leaf springs=>Hotchkis,Landrum or Eaton? - Team Camaro Tech
Brakes, Suspension & Steering Conversion questions, Steering & Handling

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post #1 of 22 (permalink) Old Oct 18th, 01, 06:01 AM Thread Starter
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Markus
 
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O.k. itīs an often discussed item. But :
I want to buy leaf springs for my 69`Camaro.
I want to get a good handling ("Pro-Touring").
What type/brand of leaf springs are the best choice ?
Any tips ? Order numbers ?
Experiences ?

Thanks !

Markus



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post #2 of 22 (permalink) Old Oct 18th, 01, 07:26 AM
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I bought a pair of the Hotchkis three leaf springs. They look good to me. I don't have them on yet to say how they work.
The lowest leaf is like a traction bar, the front bushing is stock for a good ride and rear bushings are polly for stability.
There might be different height rear springs available for lowering or get stock height and use lowering blocks if you need it lower.
Lowering blocks are not ideal but OK if they are not too thick like over 1".
David

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67 RS 327
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[This message has been edited by davidpozzi (edited 10-24-2001).]
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post #3 of 22 (permalink) Old Oct 18th, 01, 08:43 AM
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I installed the landrums mono...Went in perfect/easy..Ride feel was good and hookup was improved greatly..

Good luck

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post #4 of 22 (permalink) Old Oct 18th, 01, 02:22 PM
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David,

I have two questions in response to your post..
A) you say that the third leaf is like a traction bar. So does that do away with the need for traction bars?

B) when do you plan on installing yours to test them out? Haven't you had those for a while now?

Kevin



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Kevin

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post #5 of 22 (permalink) Old Oct 18th, 01, 03:52 PM
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I bought them about a month and a half ago. My car won't be running til next year sometime. It won't be finished, but hopefully running.
The Hotchkis springs are similar to the Guldstrand springs I have but have stock size spring eyes instead of the bronze bushings the Guldstrand springs have.
The Guldstrand springs were terrible on the street because of the solid bushings. I could not keep my rear view mirror adjusted it would rattle down out of position.
BUT the Guldstrand springs allowed the car to hook up better than what I had before, which was single leaf springs with traction bars.

With a well built rear spring, you should not need any added traction bars etc.
The spring is built stiffer in the front half and there are no short leaves like on a stock spring.
I believe this takes away a little of the rising rate of a stock spring, but the Hotchkis spring still is a rising rate spring.
I tried to do some spring rating of my own, but friction on the floor and between the leaf's caused some repeatability problems when measuring.
David

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Check my web page for First Gen Camaro suspension info:
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post #6 of 22 (permalink) Old Oct 19th, 01, 09:30 AM
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I have the Hotchkis front and rear springs and I love the stance of the car. The rear springs do hook up alot better than stock, but if you have 375hp or more you still will burn the tires off.



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Jay
69 SS-350 4-speed
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post #7 of 22 (permalink) Old Oct 19th, 01, 01:39 PM
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David,

Looking at Summit's catalogue they show a stock and a competition Hotchkis rear spring for first gens.

Do you know what's the difference between them?

Jorge
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post #8 of 22 (permalink) Old Oct 21st, 01, 02:45 PM
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Jaybird:
Can you post pictures of your car showing the stance?
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post #9 of 22 (permalink) Old Oct 21st, 01, 05:48 PM
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jmr,
My Summit catalog only shows one rear spring - HSS2407.
Hotchkis only shows one rear spring on their web site, the 2407C, they used to sell a 2407 which had no hardware or shackles, the 2407C has shackles and rear bushings, front bushings are installed.
Here is a photo of the Hotchkis spring.

The Detroit Speed rear springs should be good too. I haven't seen them yet though.
David

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Check my web page for First Gen Camaro suspension info:
David's Motorsports page
First Gen Suspension Page
67 RS 327
69 Camaro Vintage Racer
65 Lola T-70 Chev 350 Can-Am Vintage Racer

[This message has been edited by davidpozzi (edited 10-21-2001).]

[This message has been edited by davidpozzi (edited 10-24-2001).]
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post #10 of 22 (permalink) Old Oct 22nd, 01, 04:47 AM
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Coach420,

I dont have any current pictures since I've installed the springs and I now have the motor out.


Sorry!


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post #11 of 22 (permalink) Old Oct 22nd, 01, 10:22 AM
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I purchased my rear springs from Detroit-Eaton just before Hotchkis came out with their's. I wish I waited! I ordered a 1.5" drop from stock with a 175 lbs. rate. The rate seems fine but I had to send the springs back, at my expense of course, because the drop from stock was at least 2.5". Way too low! I had them re-arch to 1.5" drop but they still seem low. Not satisfied to say the least but not going to sink any more cash into those springs! The Hotchkis spring looks good to me and will get a set if/when my Detroit-Eaton's sag.

Joseph
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post #12 of 22 (permalink) Old Oct 22nd, 01, 10:36 AM
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I have 3 leaf Eaton springs on my 64 nova and they seem great. They are stock ride height, and they were only about 120$ for the pair. I have about 2k miles on them and they are real solid. Of course I dont have a posi rear yet so its hard to tell how well they'llhold up to some hard acceleration. It has a crate 350 and th350 trany so its got power.
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post #13 of 22 (permalink) Old Oct 24th, 01, 03:08 PM
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He, He!!! I gotta!!

David,

You are gonna have ta get "Big Bertha" ta sit on those suckers while they are setting on a pair of re-inforced Skateboards on top of a truck scales for "accurate, repeatable measurements". LOL, LOL!!! I'm splitting a gut!!!

pdq67



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post #14 of 22 (permalink) Old Oct 24th, 01, 04:15 PM
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pdq,
I figured out my race trailer has over 900 lbs tongue weight so I'm lowering the trailer hitch onto the spring with a hydraulic scale sitting on top of the spring.
My problem is the spring on concrete friction and interleaf friction.
David

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Check my web page for First Gen Camaro suspension info:
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First Gen Suspension Page
67 RS 327
69 Camaro Vintage Racer
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post #15 of 22 (permalink) Old Oct 24th, 01, 08:41 PM
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OK,
First, I'm still alive after the spring slipped out from under the trailer hitch with 700 lbs of force on it!
Wasn't actually too bad, nuthin hit me!

I used my alignment turntables under the spring eye ends to allow float. This made a %100 difference in repeatablity of the readings.
Here is how I did it:
I first figured the weight on the spring, or "load".
I looked up an old rear weight I had for my 67 with full tank and spare tire-1600 lbs. I subtracted the weight of the 12 bolt rear end with brakes-185 lbs, plus half the springs weight-35 lbs= 220. I didn't figure shocks because they don't weigh much.
I got 1380 lbs rear weight, the weight on one spring is 690 lbs.
I used 700 lbs as my "test weight".

Now, to test a variable rate leaf spring you are supposed to measure the rate one inch above and below the normal ride height.
Then average the two rates to come up with the spring rate at normal ride height.
I decided to use a half inch above and below and measure the difference between them, which would give an automatic average spring rate in lbs per inch.
I got 160 lbs rate at normal ride height with an arch of 3/4" measured from a line between the spring eyes to the top of the spring pack, and measured at the center bolt location.
What was very interesting was the next inch of droop was 80 lbs per inch, the next TWO inches were 80 lbs per inch TOO!
I think the main thing that is happening with this spring is the two main leaf's are providing the 80 lbs, the short leaf is not touching until the last inch, then adding quite a bit of rate, like double the rate.

The front of this spring is VERY stiff and the main deflection is the rear "half".
At full deflection, the center bolt area was about 3/4" higher than the front of the spring about six inches behind the front eye.
I should add, my accuracy could be off by 10 or 15 lbs becuase the guage I used only has 100 lb increments on the dial. I had to guess at the exact numbers.
The hydraulic load cell I used was off my home made coil spring checker.
David

------------------
Check my web page for First Gen Camaro suspension info:
David's Motorsports page
First Gen Suspension Page
67 RS 327
69 Camaro Vintage Racer
65 Lola T-70 Chev 350 Can-Am Vintage Racer

[This message has been edited by davidpozzi (edited 10-24-2001).]

[This message has been edited by davidpozzi (edited 10-26-2001).]
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