What caused this? - Team Camaro Tech
Brakes, Suspension & Steering Conversion questions, Steering & Handling

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #1 of 16 (permalink) Old Apr 23rd, 07, 02:05 PM Thread Starter
Senior Tech
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: San Jose, Ca
Posts: 1,030
What caused this?

I found this on my car the other day. It is where the sway bar was supported to the chassis on the passengers side. Maybe hard right turns? Not sure. I was told by a guy that has done similar repairs, that he has seen it on about 20 other Camaros and it is usually on the passenger side, to boot.



To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Mister G is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 16 (permalink) Old Apr 23rd, 07, 02:25 PM
Senior Tech
CDJr
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Shreveport, LA
Posts: 426
Re: What caused this?

WOWEE! Is it torn or are my eyes decieving me?
CDJr is offline  
post #3 of 16 (permalink) Old Apr 23rd, 07, 02:50 PM Thread Starter
Senior Tech
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: San Jose, Ca
Posts: 1,030
Re: What caused this?

Nope. It ripped right out.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Mister G is offline  
 
post #4 of 16 (permalink) Old Apr 23rd, 07, 02:56 PM
DjD
Retired
Dennis
 
DjD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: Fortuna, CA
Posts: 26,435
Garage
Re: What caused this?

Wow! Has a certain young man been driving the 1st gen Guy? Looks like sideshow damage to me... If you read this Ron it part of being young to be the scape goat... Kinda like letting one go when everyone is hanging out watching the tube and if it smells blaming the dog. who's fixing it Guy?

...Dennis

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


"Don't take life so serious, you won't get out alive..."
DjD is offline  
post #5 of 16 (permalink) Old Apr 23rd, 07, 03:03 PM
Senior Tech
Blaine
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Lodi,California
Posts: 540
Re: What caused this?

i'm sure david pozzi has seen this before he'll probly be able to tell you exactley what caused it. but you probley allready know.

Don't forget to post your results
it's good for the thread
My 67 RS/SS/396

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
blainedoe is offline  
post #6 of 16 (permalink) Old Apr 23rd, 07, 03:15 PM Thread Starter
Senior Tech
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: San Jose, Ca
Posts: 1,030
Re: What caused this?

Dennis,

Actually he had it the week before when he took the pictures up near Uvas. Perhaps it is because we have new tires on it that is what caused it. Grip is pretty awesome, actually.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Mister G is offline  
post #7 of 16 (permalink) Old Apr 23rd, 07, 09:27 PM
Senior Tech
Jon
 
Rodder's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Roswell, GA
Posts: 1,431
Send a message via AIM to Rodder Send a message via Yahoo to Rodder
Re: What caused this?

I ripped out the driver side on mine a couple of years ago, fixed it, and just ripped out the passenger side last week. Need to fix the passenger side now. Both of mine just stripped the bolts out of the frame, they didn't tear the rail. I fixed the drivers side by taping a couple of wrenches together, and taping a nut into the wrench on the end, and threading a stud up from the bottom. Next time I'm just going to drill the hole out a little and fish bolts down from the top.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
- LS1, T56, Hooker longtubes, Autokraft pan & mounts, GM LS7 clutch, Borla ProXS, Moser/Strange/Wilwood 9", Covans dash, UltraLite IIs, Procar Elites, Vintage Air GEN-IV, AGR 12:1 steering, Addco swaybars, Hydratech hydroboost
Rodder is offline  
post #8 of 16 (permalink) Old Apr 25th, 07, 07:15 AM Thread Starter
Senior Tech
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: San Jose, Ca
Posts: 1,030
Re: What caused this?

Any suggestions on how to fix this? I thought about running two bolts through the rail and up to the top, but now I am thinking of cutting out the section and welding in a new plate. Thoughts, please?



To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Mister G is offline  
post #9 of 16 (permalink) Old Apr 25th, 07, 09:16 AM
Senior Tech
Tom
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Rochester Mn
Posts: 7,725
Talking Re: What caused this?

To Repair this I would : 1) remove sway bar 2) Hammer old frame back to original 3) Weld tear in frame. 4) grind frame smooth. 5) Make a plate 1/8" thick or so to place over the damaged area 6) Weld plate to frame. This is just an outline. You may want to treat frame before you weld plate on and drill sway bar mounting holes etc.

69 Camaro -originally a LM1 car. 327, Edelbrock E-streets, hooker, DUI performance distributors, ultradyne cam, stewart, TRW etc. Vintage Air, AGR steering, Corbeau GTSII seats, 700R4 transmission, 12-bolt w/Eaton 4.11:1
TJS69 is offline  
post #10 of 16 (permalink) Old Apr 25th, 07, 10:34 AM
Senior Tech
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: S.F Bay Area
Posts: 652
Re: What caused this?

We all know it has to welded so... the only question is how to beef it up so this doesn't happen again.
TJS69 has a good plan with the plate, but if you didn't want to have a plate on the outside of the frame your other option would be;
1. slip a piece of 1/2" round stock behind the tear, grind a nice groove in the crack (1/4 wide) and weld the frame to the bar.

For strength, your better off to weld a piece of flat bar (3/16 x 2-1/2") on the outside of the frame passing the crack by at least 2-1/2" each side.
Drill a couple holes so you can use your existing mounting nuts.

You can probably do all this with just removing the bolts and pushing the sway bar away from the repair area.

Good luck,

Rich

AFR Heads W/ Jesel valve train

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

67 RS / SS

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Rich-Allen is offline  
post #11 of 16 (permalink) Old Apr 25th, 07, 01:05 PM
Senior Tech
Bret
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: ohio
Posts: 1,014
Re: What caused this?

If you're not able to weld or have it welded, try this? Fabricate a plate from 1/4" flat stock that will be larger than the footprint of the area the s/b bushing brakcet attaches to. Drill & tap two holes that line up with the holes in the frame, and insert this plate inside the frame. This plate will then sandwich the frame and s/b bushing bracket all together.

Bret Copsey
'68 Camaro base coupe
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

'51 Chevy 3/4ton
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
bretcopsey is offline  
post #12 of 16 (permalink) Old Apr 25th, 07, 03:16 PM
Moderator
David Pozzi
 
davidpozzi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 1999
Location: Central California, USA
Posts: 10,062
Re: What caused this?

Tearing out the threads in the subframe is a known problem. Tearing the frame is unusual in my experience but not suprising once a crack starts, it's going to go somewhere!

I'd close the tear, then weld it shut. Then drill out the two antiroll bar holes because the frame is swedged inward to make the threads, they stick up inside the frame and willl hit any plate you put in there. There also may be a "bump" in the frame right above the bar the plate will have to clear.

I'd make a plate as large as you can to fit inside the frame. You can shove it in from the front opening in the frame, or if a spring is removed you can slip it in from the spring pocket area. I'd make it from 3/16" plate, then weld two nuts on top of it for the antiroll bar,OR make it from 3/8" plate and just thread it, 1/4" plate would work, but it's not a lot of thickness for threads by the time you countersink each end for deburring. The idea is to spread the pull of the antiroll bar on the frame inside. It looks like this car made a LOT of hard right hand turns! Maybe freeway on ramps?

Check my web page for First Gen Camaro suspension info:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

67 RS 327 original owner. 1965 Lola T-70
davidpozzi is offline  
post #13 of 16 (permalink) Old Apr 26th, 07, 05:20 AM
Gold Lifetime Member
Jerome
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Renton, Wa.
Posts: 1,999
Re: What caused this?

Quote:
Originally Posted by davidpozzi View Post
Tearing out the threads in the subframe is a known problem. Tearing the frame is unusual in my experience but not suprising once a crack starts, it's going to go somewhere!

I'd close the tear, then weld it shut. Then drill out the two antiroll bar holes because the frame is swedged inward to make the threads, they stick up inside the frame and willl hit any plate you put in there. There also may be a "bump" in the frame right above the bar the plate will have to clear.

I'd make a plate as large as you can to fit inside the frame. You can shove it in from the front opening in the frame, or if a spring is removed you can slip it in from the spring pocket area. I'd make it from 3/16" plate, then weld two nuts on top of it for the antiroll bar,OR make it from 3/8" plate and just thread it, 1/4" plate would work, but it's not a lot of thickness for threads by the time you countersink each end for deburring. The idea is to spread the pull of the antiroll bar on the frame inside. It looks like this car made a LOT of hard right hand turns! Maybe freeway on ramps?
Good Morning David ,as you stated Lots of hard right hand turns ,casual to medium driving with the Hotchkis T V S suspension (big sway bar ) will not be an issue? I kinda figured the added stress on the threads (insufficient amount for the added dia. And load put on them )would eventually pull out, but I did not think about a crack developing from the skip weld ,but the load put on that area (and G M did not probley design that area strong enough for a big sway bar )so would you agree that casual to medium driving should not be an issue??(I am at a point where I can do the fix you suggested by minimal disassembly she is still 2 ft. in the air ) Thanks for your response and always Happy Motoring

1972 Nova SS , 350, Auto, AC, Survivor

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
68Lemans blue is offline  
post #14 of 16 (permalink) Old Jun 17th, 07, 09:49 PM
Senior Tech
Jon
 
Rodder's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Roswell, GA
Posts: 1,431
Send a message via AIM to Rodder Send a message via Yahoo to Rodder
Re: What caused this?

Finally got around to fixing the pass side. I drilled out the holes in the frame, drilled/tapped a 3/8 steel plate, ran some 1-1/4 long 3/8-16 bolts through the plate, tack welded the bolts to the plate to keep them from moving, fed an 18ga wire through the rear hole fish it through the front of the subframe, and then used the wire to pull the plate down the rail and the bolt through the hole. I think it is sitting on top of the bump inside the rail that David mentioned, any thought on how that's going to come back and bite me?

Also ran into one other problem. The original spacing between the bolts is 2 1/2". With 3/8 bolts and the Addco 1 1/8" sway bar, there is no room to get a socket between nut and the bracket. When I do it over again, I'll slot one or both bolt holes in the frame, and fab my plate with 2 7/8" spacing between the bolts.







To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
- LS1, T56, Hooker longtubes, Autokraft pan & mounts, GM LS7 clutch, Borla ProXS, Moser/Strange/Wilwood 9", Covans dash, UltraLite IIs, Procar Elites, Vintage Air GEN-IV, AGR 12:1 steering, Addco swaybars, Hydratech hydroboost
Rodder is offline  
post #15 of 16 (permalink) Old Jun 18th, 07, 07:03 PM
Senior Tech
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: North Attleboro,MA USA
Posts: 523
Re: What caused this?

I saw this original thread just as I was installing my new Addco 1-1/8" bar and it scared the stuff out of me! I made some 1/4" plates with nuts welded to them to put inside the frame. I had the springs out so they were easy to put in. I encountered the "bump" inside the frame so I milled a slot in the plates to clear the bump.I have my fingers crossed that these will work-I had never even heard of this problem before this post.

69 X77 Z/28
1980 Harley Tour Glide
67 Buick Special Sedan
66 Buick Special Conv.(Buicks are Paula's)
79 Trans Am rescue project,36000 original miles!
Peter Constantine is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Team Camaro Tech forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address.
NOTE we receive a lot of registrations with bad email addresses. IF you do not receive your confirmation email you will not be able to post. contact support and we will try and help.
Be sure you enter a valid email address and check your spam folder as well.



Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
wat caused this wykidd Performance 17 Feb 22nd, 07 07:27 PM
Battery drain being caused by alternator... desperately need help!! bigbadblown Electrical & Wiring 12 Jan 12th, 07 01:42 PM
What do you think caused these holes in the roof? jhilts Bench Racing 5 Dec 2nd, 05 01:55 PM
GPS caused this crash and death click Bench Racing 6 Aug 2nd, 05 01:56 PM
How to confirm smoke caused by valve seals? 68SSConvt Troubleshooting 9 May 29th, 02 05:30 AM

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome