Cam and lifter ??? - Team Camaro Tech
Engine General Engine Discussion.

 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #1 of 13 (permalink) Old Feb 26th, 10, 09:05 PM Thread Starter
Gold Lifetime Member
Gary
 
69Z28's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Delaware
Posts: 3,325
Cam and lifter ???

Looking at a solid and a hydraulic flat tappet camshaft side by side, is it easy to tell which is which?


How about the lifters? How to tell the difference?

06A 1969 Camaro Z28 X33D80 69 B 711 Black Stripes Console w/tach and gauges.
69Z28 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 13 (permalink) Old Feb 27th, 10, 06:39 AM
Super Moderator
Bess-68's rule
 
Everett#2390's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Va Beach VA
Posts: 31,723
Garage
Re: Cam and lifter ???

Two ways to tell:
1. Solid lifter will be heavier in weight
2. Remove the pushrod cup, solid will be solid; hydraulic will have a inner cylinder.

Other suggestions?

Give a man a rescued dog for the health of both their souls. May 2017 ROTM Winner - Thank you!
'
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
CUBS - 2016 World Series Champions - Thank you, Joe Madden enjoy your next chapter.
Everett#2390 is offline  
post #3 of 13 (permalink) Old Feb 27th, 10, 08:37 AM Thread Starter
Gold Lifetime Member
Gary
 
69Z28's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Delaware
Posts: 3,325
Re: Cam and lifter ???

Were the lobe profiles different between the solid and hyd? I'm asking because I can't remember which cam I have is the -140 2nd design solid. The other is a .480 lift hyd.

On the lifters one set has the small wire style keeper to hold the plunger in and the other has a true arch style keeper and the plunger sits down lower in the lifter body.

06A 1969 Camaro Z28 X33D80 69 B 711 Black Stripes Console w/tach and gauges.
69Z28 is offline  
 
post #4 of 13 (permalink) Old Feb 27th, 10, 09:32 AM
Senior Tech
Rich
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: North Jersey
Posts: 1,463
Re: Cam and lifter ???

There is no visable diference in the cams themselves.Back in the day I read something about there being a different number of bands machined around the outside of hydraulic and solid lifers.I never remeber that one.When new you can push the pushrod pluger down on a hydraulic lifter{and it will pop back up) while a solid will be just that,solid.When used,hydraulic lifters should never rattle when shaken,but solids sometmes do,but not always.Good luck.
RichSchmidt is offline  
post #5 of 13 (permalink) Old Feb 27th, 10, 09:45 AM Thread Starter
Gold Lifetime Member
Gary
 
69Z28's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Delaware
Posts: 3,325
Re: Cam and lifter ???

I have been doing a search on the internet and it seems not many know much about camshafts. Most of the post I have read surfing the net give a pat answer to this question and some are just plan silly. Check this one out.

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/in...6193848AAgcNJl

and this: http://www.chevelles.com/forums/showthread.php?t=242126

Maybe the engine builders will enlighten us.

I'm fairly sure I know which is which by looking at mine. I know one is a solid and one is hydraulic and the lobe profiles are way different.


On the lifters there is a pat answer to that as well on the internet. Not very many know how to tell the difference by just looking at it.

06A 1969 Camaro Z28 X33D80 69 B 711 Black Stripes Console w/tach and gauges.
69Z28 is offline  
post #6 of 13 (permalink) Old Feb 28th, 10, 09:37 AM
Gold Lifetime Member
Steve
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: South Jersey
Posts: 1,441
Re: Cam and lifter ???

Can't answer your cam question but if you put a hyd lifter in a vise, you can slowly squeeze out the oil in them. Then watch the spring pop the cup back up. I just did this on my lifters to purge the old oil out before re-assembling the engine.

69 SS, 350/300 h.p., M-20, 12 bolt, matching numbers.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
reelknots is offline  
post #7 of 13 (permalink) Old Mar 3rd, 10, 11:06 AM
Team Member
John
 
JohnZ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Washington, Michigan USA
Posts: 7,728
Re: Cam and lifter ???

Here's the difference in the lifters.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	HydLifter.jpg
Views:	67
Size:	62.1 KB
ID:	14549   Click image for larger version

Name:	HydraulicLifter.jpg
Views:	78
Size:	95.0 KB
ID:	14550   Click image for larger version

Name:	SolidLifter.jpg
Views:	79
Size:	83.8 KB
ID:	14551  


JohnZ
CRG
JohnZ is offline  
post #8 of 13 (permalink) Old Mar 3rd, 10, 11:30 AM
Gold Lifetime Member
John
 
Vintage 68's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Moraga,Ca.,USA
Posts: 13,705
Wink Re: Cam and lifter ???

Quote:
Originally Posted by 69Z28 View Post
... one is a solid and one is hydraulic and the lobe profiles are way different.


On the lifters there is a pat answer to that as well on the internet. Not very many know how to tell the difference by just looking at it.
If you study the profiles, you will see the 'Solid' cam has a much smoother ramp design (or profile) than the hydraulic.
The hydraulic will have a fair steep ramp and a pretty 'pointy' max lift area - or peak - vs. the solids rather rounded lobe peak.

The lifters, as pointed out already, are easy to tell apart by construction.

1968 Convertible
Some trucks
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Other V8 things - some of which float
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Other V6 things - none of which float
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Oh yeah, and 1 "Straight-Six" ...
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


If a man says something in the garage - and his wife can't hear him - is he still wrong !!!
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Vintage 68 is offline  
post #9 of 13 (permalink) Old Mar 3rd, 10, 04:06 PM Thread Starter
Gold Lifetime Member
Gary
 
69Z28's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Delaware
Posts: 3,325
Re: Cam and lifter ???

Can anyone take a pick of a cam lobe on a -140 cam for me? I need to re-educate myself now. One of my cams is a -140, I need to find out which one.

06A 1969 Camaro Z28 X33D80 69 B 711 Black Stripes Console w/tach and gauges.
69Z28 is offline  
post #10 of 13 (permalink) Old Mar 5th, 10, 04:26 PM
Senior Tech
greg
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: minnesota
Posts: 143
Re: Cam and lifter ???

You know one cam has .480 lift so divide that by the 1.5 rocker ratio that the lift is figured on. Then measure from the bottom of the cam to the highest point of the lobe. Then measure the width or diameter of the cam lobe, side to side, and then subtract that from the first number you got and see what that number is, it should be your lobe lift. .480/1.5=.32 which should be your first number. Do you know if your .480 cam was a single profile or not?? You might check one intake lobe and one exhaust lobe and see if they are the same. If one cam has the same intake and exhaust number then it is probably not the 140 cam which is a split duration cam I think around .493/.512 .512/1.5=.3413 would be the number you subtract the diameter from on the exhaust lobe. If you have a digital caliper this may work for you.
docwilcar is offline  
post #11 of 13 (permalink) Old Mar 5th, 10, 05:20 PM Thread Starter
Gold Lifetime Member
Gary
 
69Z28's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Delaware
Posts: 3,325
Re: Cam and lifter ???

Quote:
Originally Posted by docwilcar View Post
You know one cam has .480 lift so divide that by the 1.5 rocker ratio that the lift is figured on. Then measure from the bottom of the cam to the highest point of the lobe. Then measure the width or diameter of the cam lobe, side to side, and then subtract that from the first number you got and see what that number is, it should be your lobe lift. .480/1.5=.32 which should be your first number. Do you know if your .480 cam was a single profile or not?? You might check one intake lobe and one exhaust lobe and see if they are the same. If one cam has the same intake and exhaust number then it is probably not the 140 cam which is a split duration cam I think around .493/.512 .512/1.5=.3413 would be the number you subtract the diameter from on the exhaust lobe. If you have a digital caliper this may work for you.

Sounds like a good thing to try. I don't have a caliper handy but I can get one.

Thanks

06A 1969 Camaro Z28 X33D80 69 B 711 Black Stripes Console w/tach and gauges.
69Z28 is offline  
post #12 of 13 (permalink) Old Mar 5th, 10, 06:04 PM
Senior Tech
Joe
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: OK
Posts: 1,187
Re: Cam and lifter ???

measure the cams with calipers
OK69 is offline  
post #13 of 13 (permalink) Old Mar 8th, 10, 09:04 AM
Team Member
John
 
JohnZ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Washington, Michigan USA
Posts: 7,728
Re: Cam and lifter ???

If it's a GM cam, the "-140" (P/N 3927140) cam will have at least the last four digits of the casting number (3927141) on the core. If it's the second design off-road cam (P/N 3965754), it will have at least the last four digits of the casting number (3965751) on the core.

Intake lobe lift on the -140 cam is .3286", and on the second-design cam it's .3412". Exhaust is .3412" and .3566" respectively.


JohnZ
CRG
JohnZ is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Team Camaro Tech forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address.
NOTE we receive a lot of registrations with bad email addresses. IF you do not receive your confirmation email you will not be able to post. contact support and we will try and help.
Be sure you enter a valid email address and check your spam folder as well.



Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome