Intake and Carb Selection Help - Team Camaro Tech
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post #1 of 11 (permalink) Old Feb 3rd, 08, 08:56 AM Thread Starter
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Intake and Carb Selection Help

Looking for suggestions on intake and carb selction for my 350 build. Here are some of the specifics and expectations:

bored .040
stock crank (polished)
stock rods
SealPro Hyp Pistons
Comp Cam .488 exhaust and intake lift w/ hyd flat tap lifters
double hump heads (370s) just professionally rebuilt - 2.02 and 1.6 SS valves - screw in studs - guide plates - stainless steel roller rockers (1.6 ratio) - hardened stock length push rods
headers - suggestions?

Engine is for my 69 Nova SS and is mainly going to be driven to cruise-ins and local shows. Not sure how much hp I'm going to have (maybe 350-400?) but it will be much better than stock. Just want it to sound mean.

I was thinking Edelbrock Performer or RPM with a Holley Street Advenger (670), maybe an AirGap. Worth the extra $$$$? Thoughts or suggestions? Thanks!!

Tim

1968 RSSS BB 396/325 AC TH-400 Black/Red (Sold)
1969 Nova SS 350 M-20 Red/Black (Original)
1967 Chevelle SS (Clone)(Project)
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post #2 of 11 (permalink) Old Feb 3rd, 08, 09:46 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Intake and Carb Selection Help

Forgot to mention it will have the original Muncie 4-speed and power front disc brakes.

1968 RSSS BB 396/325 AC TH-400 Black/Red (Sold)
1969 Nova SS 350 M-20 Red/Black (Original)
1967 Chevelle SS (Clone)(Project)
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post #3 of 11 (permalink) Old Feb 3rd, 08, 09:46 AM
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Re: Intake and Carb Selection Help

Need a bit more information:

On your cam what is the duration @050, Comp Cams P/N would help too.
Is this mostly a street driven car? Track car?


Holly's Carb selection tool:
http://www.holley.com/data/TechServi...Carburetor.pdf

I would try to match the RPM range of your heads to your cam to your choice of headers and intake. If you do that you will make the most power across the rpm range. Mismatching those parts will cost a lot of potential power.

Your cam's RPM Range is probably 2000 -6000 (hard to tell without more numbers but based on in/ex lift #s you gave)

Intake ranges you mentioned (from Edelbrock's site):
Performer Intake: Idle - 5500
Performer Air Gap: Idle - 5500
Performer RPM: 1500- 6500
Performer RPM Air Gap: 1500-6500

I would expect one would pick up a few extra HP/TQ from the denser Fuel/mixture with an Air Gap but you will want to check to make sure you have the hood clearance to fit that manifold. I would probably go with a Performer RPM Air Gap based on your cam choice ( Hard to tell without flow numbers from your heads, your cam could be too radical for your heads or vice versa)

A good article on choosing your exhaust system:
http://www.popularhotrodding.com/eng...exh/index.html

If you want it to sound mean I would go with a straight through high flow muffler like Magnaflow rather than mismatching engine parts (too radical of a cam) to get the sound you want.

Ed

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post #4 of 11 (permalink) Old Feb 3rd, 08, 01:06 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Intake and Carb Selection Help

Thanks for the info! Good point on the AirGap intake, I'm using stock hood on the Nova. May not fit. Maybe I should stick to just the RPM manifold. Here is my cam:

Xtreme Energy XE268H Cam

Cam Style: Hydraulic flat tappet
Basic Operating RPM Range: 1,600-5,800
Intake Duration at 050 inch Lift: 224
Exhaust Duration at 050 inch Lift: 230
Duration at 050 inch Lift: 224 int./230 exh.
Advertised Intake Duration: 268
Advertised Exhaust Duration: 280
Advertised Duration: 268 int./280 exh.
Intake Valve Lift with Factory Rocker Arm Ratio: 0.477 in.
Exhaust Valve Lift with Factory Rocker Arm Ratio: 0.480 in.
Valve Lift with Factory Rocker Arm Ratio: 0.477 int./0.480 exh. lift
Lobe Separation (degrees): 110
Intake Valve Lash: 0.000 in.
Exhaust Valve Lash: 0.000 in.
Computer Controlled Compatible: No
Grind Number: CS XE268H-10

Not sure about the head flow nembers, but here is what was done to them. Nothing drastic:

Heads are thoroughly cleaned and inspected
Pressure tested to ensure no cracks or leaks
Machined with 16 BRONZE THICK WALL GUIDES, not the flimsy guide liners
3 ANGLE Valve job / Pocket Ported under valve seats
CBN milled to ensure straightness within .0015" and correct finish
All machine work performed on the latest state of the art equipment
All new 3/8 screw in studs and guide plates installed
Heads are assembled with new stainless 2.02 swirl polished intake valves
Heads are assembled with new stainless 1.60 swirl polished exhaust valves
Heads are machined with new hardened exhaust seats for unleaded fuel
Heads are assembled with hardened valve keepers
Heads are assembled with new .550 lift valve springs
Heads are assembled with new valve seal

Car won't see the strip, only street. Thanks!

1968 RSSS BB 396/325 AC TH-400 Black/Red (Sold)
1969 Nova SS 350 M-20 Red/Black (Original)
1967 Chevelle SS (Clone)(Project)
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post #5 of 11 (permalink) Old Feb 3rd, 08, 05:08 PM
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Re: Intake and Carb Selection Help

With a bit of searching around I came up with these as flow numbers for your heads (no idea if they are correct but they are probably close enough for bench racing purposes):

Intake
.100 60
.200 122
.300 167
.400 190
.500 199
.600 203
.700 203

Exhaust
.100 40
.200 80
.300 114
.400 128
.500 135
.600 143

So it looks like at about .500 lift your heads are done on the intake side and mostly done on the exhaust side.

So the stock lift on your cam 0.477 int./0.480 exh, becomes (multiplied by 1.07 i.e. 1.5 / 1.6 since you have the 1.6 rockers) - 0.510 in / 0.514 ex which matches lift wise to the peak flow numbers on your heads (no point in going more lift on the came side if your heads can't use it).

So based on this info I'd probably go with the Performer Intake since you are really looking at the Idle to 5500/5800 range with both your cam and heads. Edelbrock has a page to show you how to measure to see if the Air Gap will fit, you should try measuring and if you got the space go with a Performer Air Gap for a little extra power:

http://www.edelbrock.com/automotive_...lds_main.shtml


Good luck! Let us know how it turns out.

Flow data sources:
http://neptune.spacebears.com/cars/s.../360cylhd.html
http://users.erols.com/srweiss/tablehdc.htm#Chevy
http://racingfeed.com/downloads/chevy_flow_data.pdf
http://www.purplesagetradingpost.com...fo/heads1.html

Ed

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post #6 of 11 (permalink) Old Feb 3rd, 08, 08:47 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Intake and Carb Selection Help

Thanks for the great information!!! Don't have the original intake for the measurements. Since the operating range of the cam is 1600-5800 should I go with the RPM or the performer as you suggest? May not make much difference on the street. Does the Holley Street Avenger 670 seem to be a good fit for this application? Again, thanks for all the info, I know that took some time. BIG HELP!!!

1968 RSSS BB 396/325 AC TH-400 Black/Red (Sold)
1969 Nova SS 350 M-20 Red/Black (Original)
1967 Chevelle SS (Clone)(Project)
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post #7 of 11 (permalink) Old Feb 3rd, 08, 10:01 PM
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Re: Intake and Carb Selection Help

Yes your on target with the 670. As for the intake if you can fit it with a 3" cleaner without a drop base go for a little added power of the Airgap. But if you'll have to use a drop base cleaner to clear the Airgap then your better off with the performer. As for the decision to go with the standard intake or the rpm it really comes down to how you plan to drive the car. I know you said it isn't a street/strip set-up so if most of your shifts will be at or under 3k, and you won't be up over 5k much then the standard intake is the better choice. But with it being mainly a weekend cruiser I would also go with the rpm version because you'll be driving to have fun not get groceries.


"Be who you are and say what you feel, because those mind don't matter, and those who matter don't mind."-Dr. Seuss
We learn life's important lessons in kindergarten.

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post #8 of 11 (permalink) Old Feb 10th, 08, 11:35 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Intake and Carb Selection Help

I notice that the Performer Series is Idel - 5500 rpm and the RPM Series is 1500 - 6500 rpm. Since my cam's advertised operating range is 1600 - 5800 rpm would I be better off with the RPM? Still considering the Air Gap but still need to choose between the Perfromer and RPM. Many Thanks Guys!!!

1968 RSSS BB 396/325 AC TH-400 Black/Red (Sold)
1969 Nova SS 350 M-20 Red/Black (Original)
1967 Chevelle SS (Clone)(Project)
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post #9 of 11 (permalink) Old Feb 10th, 08, 11:47 AM
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Re: Intake and Carb Selection Help

Probably mostly a matter of preference.

I'd probably go with the Performer especially on a street driven car, should give you a little bit more low end torque which generally is funner on the street vs strip where you are more concerned with top end power (WOT). With your Nova's weight the Performer would probably make your car seem a bit more "peppy". Really all depends if you ever plan on going more radical in your cam the RPM might prevent you from having to buy yet another intake.

Ed

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post #10 of 11 (permalink) Old Feb 10th, 08, 11:56 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Intake and Carb Selection Help

Thanks BigBlock1969RS, you've been a big help during this process. I believe I will go with the Perfromer, maybe even the Perfomer Air-Gap, with 670 Holley Street Avenger. I'll tackle the header/exhaust system later.

1968 RSSS BB 396/325 AC TH-400 Black/Red (Sold)
1969 Nova SS 350 M-20 Red/Black (Original)
1967 Chevelle SS (Clone)(Project)
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post #11 of 11 (permalink) Old Feb 10th, 08, 12:49 PM
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Re: Intake and Carb Selection Help

Your welcome, keep us updated on what you do, and take plenty of picx for sharing

Ed

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