No Crank, help! new starter just makes loud click 1 of 4x ??? - Team Camaro Tech
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post #1 of 19 (permalink) Old May 17th, 15, 06:50 PM Thread Starter
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No Crank, help! new starter just makes loud click 1 of 4x ???

I just put in a brand new TH350, starter, flywheel and converter. Have driven about 4 times in the last week since new trans install. Now for the second time the starter just makes a loud metallic thunk noise and no crank. It did this cold cranking both times, last time I just fiddled with it and eventually after 5 min , 20+ attempts it cranked over. It is not grinding at all, just a loud thunk 1 time.

Whats really weird is the old starter would do this every once and a while but I just passed it off as an old worn out starter. Strange thing is the new one is worse than the old one, anyone run into this ???

engine is a 350, I assume I have a bad starter out of the box?

kevin p...................
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post #2 of 19 (permalink) Old May 17th, 15, 11:50 PM
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Re: No Crank, help! new starter just makes loud click 1 of 4x ???

If battery terminals are good/ clean... the battery holds a charge, not just voltage is up after a re charge... turn on lights, with no charging for a few minutes and the voltage should still be fully charged....or if has cell tops, check each cell with a battery hydrometer... forget the charged low charge marks.. u are looking for a cell significantly different to the rest

Check the benex has not been oiled or greased.. unless special oils used, keep dry.. no lube

Will the starter work with a jumper battery?

Big or stock cam.. what is the initial timing?

All the above ok.. bad starter out of the box..
rebuilt or new starter.. its not uncommon for rebuilt starters to have faulty armatures over the last 20/ 30 yrs

I needed a starter quick about 5 yrs ago.. hi compression (220 + cranking lbs) and grabbed a Chinese geared torque starter... damn think was never meant or intended to last this long.. daily driver....

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post #3 of 19 (permalink) Old May 18th, 15, 03:29 AM
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Re: No Crank, help! new starter just makes loud click 1 of 4x ???

2 starters and same issue (pretty much).

I would pull and test the starter, check for proper gear mesh, make sure its the correct tooth count, and check wiring.

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post #4 of 19 (permalink) Old May 18th, 15, 04:41 AM
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Re: No Crank, help! new starter just makes loud click 1 of 4x ???

I feel this is a connection problem. The small wires at the starter could be just as suspect as the battery cables. Another possibility is a bad ignition switch but I'd look at that last after exhausting all the other possibilities first. Have you tried to cross the terminals at the starter to see what happens?

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post #5 of 19 (permalink) Old May 18th, 15, 04:43 AM
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Re: No Crank, help! new starter just makes loud click 1 of 4x ???

Along with Doug's & Steps suggestions, I would add change battery cables to a min 1/0 wire gauge with molded clamps.
If neg cable is screwed to an alt bracket, move this end to the block.

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post #6 of 19 (permalink) Old May 18th, 15, 06:44 AM
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Re: No Crank, help! new starter just makes loud click 1 of 4x ???

Quote:
Originally Posted by Everett#2390 View Post
Along with Doug's & Steps suggestions, I would add change battery cables to a min 1/0 wire gauge with molded clamps.
If neg cable is screwed to an alt bracket, move this end to the block.
X2, I had this problem as well. The ground cable did not make very good contact because of the paint on the alternator bracket. I had to grind off some paint under the wire connection on the bracket .

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post #7 of 19 (permalink) Old May 18th, 15, 11:39 AM
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Smile Re: No Crank, help! new starter just makes loud click 1 of 4x ???

Make sure the engine turns by hand (or breaker bar) !

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post #8 of 19 (permalink) Old May 18th, 15, 03:37 PM
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Re: No Crank, help! new starter just makes loud click 1 of 4x ???

Touched on above... and have experienced this in many old vintage cars, espec 6 cylinder up...
Old cars are likely get wires shorted in their time.. even accidentally , momenturaly...this tends to 'burn' oxidize the outer surface of the strands in the wire... Electricity runs down the surface of the strands NOT thru the center... so in effect the strand now becomes the same as a one long dirty bad connection... with a voltage drop.
Placing a relay, attached on the engine side of the firewall to one of the heater case bolts.
Wired so the big purple wire activates the relay for a new direct feed to the starter fixes permanently without replacing ign switches, looms , re wiring etc.
I did this 30 odd yrs ago on the camaro... most of our vintage / old cars also have one now.
The same effect can happen and is the usual cause for replacing battery cables, as suggested above.

The trouble with checking the voltage drop on the purple wire is it has to be done as the starter engages....at the Mil sec point where huge currents are drawn and the gear is initially thrown out... which requires digital little more fancy multi meter with logging...
Simply checking voltage drop unloaded can show no drop because of the short distance and larger size of the purple wire.

Also your ground strap need to be good and using star washers to cut thru the paint...
I run my battery ground directly to the bottom alternator mounting bolt,( my lower alternator mount is custom... heavy chrome steel plate bolted to 2 of the water pump bolts because dont have head mount holes) and another short battery cable from a trans bolts to chassis and body, tucked up out of sight.

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post #9 of 19 (permalink) Old May 18th, 15, 06:35 PM
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Re: No Crank, help! new starter just makes loud click 1 of 4x ???

I had the same thing on a car as well. It was a bad connection to the starter. The battery cables were very oxidized and weren't making a good connection. You would hear the thump and no turn over. Sometimes it would turn over but most times it didn't. I replaced the cables and it worked fine.
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post #10 of 19 (permalink) Old May 18th, 15, 06:59 PM
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Re: No Crank, help! new starter just makes loud click 1 of 4x ???

Check and make sure you have the starter shimmed properly in addition to the above.
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post #11 of 19 (permalink) Old May 20th, 15, 06:29 PM Thread Starter
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Re: No Crank, help! new starter just makes loud click 1 of 4x ???

Quote:
Originally Posted by DOUG G View Post
2 starters and same issue (pretty much).

I would pull and test the starter, check for proper gear mesh, make sure its the correct tooth count, and check wiring.
thats what I was concerned about. stater gear mesh is OK, I just put a 168t flexplate and 168t powermaster OE style starter on. I'm going to be rechecking the connections and grounds. Thanks for all the ideas and suggestions, hopefully it wont be snowing this weekend and I can work on it some.

kevin p...................
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post #12 of 19 (permalink) Old May 20th, 15, 06:56 PM
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Re: No Crank, help! new starter just makes loud click 1 of 4x ???

With just a click, my guess is that the solenoid isn't getting enough current to do its job. Of course there isn't a single voltage measurement in the thread, and therefore no attempt to test or troubleshoot.
I'd measure to ground at the S terminal, and then at the terminal that feeds into the starter, both with the key in the start position.
Since its intermittent, I'd suspect a poor connection.
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post #13 of 19 (permalink) Old May 21st, 15, 02:07 PM
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Re: No Crank, help! new starter just makes loud click 1 of 4x ???

I had the same issue with Powermaster starter.. turned out o be defective and replaced under warranty. Make sure you have enough volts directly to starter.
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post #14 of 19 (permalink) Old May 21st, 15, 02:11 PM
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Re: No Crank, help! new starter just makes loud click 1 of 4x ???

I know this is not for most but you can jump the starter by touching both small and big nuts at the same time with a long screw drvier, see if the starter works.
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post #15 of 19 (permalink) Old May 21st, 15, 02:28 PM
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Re: No Crank, help! new starter just makes loud click 1 of 4x ???

Next time it happens, rap the outside of the starter case (not the solenoid) a couple of times with a hammer or wrench and then turn the key again. Do not hit it really hard because you can crack the case. I forgot why this works, but if it does work, its not the wires or the solenoid, replace or rebuild the starter.
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