LS-1 vs. Vortech - Team Camaro Tech
Engine General Engine Discussion.

 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #1 of 13 (permalink) Old Jan 29th, 05, 04:24 PM Thread Starter
Gold Lifetime Member
 
stevo camaro's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Dunsmuir, CA
Posts: 2,005
Garage
Question

Whats the difference between these motors? Are only Vortechs put in trucks?
Are the basic motors the same?

67 RS 327, 4-speed, posi, done.
67 Modified, 454, TH-400, posi, under construction.
67 SS 396, 4-speed, basket case.
72 RS, sitting, partially done.
55 210 post, 2 door, 327 4-speed runs good.
55 2 door post, gasser project
69 Cadillac ElDorado
69 4x4 suburban
59 ElCamino

Some mornings, it's just not worth chewing thru the leather straps"
stevo camaro is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 13 (permalink) Old Jan 29th, 05, 05:17 PM
Senior Tech
Chad
 
67 Plum's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Thomasville,Ga.
Posts: 4,386
Post

The L31 350 Vortec was a truck motor.Other than the heads just a one piece rear main seal 350.The Ls1 is a 3rd Gen motor sharing nothing with the older engines.

67 Plum Mist Met. 408 TH350 3.08 posi
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
67 Plum is offline  
post #3 of 13 (permalink) Old Jan 29th, 05, 07:37 PM
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Posts: 21,341
Unhappy

Stevo,

The Vortec heads have taller ports then our old motors so intake sealing may be a problem.. And they also have the "pony-car" vertical manifold bolt design.. So much for Ford using our rockers!!!

The new LS- jobbers have separated ports both intake and exhaust. They call the intakes, cathedrals b/c they are tall and narrow and have pointed tops so the injectors can fire right at the back of the valves..

I want to put a set of cast-iron LS- type truck heads on an old standard block for the fun of it but I am not equipped to do it!! Just to prove a point that GM didn't need to sh-t-can the old design!!!

Personally I think GM spent a fortune on a new motor when the old motor was THE BEST one in the world!! Bar none!! They spent a fortune on it just like they did the aborted LT-5!!!

FWIW, look at the Vortec chambers and you will see some 500 Cad. motor in them. That tells me that GM knew darn well early on how to make a better SB head then they sold us all those years!!!

As well as the LS- heads only having 4 head bolts around each cylinder!! GM didn't think that was a good idea back in '55 so why is it OK now??????

pdq67



pdq67 is offline  
 
post #4 of 13 (permalink) Old Jan 30th, 05, 08:19 AM Thread Starter
Gold Lifetime Member
 
stevo camaro's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Dunsmuir, CA
Posts: 2,005
Garage
Post

Isn't the LS-1 motor used in the Vettes?
The reason I ask is not to build one but just know what the difference is.
I have a 6.0 Vortech in my truck. That equates to a 366 cubic inch. A 5.7 Vortech is a 350. (I believe.)
So what is my motor? A stroked 350?

The above questions got off track of the original question.

So head design & intakes are the big difference between LS-1 & Vortech?
Everything else being the same? ie. pistons, crank, block.

67 RS 327, 4-speed, posi, done.
67 Modified, 454, TH-400, posi, under construction.
67 SS 396, 4-speed, basket case.
72 RS, sitting, partially done.
55 210 post, 2 door, 327 4-speed runs good.
55 2 door post, gasser project
69 Cadillac ElDorado
69 4x4 suburban
59 ElCamino

Some mornings, it's just not worth chewing thru the leather straps"
stevo camaro is offline  
post #5 of 13 (permalink) Old Jan 30th, 05, 08:24 AM
Senior Tech
Al
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Vancouver, USA
Posts: 10,511
Post

Quote:
Originally posted by stevo camaro:

So head design & intakes are the big difference between LS-1 & Vortech?
Everything else being the same? ie. pistons, crank, block.
The Vortec 350 is the old familiar small block with slightly different heads and intake manifold. The Vortec heads will bolt up to any of the old school SBC's.

The LS-1 is a new engine from the ground up. I don't believe any of the major components will swap over to the old small blocks.

Not sure what a Vortec 6.0 is?


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
BPOS is offline  
post #6 of 13 (permalink) Old Jan 30th, 05, 10:11 AM
Moderator
Bill
 
Join Date: Aug 1998
Location: Waldorf Md. USA
Posts: 3,288
Post

Steve,
The 6.0 "vortec" engine you have in your truck is based on the LS1 platform. The term "Vortec" is basically a marketing term used on both the older style and newer style truck engines even though they are totally different. The LS1 type engines are completely different from the older style small blocks and as far as I know nothing is interchangable.

Bill Koustenis
Owner
Advanced Automotive Machine
Waldorf Md
1971 Chevelle "Heavy Chevy" original owner


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
BillK is offline  
post #7 of 13 (permalink) Old Jan 30th, 05, 12:29 PM
Senior Tech
Tom
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Rochester Mn
Posts: 7,749
Post

Can you say "aluminum."

69 Camaro -originally a LM1 car. 327, Edelbrock E-streets, hooker, DUI performance distributors, ultradyne cam, stewart, TRW etc. Vintage Air, AGR steering, Corbeau GTSII seats, 700R4 transmission, 12-bolt w/Eaton 4.11:1
TJS69 is offline  
post #8 of 13 (permalink) Old Jan 30th, 05, 01:21 PM
Senior Tech
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Ashby,MN, USA
Posts: 8,305
Post

my 93 S10 Blazer has "vortec" 4.3 liter v6 in it..
Vortec is Chevy marketing lingo for "truck engine".
as for pdq's ongoing idea of putting the new LS1 heads on an old small block, i might just have to go out to the shop one day and set my LS1 heads on that LT1 shortblock (very close to the old school small block designe except for the reverse cooling passages) i have just to show him ho much different the 2 designs truly are- literally the only measurement that is the same is the bore spacing.

you don't plan sincerity.
you have to make it up on the spot.

wanna hear about 20 years ago when i was too smart to know any better?
novaderrik is offline  
post #9 of 13 (permalink) Old Jan 30th, 05, 05:03 PM
Senior Tech
Lee
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Fort Worth, TX
Posts: 708
Post

As much as I like the first generation motors, I must say the LS1's are a much better motor.

I have a 5.3 in my Yukon and 1st gen 350 in my '97 pickup. The Yukon makes more power and gets better mileage than my old 350 and the 350 is 25 cubic inches bigger than the 5.3.
69Project is offline  
post #10 of 13 (permalink) Old Jan 30th, 05, 06:29 PM
Senior Tech
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Ashby,MN, USA
Posts: 8,305
Post

the new "gen 3" engines are way beyond the old design. they have features that you'd have to pay big $$$ to put on the old engines.
for exapmle- how much does a set of 15 degree heads and all the supporting hardware (rockers, pushrods, etc) cost for a regular small block? probably as much as or more than buying a whole LS1 crate engine that already has that. the new LS7 427 inch Vette motor has (i think) a 12 degree valve angle- that is top end race car tech on a regular small block, folks, and probably where a good majority of the performance potential comes from in these engines.
plus, i think they are going with aluminum blocks across the board in the next couple of years- how many production aluminum small blocks did they make from 1955 to present? i'd guess approximately zero.
i think that once they figure out the knocking and oil consumtion issues (which they "solved" on the LS7 by torque plate boring and honing the blocks), they will have moved beyond the old stuff for good and proven how good a modern pushrod engine can be.
novaderrik is offline  
post #11 of 13 (permalink) Old Jan 31st, 05, 07:07 AM
Senior Tech
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Castle Rock Co.
Posts: 446
Post

I think rod bearings and lifters are the same, other than that nothing.

The LS1 heads are a 4 bolt design with rod bolts that reach way down into the mains webbing.

There is an article somewhere about installing a 6.0l vortec into an old school K5, something I was interested in doing. It was a huge undertaking.

GM sells a 383 crate engine with the vortec heads that makes big block torque and costs than I expected. That would be a much easier swap than a 6.0l vortec.
Heretic is offline  
post #12 of 13 (permalink) Old Feb 3rd, 05, 07:45 AM
Senior Tech
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Wyoming
Posts: 1,635
Post

What is the difference between the Ls1, 060, and 061 Vortecs? Which ones are the best?
deerhunter is offline  
post #13 of 13 (permalink) Old Feb 4th, 05, 06:33 AM
Tech Team
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Charlotte, NC USA
Posts: 49
Post

Vortec is a marketing term...

All the new 4.7, 5.3, and 6.0 truck motors are Gen III designs. basically, they are slight variations of an Iron blocked LS1. The LS1 is of course a 5.7L Aluminum block.

But the valve angle, 6-bolt cross bolted mains are the 2 big selling points.

Cost is the only thing the old school SBC has going for it at this point, the tech and quality is Gen III all the way.

2003 Yellow S-10 4.3L - Stock "The Bus"<br /><br />'75 Type LT<br />Slowly but Surely<br />Learning as I go...
BusDriver is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Team Camaro Tech forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address.
NOTE we receive a lot of registrations with bad email addresses. IF you do not receive your confirmation email you will not be able to post. contact support and we will try and help.
Be sure you enter a valid email address and check your spam folder as well.



Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome