problem of that Colo. elavation (5200'+)your
car should run low 14's to high 13's.Setting
timing by ear is not the way to go.Beg,barrow
or buy a good timing light and check your
initial and your total timing.Think about go
ing to DOT drag tires or slicks but if you have to stay with the radials so be it.You
might what to play with tire air pressure.If
you are doing burnouts with the radials stay
out of the water.Work with tuning the carb
and look at the spark plugs to see if your
are running rich or lean.See if your track has any test and tune days.That way you can
make changes and run the car to see if they
helped or hurt.Make only one change at a time
if you make more than this at a time it's
eazy to get lost and not know what helped and what hurt.DougC was right about running
a 1/4 tank of gas, you don't need the extra
added weight.With 10:1 compression that 110
octane fuel is hurting and not helping you.It
is slowing the combustion flame travel.You
should run 93octane and keep an eye on the
timing and read the plugs.Keep records of what changes you are making, save your time
slips and if your track or someone at the track can provide you with weather info keep
a record of it also.By the way nice job on
your web page.Good luck and good tuning.

DaveP
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post #9 of 13 (permalink) Old May 31st, 00, 07:19 AM Thread Starter
 
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ok people the results are in and they are inconclusive

On sunday we advanced the timing and swapped in the quadra jet. Took it for a test drive and I must say it kept pullling in 3rd gear that we had no road left So I was thrilled. When we went to buy gas my dad noticed there was a lot of pressure on the cap so after fueling up he sent us to buy a new cap. This new cap he drilled 2 or 3 small holes in them.

The next day at bandimere speedway, my brother shifted by himself and messed up so bad time. My turn I let it shift itself and it pulled off the line till around 900 ft it fell flat on its face then I quickley eased the throttle then gunned it again. I thought it died on me and then restarted or something. My dad and brother thought I left it in 2nd gear and almost blew the engine but I didn't think so. So my brother goes and he says he experienced the same thing so my dad concluded that the q wasn't getting fuel. SO he hurriedly tore off the top of the Q before my round was called up and raised the float. Now its my 2nd trial run and I go this time I half expected the bog and I did get one but I reacted to it quickly and turned out a good ET 15.691
Then its my brothers first elemination run, he gets the bog but doesn't react to it and loses the race. And during his run I was watching gas come out of the cap. SO I thought with all the tourque the gas is being pushed back and not being fed to the carb. So I fish out the old gas cap without holes and replace it. Now its my first elemination run. I'm up against a girl hick with whips and stuff on an old ford truck running 19s. I dialed in at 16.00 trying to get the best of both worlds, no bog and bog. Needless to say she redlighted so I half throttled it till the 1/8 then floored it. I won that round and didn't get any bog so I the problem was cured. Now for my second elemination run- I'm up against a caddy running 19s and he gets a R/T of .503 wow and so I wait for my light to turn green then go flooring it all the way and no bog. but right when I'm next to him I tried to brake it so I could win but I braked to late. My ET with braking the last 300 or so ft was 15.301. I know the car can get into 14s now with the Q. TOday were gonna go to test and tune and TRY to dial in the holley 750 DP.

Here are the times starting with the first elemination round of my brother than me and me again

my brother
R/T..0.916
60'..2.326
330..6.524
1/8..10.82
MPH..59.34
1000..14.397
1/4..17.367
MPH..76.47

me
1.062
2.649
7.707
11.743
64.23
14.923
17.49
88.85

me again
0.994
2.35
6.282
9.65
71.83
12.591
15.306
76.47


Thanks Rob
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post #10 of 13 (permalink) Old May 31st, 00, 09:58 AM
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Sounds like the secondaries are opening too fast and it's bogging, or you are running out of fuel. Remember as you richen up the carb you are increasing fuel demand, the Q Jet has a very small float bowl, so very little fuel reserve. You'll get a lot of air when the secondary air valve opens too fast but engine vaccum will drop to nothing and a lot of the fuel in the intake will turn from vapor to liquid because it is no longer under high vaccum. Also fuel will not be pulled out of the brass tubes you see under the secondary air valve because there isn't enough vaccum.
Any Q jet rebuild kit has instructions for the base setting of the secondary air valve. Make shure you didn't remove the vaccum can that controlls it. Many people remove too many parts from the carb thinking they are "improving" it.
David

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[This message has been edited by davidpozzi (edited 05-31-2000).]
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post #11 of 13 (permalink) Old May 31st, 00, 10:30 AM
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Buy the July,00 Hot Rod Magazine, there is a QJet article in it, it has common mistakes people do. Should be on the newsstand now.
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post #12 of 13 (permalink) Old Jun 1st, 00, 01:19 PM Thread Starter
 
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go to this page for all my times slips information and adjustment made. http://ss396.8m.com/racelog.htm
You should have works or excel to see it but I converted it to text format for those who don't have it.

Rob
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post #13 of 13 (permalink) Old Jun 2nd, 00, 04:41 AM
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As davidpozzi mentioned, the July Hot Rod has an article on Qjets. However, what I got from the article was that these carbs are very difficult to set-up, but once dialed in, they are very good carbs. You may want to consider sending your carb to the company that worked on the carb in the article.

Pontiac used the 840 cfm version of the Qjet on the SD-455 in 73-74. This engine was rated at a lowly 360hp, but with over 500 ft-lbs of torque. I understand these engines were significantly underrated (where have you heard that before?) and were closer to 450hp. So, the Qjet can be used in a very high performance application.
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