Brakes Problem - Team Camaro Tech
Brakes, Suspension & Steering Conversion questions, Steering & Handling

 
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post #1 of 13 (permalink) Old Jun 26th, 08, 06:11 PM Thread Starter
Tyler
 
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Brakes Problem

I have a problem....my dad accidentaly poured power steering fluid into the brake reservior and my brakes went out on me! Even though he did this he does know what he is doing it was a late night and the containers looked the same(thats what he says!! haha) We have replaced lines, calipers, mastercylinder, Brake Booster because a buddy of ours said that if the power steering fluid cycles through the whole system all of the o-rings and rubber lines and etc. will swell up and or deteriorate. So we flushed the system multiple times and have replaced the list above and when you press on the brakes, they go to the floor and are very spongy like they where when they went out on me. We are able to bleed the brakes but it still seems like there is air in the system or something wrong. If you guys or gals have any suggestions of what else to do PLEASE, PLEASE tell me and try to descript the suggestions in some detail please and thank you!!
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post #2 of 13 (permalink) Old Jun 26th, 08, 06:50 PM
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Jim
 
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Re: Brakes Problem

There is still air in the system. Did you bench bleed the M/C first?
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post #3 of 13 (permalink) Old Jun 26th, 08, 07:00 PM
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Re: Brakes Problem

Why did you change the booster? Brake fluid does not go thru the booster.

Check the old master and the new master and see if the input shaft depth is the same. Some come with a sleeve or spacer in the back of them. there have been many problems noted with the brake pedal rod to master fitment causing this problem.

For kicks put the old booster back on, cuz ther aint nothing wrong with it.

Ive had alot of luck gravity bleeding my brakes when i run into issues.

Hatya

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post #4 of 13 (permalink) Old Jun 26th, 08, 09:28 PM
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Re: Brakes Problem

1st
The power steering will noy effect the rubber/neprene seals etc in the btake system...
Its more likely brake fluid c ould mess up powersteering seals etc
Clairification?
Have u replaced as in purchaed new units and put or just removed and cleaned out and replaced?

U say the brakes went out on u before the wrong fliud issue...what happened back then?

All u needed to do was, bleed thru 2 or 3 master cylinder fulls thru each wheel,starting at the closest to master cylinder, then start at the fartherest and bleed back... that would have cleared everything out.

My Spelling is not incorrect...it is creative

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post #5 of 13 (permalink) Old Jun 27th, 08, 05:27 AM
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Re: Brakes Problem

I bet the fluid in the brakes just boild and not trashed the rubber stuff. a good flushing should have done it. The booster for sure should be O.K. Is the rod adjustable to the master? Are you sure there is no air? I can tell you its real hard to get all the air out even with a mityvac. Getting air to move down hill under water is very hard.
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post #6 of 13 (permalink) Old Jun 27th, 08, 05:52 AM
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Re: Brakes Problem

Ok on this sometimes you just havt to gravity bleed them to death just diid the same thing.Fill the master clyinder up replase the top but dont put the lock on the cap open up the rear passenger sid line first connect a hose to the bleeder run it ot a jar and let her drip.Check the master cylinder of fluid and refill when low.Do evey wheell.Before you start pump the bracks slowy than spot and start bleeding .Youi are going to need a big bottle of fluid but it work for me.Sometimes when you get a half way peddle if you can drive it than bring it back and repeat the bleeding process one more time or until you fiil the pedal is where it should be.Took me Three tries now I have all the air out and great pedal feel.
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post #7 of 13 (permalink) Old Jun 27th, 08, 08:57 AM Thread Starter
Tyler
 
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Re: Brakes Problem

Thanks everyone i will give all of your ideas a try and go from there
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post #8 of 13 (permalink) Old Jun 27th, 08, 10:21 AM
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Re: Brakes Problem

Compare booster pushrods there are two lengths, and two depths of master cyl rear holes. Get the wrong combo, and the brakes won't bleed.

Also make sure your brake bleeders are at the top of the caliper, not pointing down.
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post #9 of 13 (permalink) Old Jun 27th, 08, 04:24 PM
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Re: Brakes Problem

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steptoe View Post
1st
The power steering will noy effect the rubber/neprene seals etc in the btake system...
Ohhh yes it will. The linings and seals in the brake system are not compatible with the petroleum based oils like power steering, trans, and engine oils, and will cause them to eventually swell, which results in lines that swell shut, seals that leak, seals that no longer pull pistons back, and the seal on the resevoir cap not fitting anymore, among other goofy things it will do.

One other trick to try is to bleed right at the master cylinder. Pump up brakes like you normally would then crack the lines right at the master. After that move on and rebleed the brakes normally.

NEVER argue with a stupid person. They bring you down to their level, and then beat you with experience.
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post #10 of 13 (permalink) Old Jun 27th, 08, 05:37 PM
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Re: Brakes Problem

Quote:
Ohhh yes it will. The linings and seals in the brake system are not compatible.....
Sry its the other way around...dig deeper in seal compound properties etc
If fact you will find many of the compound properties of modern neoprene seals are interchangable.
But if u go back 30 odd yrs ago...yes what u say is true
Technology has come a long way since then but many old school perseptions remain.

My Spelling is not incorrect...it is creative

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post #11 of 13 (permalink) Old Jun 27th, 08, 07:02 PM
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Re: Brakes Problem

Steptoe, if you are right, why would you assume he has modern neoprene seals, our cars are not modern

But, thanks for the info
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post #12 of 13 (permalink) Old Jun 27th, 08, 11:07 PM
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Re: Brakes Problem

Quote:
Originally Posted by 400bird View Post
Steptoe, if you are right, why would you assume he has modern neoprene seals, our cars are not modern
But, thanks for the info
For 1 thing because our cars are not modern then there is no way the orginal seals are still there....even without use long before now the cylinders would have corrided, orginal seal broken down by now because they where not Stainless and the seals are not of compounds made with todays technology...
eg my orginal cylinders have been honed resealed, and finaly replaced in '86 the master cylinder, same, and replaced about 12 months ago
The discs are orginal, new cylinders in 86, and new seals about 12 months ago.
2nd I make the assumption that the guys here are not stupid enough to run their expensive classic cars in a condition to kill themselves or others thru negelet.

My Spelling is not incorrect...it is creative

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post #13 of 13 (permalink) Old Jun 28th, 08, 01:53 PM
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Re: Brakes Problem

This is directly from GM service information.

NOTICE: Power steering fluid, engine oil, brake fluid, or any other mineral based fluids cannot be mixed. If brake seals contact power steering fluid, or steering seals contact brake fluid, seal damage will result.

NOTICE: When filling the master cylinder, use only Delco Supreme 11, GM P/N 12377967 (Canadian P/N 992667), or equivalent DOT 3 brake fluid. Do not use a container which has been used for petroleum based fluids, or a container which is wet with water. Petroleum based fluids will cause swelling and distortion of rubber parts in the hydraulic brake system, and water will mix with brake fluid, lowering the boiling point. Keep all fluid containers capped to prevent contamination.

This information is from an 08 vehicle. Contaminated fluid in the brake system can and will destroy the rubber components, i have seen it happen on many occasions, no matter if they are old or modern. Some of the compounds in the seals may be the same, yes, but all seals and hoses are made with certain properties specially formulated for whatever fluids they will be used with. Some can be interchanged even, but when it comes to brake fluid... no.

NEVER argue with a stupid person. They bring you down to their level, and then beat you with experience.
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