Head sizing - Team Camaro Tech
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post #1 of 8 (permalink) Old Feb 9th, 10, 05:49 PM Thread Starter
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Head sizing

Area Dart Iron Eagle heads (215cc) too much head for a 350 (bored .030)?

Looking at a used set locally, but don't know if it is bette rintended for a 383 or larger stroker small block, or if they will run fine on a 350 build.

At this time, I do not know what cam, etc I might be looknig at, but woud have TRW forged flat tops (4 valve relief) pistons.

Also, I am trying to find out the specific part number on the heads to find out what cc the chambers are...

Keith
1967 Camaro
406, 10:1, comp xr282HR, Dart Iron Eagle 200cc, Holley Contender dual plane, Holley 750 DP
Muncie M-20
GM 8.5, 3.73 posi
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post #2 of 8 (permalink) Old Feb 9th, 10, 06:38 PM
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Wink Re: head sizing

That's sort of a "how high is up" type question

Depends on the rest of your set-up and how you intend to use you car specificly.

They aren't 'to big' - if;
* you have the cam and valve train to flow them
* you have the exhaust system to support them
* you have and intake matched to they flow needs
* you have the gearing to support the higher RPM band to get useable torque range
* you don't mind RPM'ing the engine for standard street uses - or - you intend to mainly race the car and can keep the engine in the required RPM range
* you can live with the higher Idle required
* you don't need much Vacuum signal for brakes or accessories
* ...

I think you get the idea.
They're nice heads for the right application, but will be 'to big' if your intended use falls out of the above by very much.

You are usually 'money ahead' to spend your dollars on well matched parts for your intended use and needs vs. picking up 'cool' speed parts used.
Unless you intend to go much farther with your build in the near future you can get by with a much smaller port.

You might want to look into GM or aftermarket Vortec's for a nice reasonable head choice.
They have @ 170cc port and flow in the low 200's (@225) with a .490~.500" lift.
They will support HP in the mid 400's with the right cam and exhaust.

Hope this helps ...

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post #3 of 8 (permalink) Old Feb 9th, 10, 06:50 PM
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Steiner
 
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Re: head sizing

This is straight from Dart:

http://www.dartheads.com/customer_se...view.php?qk=34

'69 Camaro
Dart 400-AFR 195-224/224 HR-Powerjection III TB with F.A.S.T. Sportsman XFI
TKO 600-Moser 3.42-Detroit Truetrac
500hp/538lbft

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post #4 of 8 (permalink) Old Feb 9th, 10, 06:57 PM
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Re: head sizing

I think they'll be on the too big side of the coin unless this is an all-out strip car.

68 Camaro~LSx ~all motor
1.54 60'--6.95 @ 98.45 660'--10.96 @ 121.53
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post #5 of 8 (permalink) Old Feb 9th, 10, 07:02 PM Thread Starter
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Re: head sizing

Not so concerned about "cool" speed parts, as I am about making the parts work together power-wise...
The motor will be for a street cruiser, not a racer...

Actually, I do not even have a car to put the motor in!

The motor I am considering building (I have never built one before) is the old 350 block that was in my Camaro (see my progression) prior to the 383...plan to re-use the pistons, crank, etc, but not the 76cc heads that were on it (882's).

Not in any rush to buy heads per se, but the price for these might be right, so I was just wondering if they would be a good buy, or just be too much head for what I would be looking to do--cruisable power somewhere in the 350-400+ range (for my first build). I have DART Iron Eagle 200's on my 383, and am pretty happy with them on that motor, but that is way more stout than the 350 that was in the car...

Then I would just need to find the right machine to put it in, and worthy of taking up space next to my '67...Maybe a 78-81 Z-28 or a 66-67 Malibu...only time will tell!

Keith
1967 Camaro
406, 10:1, comp xr282HR, Dart Iron Eagle 200cc, Holley Contender dual plane, Holley 750 DP
Muncie M-20
GM 8.5, 3.73 posi
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post #6 of 8 (permalink) Old Feb 9th, 10, 07:23 PM
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Re: head sizing

If you're building a street cruiser that will get hammered on once in a while.... There are better/cheaper heads that will do what you want and do it better.

I think something in the 170-180 range would be better... Vortecs seem to be decent.

68 Camaro~LSx ~all motor
1.54 60'--6.95 @ 98.45 660'--10.96 @ 121.53
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post #7 of 8 (permalink) Old Feb 9th, 10, 07:29 PM
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Steiner
 
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Re: head sizing

Heck, if you can get a good deal then get 'em. Looking at the progression of your '67 it looks like it would only be a matter of time before that 350 street morphed into something that could use that big of a head.

'69 Camaro
Dart 400-AFR 195-224/224 HR-Powerjection III TB with F.A.S.T. Sportsman XFI
TKO 600-Moser 3.42-Detroit Truetrac
500hp/538lbft

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'69 Camaro Beater-SFT 327-M20-Moser 4.10-sold
'02 Z/28 vert-stock-sold and totaled
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post #8 of 8 (permalink) Old Feb 10th, 10, 06:29 AM
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Re: Head sizing

I tend to agree with the Dart recommendations.if I were building from scratch that is about where I would start.In your case,if you are looking to make over 400hp right now I would take the deal on the 215's.The chart is somewhat more important in selecting a minimum heads size for a certain power level,but you can go higher if you know how to make it work.Choose an intake that is designed for the actual operating range you seek to run.PORT match the intake to the heads at least 1 inch into each port.Porting the intake sound counter productive in this case,but if you leave the mismatch,you will loose some of the signal from the cylinders as the heads try to pull air from a flat surface such as the intake manifold face.I believe that this is where most of the perceived power loss is when comparing cylinder heads.If you ever choose to step up the power level you can just buy a bigger intake.

And of course if you are starting with an empty 350 block,I recommend a good 383 crank kit.The newer kits are less expensive then seeking out and machining old junk,and are the same cost as a new 355 kit.They come with specifically profiled rods that usually require no grinding and no reduced base circle cam,and are often internally balanced,which eliminates a lot of the historic nightmares that came with the first cobbled together stroker setups.

Good luck.
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