327ci engine with no PCV valve is building pressure!!?? what to do!? - Team Camaro Tech
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post #1 of 11 (permalink) Old Jan 21st, 10, 05:07 PM Thread Starter
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guillaumeb
 
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327ci engine with no PCV valve is building pressure!!?? what to do!?

Hi, I'm presently trying to get my engine running, missing only a couple of things...
Today, i realized that when I crank the engine for like 10-15 seconds (not starting), i hear a PSSSSSSSSSssss sound...
After looking for a while, i realized that the sound comes from the oil dipstick...and when I remove it, there is a lot of pressure coming out from the base.
I know this isn't normal...and can be bad for the seals, etc...
My engine has no PCV valve... should a 327 from 1968 have one?
My valve covers don't have any hole in them to install one, and i've been told that they were original... true?
Where does the pressure goes out from the base on an engine which doesn't have a PVC valve?
Thanks in advance!
All your help is always much appreciated!!
G.b.
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post #2 of 11 (permalink) Old Jan 21st, 10, 05:12 PM
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Re: 327ci engine with no PCV valve is building pressure!!?? what to do

'68 had it on the passenger side, it should have stamped steel valve covers with holes in both valve covers with baffles, one for PCV one for air cleaner to valve cover.
I think pre '68 used a road draft tube under the intake in the galley for crank case evac, it was messy. Maybe that is really what you have.

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post #3 of 11 (permalink) Old Jan 21st, 10, 05:24 PM
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Smile Re: 327ci engine with no PCV valve is building pressure!!?? what to do

Many camaros had the PCV in the oil fill tube at the front of the intake manifold.

69 Camaro -originally a LM1 car. 327, Edelbrock E-streets, hooker, DUI performance distributors, ultradyne cam, stewart, TRW etc. Vintage Air, AGR steering, Corbeau GTSII seats, 700R4 transmission, 12-bolt w/Eaton 4.11:1
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post #4 of 11 (permalink) Old Jan 21st, 10, 05:26 PM
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Wink Re: 327ci engine with no PCV valve is building pressure!!?? what to do

Quote:
Originally Posted by ace's68 View Post
'68 had it on the passenger side, it should have stamped steel valve covers with holes in both valve covers with baffles, one for PCV one for air cleaner to valve cover.
I think pre '68 used a road draft tube ... it was messy...
1968's used a "Closed" ventilation system as discribed above.
(ps: no american car used a 'Road Draft' tube system after 1962 - they were illegal after that date )
1967 engines did not have ports in the valve covers to install air-intake or PVC into - all 1968 and later Small blocks did.

You might be able to get away with installing a 1967 style 'Semi-closed' breather capped Oil Fill tube until you can get the correct valve covers and parts. This would replace the original twist cap oil fill tube the engine should have now.
Most of the auto parts stores that carry cheap-chrome accessories should have them ...

Be aware that some of your problem may be stuck, frozen or non-seated (if the engine is a new rebuild) rings causing excessive 'blow-by'.
You may see a decrease in pressure once that is addressed or as the engine is run - BUT, you should still install a properly functioning PVC system to assure the engine operates correctly.

If you do a search on the site for PVC I'll bet you'll find a ton of good reading and pictures of what you need

Quote:
Originally Posted by TJS69 View Post
Many camaros had the PCV in the oil fill tube at the front of the intake manifold.
That is a 1967 only design.

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post #5 of 11 (permalink) Old Jan 21st, 10, 05:38 PM Thread Starter
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Re: 327ci engine with no PCV valve is building pressure!!?? what to do

Nice informations!!! thanks a lot again!

My car is a 1968 but has been built end of 1967 and delivered january 1968, can anyone confirm if I should have the 1967 style PCV or the 1968 style? I'm trying to make my car as original as possible...
Also, Could i remove the valve covers and drill holes in them, adding the grommets and everything?
By the way, everything is new and the rings are probably not seated, but anyway, i want to fix the problem as the engine presently has NO ventilation for the crankcase and am worried that seals can blow, I won't run the engine until this is fixed...

If I hear right, I should also have a tube from the air filter to the other valve cover?? Damn, I have nothing like that!

g.b.
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post #6 of 11 (permalink) Old Jan 21st, 10, 06:12 PM
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Smile Re: 327ci engine with no PCV valve is building pressure!!?? what to do

[QUOTE=Vintage 68;1365476]1968's used a "Closed" ventilation system as discribed above.
ps: no american car used a 'Road Draft' tube system after 1962 - they were illegal after that date QUOTE]

My 327 is from a 1965 full size Chevrolet. It had the road draft tube system with the "can" under the intake etc.

69 Camaro -originally a LM1 car. 327, Edelbrock E-streets, hooker, DUI performance distributors, ultradyne cam, stewart, TRW etc. Vintage Air, AGR steering, Corbeau GTSII seats, 700R4 transmission, 12-bolt w/Eaton 4.11:1
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post #7 of 11 (permalink) Old Jan 21st, 10, 06:26 PM
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Re: 327ci engine with no PCV valve is building pressure!!?? what to do

Quote:
Originally Posted by guillaumeber View Post
Nice informations!!! thanks a lot again!

My car is a 1968 but has been built end of 1967 and delivered january 1968, can anyone confirm if I should have the 1967 style PCV or the 1968 style? I'm trying to make my car as original as possible...
Also, Could i remove the valve covers and drill holes in them, adding the grommets and everything?
By the way, everything is new and the rings are probably not seated, but anyway, i want to fix the problem as the engine presently has NO ventilation for the crankcase and am worried that seals can blow, I won't run the engine until this is fixed...

If I hear right, I should also have a tube from the air filter to the other valve cover?? Damn, I have nothing like that!

g.b.
You are correct, it's a larger diameter shorter tube bent to a closed snorkel type air cleaner.
what kind of rings did you use?
the rings should have seated if you turned the motor over at all, if not, you need to do a couple of hard runs, varying speed and rpm of each, then decelerate to seat them properly, in a way, "drive it like you stole it" actually will seat the rings better than babying it. Make sure the cam is broken in.
John had some pretty good info posted, I didn't know that about the draft tube.
I agree, you can find what your looking for at most auto zones, pcv valve, and breather for the passenger side, not stock appearing, but it does function properly.

One easy way to tell if you have a '67 or 8 motor is if it has a spin on oil filter, or the canister style. It sounds like you may have a '67 motor, if it's a '68 car, I don't know if they did that or not...

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post #8 of 11 (permalink) Old Jan 21st, 10, 07:05 PM
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Wink Re: 327ci engine with no PCV valve is building pressure!!?? what to do

It's a 1968 model year car, even though it was manufactured in 1967
It will have a 1968 PVC system on it.

I certified these vehicles when new, I know what was on them from the factory.
Yes, I'm old ...

Oh, and "Draft Tubes" were legislated out in 1962 (we just think the gov. getting involved in our vehicles is something new ... ).
Don't care if you believe me or not - look it up.
The provision for the Oil Separation Canister in the upper rear of the block was retained through the 1967 casting runs - then removed.
NO vehicle leaving a US factory destined for sale in the US was equiped with a 'draft tube' after 1962

Glad I could help.

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post #9 of 11 (permalink) Old Jan 21st, 10, 09:21 PM
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Smile Re: 327ci engine with no PCV valve is building pressure!!?? what to do

John, I am not doubting you at all. I just want to know what type of system, my 327 had in '65. I always thought that it was the road draft tube. What is it ?

69 Camaro -originally a LM1 car. 327, Edelbrock E-streets, hooker, DUI performance distributors, ultradyne cam, stewart, TRW etc. Vintage Air, AGR steering, Corbeau GTSII seats, 700R4 transmission, 12-bolt w/Eaton 4.11:1
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post #10 of 11 (permalink) Old Jan 22nd, 10, 01:51 PM
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Thumbs up Re: 327ci engine with no PCV valve is building pressure!!?? what to do

It would depend on original engine type and intake set-up.
Some L-6's and V-8's had a tube fitting installed into the original draft-tube port that hooked into the base of the air cleaner pan (early air cleaners used a flat[ish] base pan and then a 'cake-cover' top stamping that went over the element - the opposite orientation of most 1966/67 and later air cleaners ... ) and a 'Breather' cap was installed on the Oil Fill tube, or valve cover for 6's.
The above design systems just used the pressure in the crankcase to push any vapors into the air cleaner so they would get sucked into the carb and burned.

The majority of small V-8's, including 327's, from 1962 ~65 had a fitting in the oil fill tube that had a small orifice in it to meter a small amount of crankcase vapor through to a fitting at the base of the carb. This system was sort-of a 'small vacuum leak' that could pull vapors out of the crankcase and prevent it venting to the outside.
There was a large tube assembly that was installed into the rear port (where 'draft tubes' were installed for 1955~61 V-8's) and it plugged into a hole fitting in the base of the air cleaner assembly (a base plate and a top 'cake cover' stamping, with the snorkle on it).
I've owned both a 62 and a 65 327 equiped car that had this system.
Here is a picture of this type of system on a 65 'vette;
Click image for larger version

Name:	1965 Corvette 327 Stock PCV.jpg
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Please pay no attention to the modern carb type and other mods - it's the PC hook-up we're looking at
All 396's, introduced in the 1965 model year, had PCV system with the valve installed into the passenger side valve cover.
All 1966 and later engines had a PCV installed in replacement to the orific system used in earlier years.
The 1966~67 small blocks with a "Closed" PCV system - used a PCV installed in the oil fill tube.
The 1966~67 small blocks with a "Semi-closed" system - used a PCV in a hose routed to the adapter tube installed in the rear port of the block. This adapter looks like an 'upside-down' Dixie cup with a fitting on it.

Some smaller engine types from GM just used a 'T' in a vent line from the fuel pump into the base of the carb. There was a very small orifice in a brass fitting for the tube that limited the vacuum flow - 'sorta' ... folks had a habit of loosing or removing the orifice for some reason.

This applied to all vehicles.
These were not combersome "Smog" systems that required much if any service, like the 1967~68 on systems, so many people that owned these cars never even knew they were there.
I recently helped a buddy redo a system for his 1962 Jeep and get the system woking again. It had a piece of small vacuum tubing hooked from the fuel pump vent through a small valve then 'T'ed into a vacuum line going to the intake - took some time looking through Jeep literature to find the correct hook-up as it had all been removed years before he got the jeep.

Hope some of this helps, let me know if you need a specific part referal or information.

John

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post #11 of 11 (permalink) Old Jan 22nd, 10, 02:29 PM
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Re: 327ci engine with no PCV valve is building pressure!!?? what to do

Quote:
Originally Posted by guillaumeber View Post
Nice informations!!! thanks a lot again!

My car is a 1968 but has been built end of 1967 and delivered january 1968, can anyone confirm if I should have the 1967 style PCV or the 1968 style? I'm trying to make my car as original as possible...
Also, Could i remove the valve covers and drill holes in them, adding the grommets and everything?
By the way, everything is new and the rings are probably not seated, but anyway, i want to fix the problem as the engine presently has NO ventilation for the crankcase and am worried that seals can blow, I won't run the engine until this is fixed...

If I hear right, I should also have a tube from the air filter to the other valve cover?? Damn, I have nothing like that!

g.b.
If origionality is your goal check out CRG: http://www.camaros.org/index.shtml That is the site's main objective. There is a great deal of data there and pics, including your PCV issue.
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