Which Head and Cam combo?? - Team Camaro Tech
Engine General Engine Discussion.

 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #1 of 13 (permalink) Old Oct 21st, 14, 01:48 AM Thread Starter
Senior Tech
Dustin
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Tennessee
Posts: 109
Which Head and Cam combo??

I am about ready to start putting the 67 back together. Looking for some advice on which heads and cam to go with. After reading just about everything I an get my hands on, it is hard to discern which article is real and which one is done to pay the magazine ad costs. This is a street car that I will hopefully take to the track once in great while.

I have a 30 over 454 with all forged bottom end. Speed Pro 9.7 to 1 with a little bit of dome. Intake is an Edelbrock C427X. I know this is a rectangle port, but I am going to go with an oval port head. I have the 1.7 roller rockers and want to go with a hydraulic roller cam.

The last set up I had was the Edelbrock pn7162 (243/576) cam, roller rockers, Edelbrock 2.0 intake and a lightly worked over set of 781's with a Holley 750dp. Car was a blast to drive, just needed to be gone through and I figured I may as well add some more power and lose some weight.

Is it worth it to go to the roller set up, or just replace the heads and have fun. Hoping to get about 50-60 more hp/tq with heads only or heads and roller cam swap.

I have heard the AFR 265's are great and I am leaning that way but I know Edelbrock and Brodix are also great companies. Any head and cam combo's would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks

1967 RS Convertible, 454, M20 4-speed
dboz67rs is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 13 (permalink) Old Oct 21st, 14, 03:23 AM
Moderator
____
 
DOUG G's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 1999
Location: Maryland, USA
Posts: 19,437
Garage
Send a message via MSN to DOUG G
Re: Which Head and Cam combo??

http://www.profilerperformance.com/
AFR heads are not the end all/beat all heads out there. There are some better offerings out there

68 Camaro~LSx ~all motor
1.54 60'--6.95 @ 98.45 660'--10.96 @ 121.53
DOUG G is offline  
post #3 of 13 (permalink) Old Oct 21st, 14, 03:59 AM
Senior Tech
Steve
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Toronto
Posts: 777
Re: Which Head and Cam combo??

Do this right 'for you' and your car setup ... Just talk to Chris Straub for heads and cam options.

Steve

Steve
69' SS/RS X11 PRO-TOURING E-FORCE LS7, DSE Sub, T56 MAG, Recaro, Wilwood disc, Racepak IQ3S, SpeedTech TA/JRI CO's, Pro-Venom 250s, Forgeline CV3C 20/19 - SOLD
Sheck44 is offline  
 
post #4 of 13 (permalink) Old Oct 21st, 14, 05:44 AM
Gold Lifetime Member
Don
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: 2 Dog Town in West Texas
Posts: 11,154
Re: Which Head and Cam combo??

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sheck44 View Post
Do this right 'for you' and your car setup ... Just talk to Chris Straub for heads and cam options.

Steve
X2, Eliminating all the guess work. http://www.straubtechnologies.com/

Don
TC # 349
Zdld17:69 Z/RS,306, NOR141111, 9N554XXX, 12A, X3G, 59/59,723, AFR 195,CCC282/290HR, TKO 600, BU1122B1E Owner since Dec 1968

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
zdld17 is offline  
post #5 of 13 (permalink) Old Oct 21st, 14, 08:29 AM Thread Starter
Senior Tech
Dustin
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Tennessee
Posts: 109
Re: Which Head and Cam combo??

Thank you guys for the direction. I will get in touch with Chris.

1967 RS Convertible, 454, M20 4-speed
dboz67rs is offline  
post #6 of 13 (permalink) Old Oct 21st, 14, 09:17 AM
Senior Tech
Chris
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Tri-Cities, TN
Posts: 539
Re: Which Head and Cam combo??

Let us know what we can do.

Chris

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
cstraub is offline  
post #7 of 13 (permalink) Old Oct 26th, 14, 09:53 AM
Senior Tech
Tom
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Joplin
Posts: 1,377
Re: Which Head and Cam combo??

Try to swap for a C396 intake or get an RPM oval port.

71 Camaro 355 NA
11.1650 @ 119.30
1.5028 60'
hhott71 is offline  
post #8 of 13 (permalink) Old Oct 26th, 14, 02:45 PM
Senior Tech
Dave
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Tampa, Florida
Posts: 4,682
Re: Which Head and Cam combo??

Chris is a very good engine builder, and he is still making motors for sale to customers (I am not). He and I agree most of the time, but he generally likes to add about five more degrees of duration than I like for a street driven engine, and he favors a shorter lobe separation angle which builds more peak power, but it also lowers manifold vacuum due to the increased duration.

Basically duration is added to an engine build if you favor higher engine RPM's because it gives the engine the time it needs to suck in the air required to combust the fuel. Everything about building power in an internal combustion motor is all about getting as much air in as you can (which explains why blowers are so popular). Since air is a fluid it follows loosely most of the rules that are spelled out in the laws of fluid dynamic (mostly Bernoulli's equation, that others have added modifiers to over the years). Because air is compressible it doesn't follow all of the laws exactly but closely enough.

Like any fluid it takes time to get from a to b. It speeds up in an restricted channel and slows down in a broad one. Because of this there are as many people that swear by one head over another. the difference is in how they have put their engine together. At high RPM and larger displacement you need a larger port, slow down the air speed such as occurs on the street and you want a smaller port. It is about maintaining the flow velocity in the port all the way to the valve that determines the amount of power you will make.

That is why no one uses a rectangular port head (unless you have at least a 502 (540 is a better) minimum size but requires a 4.500 inch bore block which leaves a lot of 454 4.250 dia. bore blocks wanting), or have a car that lives on a trailer and is shifted at 7,500 RPM. By the way you are creating a huge weir in your port that will cause all kinds of havoc with air flow using that manifold with oval port heads (You need another intake manifold). Compare the price of rectangular port heads on e-Bay to oval port to illustrate how popular rectangular heads are today.

Brodix or AFR? You are not comparing apples to apples. Brodix and Dart include in their instruction sheet information telling you how thick and where in the port you are likely to hit water. This is because they fully expect you to port these heads to match your engines final needs. AFR is used right out of the box as is, and they state that you will ruin the head if you attempt to port or polish it. Trick Flo has recently discovered Chevys of late and has been making better heads than before if you believe the car rags. I am not going to even talk about buying off shore copies of other manufactures head designs, as you get what you pay for, and they are usually inferior in every way.

They were mostly Ford guys before, as Indy is to Chrysler and MTS is to Cadillac. Edelbrock is the Chevy of aftermarket heads. Entry level, and with a little work in bigger valves and stiffer springs, are probably the most bang for the buck. Which is why I ordered my Edelbrock heads bare and added bigger Manley valves and PAC springs. They also have quality good enough to meet GM's OEM requirements; and are used by GMPP for all of their aluminum manifolds and heads used on crate engines. Edelbrock has also been renting time on universities super computers to redesign their heads for wet flow. They did this earlier with their intake manifolds to noted success.

Big Dave
Larger Dave is offline  
post #9 of 13 (permalink) Old Nov 13th, 14, 03:45 PM Thread Starter
Senior Tech
Dustin
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Tennessee
Posts: 109
Re: Which Head and Cam combo??

I wanted to thank everyone for their help. I did talk with Chris and decided to go with one of his hr's, AFR's and all the other stuff needed to make it right.

I will keep you up to date.

Thanks again.

1967 RS Convertible, 454, M20 4-speed
dboz67rs is offline  
post #10 of 13 (permalink) Old Nov 13th, 14, 03:59 PM Thread Starter
Senior Tech
Dustin
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Tennessee
Posts: 109
Re: Which Head and Cam combo??

hhott71, I am looking for one. If you happen to see one, please let me know.
Thanks

1967 RS Convertible, 454, M20 4-speed
dboz67rs is offline  
post #11 of 13 (permalink) Old Nov 13th, 14, 04:54 PM
Senior Tech
Chris
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Tri-Cities, TN
Posts: 539
Re: Which Head and Cam combo??

Quote:
Originally Posted by dboz67rs View Post
I wanted to thank everyone for their help. I did talk with Chris and decided to go with one of his hr's, AFR's and all the other stuff needed to make it right.

I will keep you up to date.

Thanks again.
Enjoyed our time on the phone and the fact you knew where Halls River Rd was!!!!

Chris

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
cstraub is offline  
post #12 of 13 (permalink) Old Nov 13th, 14, 05:09 PM Thread Starter
Senior Tech
Dustin
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Tennessee
Posts: 109
Re: Which Head and Cam combo??

Yeah Chris, small world. Looking forward to making it rumble!

1967 RS Convertible, 454, M20 4-speed
dboz67rs is offline  
post #13 of 13 (permalink) Old Nov 13th, 14, 05:13 PM
Senior Tech
Chris
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Tri-Cities, TN
Posts: 539
Re: Which Head and Cam combo??

Quote:
Originally Posted by dboz67rs View Post
Yeah Chris, small world. Looking forward to making it rumble!

Buy stock in Goodyear.... you will need it!!!

Chris

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
cstraub is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Team Camaro Tech forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address.
NOTE we receive a lot of registrations with bad email addresses. IF you do not receive your confirmation email you will not be able to post. contact support and we will try and help.
Be sure you enter a valid email address and check your spam folder as well.



Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome