Rebuilt stock DBL hump heads vs aftermarket - Team Camaro Tech
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post #1 of 37 (permalink) Old Apr 9th, 15, 11:12 AM Thread Starter
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Rebuilt stock DBL hump heads vs aftermarket

Restoring my '69 base Camaro that has seen little use in the last 30 years I've owned it. 327 bored 30 over. I plan on putting on an Edelbrock performer 600 carb and Performer EPS intake. I'll be putting the stock exhaust manifolds back on the car. (currently has headers I put on 30 years ago. I did not know the motor was bored until I recently took the heads off for the 1st time) I put on a new double roller timing chain my buddy had laying around.

I pulled the stock "double bump" heads off and took the local machine shop to get an estimate of what shape they are in and what cost to put in hardened seats. Machine shop says castings are fine, but things are wore out. They want ~$1375 to put in:

new screw in studs (replace the stock pressed in)
valve guides
new springs
new stainless valves
new hardened seats

I was assuming I'd be paying less money for the head work. So with some brief looking I see http://www.jegs.com/i/Edelbrock/350/...43#moreDetails are roughly the same price.

So, I have a couple questions:

Is $1375 too much for the work described above?

What is a better head, my stock dbl humps rebuilt or new aluminum edelbrocks linked above? (pros/cons of each?)

I currently have two bent pushrods so I'd probably get a new set of push rods with my rebuilt heads (I see with the Edelbrocks I need a bit longer push rod with stock rockers, which are in my current heads)

The motor is not original to my car. It is however a 327 out of a '69 sedan.

1969 Plain Jane Camaro - Restoration in progress...327, M20 wide, 12 bolt 3:31

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post #2 of 37 (permalink) Old Apr 9th, 15, 11:52 AM
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Re: Rebuilt stock DBL hump heads vs aftermarket

I'd pick up the aftermarket heads. Cheaper, lighter, likely make more power and you can sell the original ones for a few hundred bucks to make them even cheaper.

Jason
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post #3 of 37 (permalink) Old Apr 9th, 15, 12:05 PM
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Re: Rebuilt stock DBL hump heads vs aftermarket

Well Dave sounds like a make work project to me. I can just hear that cash register in the machine shop going cha ching cha ching . First off I am now retired but I was an automotive machinist for 40 years. If you need al that work go buy yourself a set of Summit 152123 fuelly head replacements . They are good heads at half the price and they are new . I seriously doubt you need all that work . It is not a race motor. Do you need screw in studs nice to have but I doubt it for what you have , scratch that . Do you need all new valves , I doubt it maybe a couple but they can be ground and the stems polished if they are good to reuse. Doyou need all new valve springs yes you do RV 943X about 30 bucks good to .510 lift. Do you need all new seats absolutely not and the exh are probably fine . years ago we used to put new ones I but in all honesty I only saw about 3 cases of valve seat recession in all my years and we did boatloads of heads all kinds . The heads that were really bad had been overheated to kingdom come worked hard and poor maintenance . Here again I have not seen your heads but based on what I have seen this is my consensus. the other thing is this I would look for another shop he seems just a tad pricey for regular non race work . It ain,t a FERARI kid its a small block Chevy and I mean no disrespect to you or you car . RUN FORREST RUN and find another shop . Alex
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post #4 of 37 (permalink) Old Apr 9th, 15, 01:29 PM
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Re: Rebuilt stock DBL hump heads vs aftermarket

I would put the Edelbrocks on in a Heatbeat, they are decent heads for the money.
You will also need new head bolts w/washers.
I have them on a 350 in my parts hauler truck with a Lunati retro-roller cam and have been happy with the perfromance.

With a roller cam and lifters I ended up with a shorter pushrod and different valve springs, but I believe you are correct in needing a longer with a flat tappet cam. I assume thats what you are running.

I like the Edelbrock 650 AVS carb over the 600.
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post #5 of 37 (permalink) Old Apr 9th, 15, 01:43 PM
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Re: Rebuilt stock DBL hump heads vs aftermarket

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Originally Posted by Hogdaddy View Post
I would put the Edelbrocks on in a Heatbeat, they are decent heads for the money.
You will also need new head bolts w/washers.
I have them on a 350 in my parts hauler truck with a Lunati retro-roller cam and have been happy with the perfromance.

With a roller cam and lifters I ended up with a shorter pushrod and different valve springs, but I believe you are correct in needing a longer with a flat tappet cam. I assume thats what you are running.

I like the Edelbrock 650 AVS carb over the 600.
If you do end up with a shorter push rod, you may need to correct any rocker arm geometry. Just a suggestion.

Don
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post #6 of 37 (permalink) Old Apr 9th, 15, 02:28 PM
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Re: Rebuilt stock DBL hump heads vs aftermarket

delete please.

Last edited by Hogdaddy; Apr 9th, 15 at 02:42 PM.
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post #7 of 37 (permalink) Old Apr 9th, 15, 02:32 PM
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Re: Rebuilt stock DBL hump heads vs aftermarket

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Originally Posted by zdld17 View Post
If you do end up with a shorter push rod, you may need to correct any rocker arm geometry. Just a suggestion.
The rocker arm geometry is fine it's been several years ago that I built this combo.
No problems whatsoever. The roller lifters are longer than flat tappets IIRC. Although I could be wrong about using the shorter pushrod too its been a while and I tend to forget some these days.

To the OP I would make sure there is no interference with the double roller timing chain and the oil galley plugs as I had to clearance them with the Cloyes Hex-adjust chain.

1967 convertible T-1
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post #8 of 37 (permalink) Old Apr 9th, 15, 02:41 PM
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Re: Rebuilt stock DBL hump heads vs aftermarket

1375 I would say is not worth the investment for those heads. Sell them like was suggested. That kind of money you could buy a very good aluminum head. Shop around. Stay away from the Chinese stuff. Yeah, they are tempting because of the price, but I would just purchase a well known head.

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post #9 of 37 (permalink) Old Apr 9th, 15, 02:49 PM
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Smile Re: Rebuilt stock DBL hump heads vs aftermarket

The double hump heads are not worth putting money into them and not worth much if you did ! I had a hard time getting $350 for mine with stainless valves and screw in studs etc. They only had about 3000 miles on them.

I really like my Edelbrock E-streets. They are a great head ! I wouldn't mess with the replacement double humps. The ports are just to small on those ! 165cc vs 185cc on the E-streets.

Edelbrock 5089 Cylinder Head, E-Street Sold as a Pair on E-bay $970.49 with Free shipping

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post #10 of 37 (permalink) Old Apr 9th, 15, 02:58 PM
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Re: Rebuilt stock DBL hump heads vs aftermarket

I guess it depends how orignal you want your car to be. Are they date coded to your car? If you want a hot rod then make a hot rod, if you want a stock appearance then keep them. IT IS A LOT of money however. I bought some 68 camel humps like 2 years ago for a buddy that were original castings (non ported) and fully rebuilt for $600. He still has them today and they work great.

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post #11 of 37 (permalink) Old Apr 9th, 15, 03:09 PM
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Re: Rebuilt stock DBL hump heads vs aftermarket

New aluminum heads will need to be checked cause they are not perfect. You will have leaks in the seats among other places. Google it. I had my 70 Z28 heads done along with my engine rebuild and had hardened valve seats installed on the E valves. My prior engine rebuild was in '85 which I put on 50,779 mi with no valve recession. I did use a lead additive once in a while but not much plus Shell gas back in the 80's and early 90's had a lead substitute in it that I also used. If you want the engine to look stock as I did then go with the orig heads. Some of today's aluminum heads are JUNK. Do your research first.

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post #12 of 37 (permalink) Old Apr 9th, 15, 03:28 PM
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Re: Rebuilt stock DBL hump heads vs aftermarket

One other point to make here. I'm not sure original is what you are after, having said that you could always paint the aluminum head Chevy Orange like I did. They look great in Chevy Orange LOL.

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post #13 of 37 (permalink) Old Apr 9th, 15, 04:53 PM
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Re: Rebuilt stock DBL hump heads vs aftermarket

Quote:
Originally Posted by COPO View Post
New aluminum heads will need to be checked cause they are not perfect. You will have leaks in the seats among other places. Google it. I had my 70 Z28 heads done along with my engine rebuild and had hardened valve seats installed on the E valves. My prior engine rebuild was in '85 which I put on 50,779 mi with no valve recession. I did use a lead additive once in a while but not much plus Shell gas back in the 80's and early 90's had a lead substitute in it that I also used. If you want the engine to look stock as I did then go with the orig heads. Some of today's aluminum heads are JUNK. Do your research first.
I've used edlebrock, patriot, trickflow, AFR and procomps in the past 5 years and never had as issue

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post #14 of 37 (permalink) Old Apr 9th, 15, 05:01 PM
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Re: Rebuilt stock DBL hump heads vs aftermarket

You won't be disappointed with aftermarket heads.

But..... find someone else to look over the heads and give you an estimate for work you actually need. Why does he want to replace the rocker studs with screw ins? You don't need screw in studs with a stock type cam. Maybe I missed it, but are you installing a high lift roller that will require more spring pressure?

Why do the springs need replaced? They rarely wear out.

Get another opinion. Then you will know what you are dealing with.

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post #15 of 37 (permalink) Old Apr 9th, 15, 05:14 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Rebuilt stock DBL hump heads vs aftermarket

Thanks for all the input so far everyone. It is greatly appreciated. Tomorrow morning I'm going to find out more details from the place where the heads are currently as to the reason behind their estimate

I have lead on another local place to take the heads to for another opinion/estimate.

I'll keep you all posted.

1969 Plain Jane Camaro - Restoration in progress...327, M20 wide, 12 bolt 3:31

My Camaro history here -->

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