To Marvel, or not to Marvel???? - Team Camaro Tech
Engine General Engine Discussion.

 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #1 of 8 (permalink) Old Oct 17th, 03, 05:54 AM Thread Starter
Tech Team
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Vacaville, CA
Posts: 86
Post

I did my first oil change on the 68 yesterday since I bought the car. Not good! The filter and oil were fresh when I bought the car and since then I've only put about 300 miles on it. The oil looked alright, it wasn't sludge, it was dark. I thought it was going alright until I pulled the filter. Just inside of the gasket was a line of sludge, along with some gritty crap. I don't think it was metal though.

Just about a month ago I pulled my RPM Performer manifold off to replace it with dual-quad set-up. I was real careful not to get anything into the lifter valley, as it was already spotless. Of course I had to pull the valve covers off and the tops of the heads were spotless too...

Should I pull the engine and check the pan? Possibly to install a new stock oil pump? This engine carries about 30 lbs oil at speed and 5-7 pounds at idle. I am debating over trying that Marvel Mystery oil to get things loosened up a bit but don't know if that is a good idea or not.

Any suggestions would be appreciated. The engine is a 65 Small Journal 327 with double hump heads. It don't smoke, even on startup.

Thanks!
Aaron

68 Coupe, dual quad 327,
Aaron Bullock is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 8 (permalink) Old Oct 17th, 03, 06:11 AM
Senior Tech
Dave
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Yorkville In
Posts: 1,420
Post

5-7 lbs of oil presure at idle sounds like it could be a plugged oil pick up screen or worse bad cam bearings. To much cam bearing clearance will effect oil presure, or even a gouge in one of the cam bearings when the cam was installed will effect oil presure.

Dave
69 Big Block / Hugger Orange Sold
65 Chevelle SS
Black 2010 Electra Glide Classic
Branded is offline  
post #3 of 8 (permalink) Old Oct 17th, 03, 06:19 AM
Senior Tech
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Allen, TX
Posts: 2,108
Post

Hmm, I get 58lbs of pressure at 60mph on the freeway, and >40lbs at idle. I am using a high velocity Mellings oil pump and deep sump pickup, purchased as a SUMMIT RACING brand prewelded together! I use Valvoline Racing 20w-50 as highly recommended by my engine builder Beck Racing Engines. You can jack up the engine by the pan using a 2x4, have a few 2x4x4 pieces of wood and maybe a few 1x3x4 pieces to shim under each motor mount once you get the engine as high as possible (watch distributor and trans filler line clearance), this gives you just enough room to actually drop the oil pan, put a new pump in, put a nice new 1 piece Felpro permadry gasket in and be done.

Might also consider running some GUNK ENGINE FLUSH designed to be ran in the engine for 15 minutes while idling right before you change the oil, it loosens a bunch of stuff up and won't harm the engine as long as you aren't running it WOT up and down the street with the stuff in it. Found near the Mystery Oil at any auto store.


1969 Camaro - GM 2003 Electron Blue
Beck Racing 383 cu in 465HP Engine - Sean Murphy Inductions Stage 2 Quadrajet
TCI Streetfighter 350 - 3.73:1 Posi 10 Bolt Rear - 12.6 sec qtr mile

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
and
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Brian Lewis is offline  
 
post #4 of 8 (permalink) Old Oct 17th, 03, 06:24 AM
Senior Tech
Royce
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Vacaville, CA
Posts: 10,474
Post

What RPM is idle in your car? If your idle speed is low that will of course lower your oil pressure. What type and weight of oil are you using? Before you tear apart the engine, make sure you actually need to. If the lifter valley was spotless, and the heads are clean, I wouldn't expect the lower end to be full of sludge. Do you hear any "knocking" on start up or once it's warm? At what RPM is that 30lbs (at speed pressure)?

Royce (NO XQSSS) Bradley

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

(brief sound/video clip, 3 1/2" exhaust through Borla Sportsman mufflers)
camaroman7d is offline  
post #5 of 8 (permalink) Old Oct 17th, 03, 11:59 AM Thread Starter
Tech Team
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Vacaville, CA
Posts: 86
Post

Thanks for the quick responses! I idled the engine at about 8-900 to get it to show a sign of oil pressure on the gauge when warm. At speed would be about 1500 rpm and up for 30 lbs. It will hit 40 when it's 60 degrees outside and the engine is cold. I'm not sure what weight was in it, but I put some extra stuff I had sitting around back in it just to use it up. I used 2 qts of Castrol straight 40 wt with 3 qts of Penzoil 10-40. Otherwise, I was going to put straight 30 wt.

Oh, no knocking either. No water in the oil or oil in the water. Sometimes it will tick a little, but I'm sure it's just a lifter.

If I drop the pan to put in a new pump, what kind of pump should I get? I heard something while back that a person shouldn't run a high volume unless it's a rebuilt or new engine cause of blowing the old gaskets... Any truth to that?

68 Coupe, dual quad 327,
Aaron Bullock is offline  
post #6 of 8 (permalink) Old Oct 17th, 03, 12:57 PM
Senior Tech
Royce
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Vacaville, CA
Posts: 10,474
Post

First no there is no truth to "blowing" a gasket do to a high volume or pressure pump. Your oil pressure seem slightly low at idle (not drasticly), and at speed it is more than enough (basic rule is 10psi per 1000 RPM).

As far as which pump to buy, I think that would depend on what you pull out of the engine. If it is already a high volume or pressure and your oil pressure is this low, I don't think a new pump is going to fix it. If you pull out a stock pump (not even sure what engine we are dealing with here), then you will have to decide what you think is best. Typically a Z28 pump is plenty, Melling pumps are decent as well.

I am stillnot sold that you even need a new pump. The first thing I would do is change the oil and filter. Pour some 20-50 (good quality) oil in there and see how it acts. If the pressure is too migh the maybe go to a 10-40 etc... An oil change is a lot easier and cheaper than changing the pump only to find out it doesn't make a difference. If you go to 20-50 and your pressure is still low then maybe look at the pump. If you are using cheap (poor quality) oil it could very well already be broken down. How is your engine tempature? Just a few things to consider before rolling up your sleevs and getting dirty.

Royce (NO XQSSS) Bradley

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

(brief sound/video clip, 3 1/2" exhaust through Borla Sportsman mufflers)
camaroman7d is offline  
post #7 of 8 (permalink) Old Oct 17th, 03, 04:37 PM
Senior Tech
Bob
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Ct.
Posts: 1,145
Post

You could have had a small amount of water/ anti freeze leak into the engine when you pulled the intake. This could account for some sludge in your oil filter.
5 to 7 lbs. at idle sounds too low to me for a 40wt. mixture. I would change the oil and filter and run it a while but that idle pressure is too low for me. Your running pressure of 30-40 lbs. isn't bad if the pump is a standard model and not a hypo.

Bob
Garnet Red 69/SS396/TH400/355 Posi Sold
'02 triple blk Vette Vert. now
94 HD Dyna Wideglide
phel69 is offline  
post #8 of 8 (permalink) Old Oct 18th, 03, 08:47 PM Thread Starter
Tech Team
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Vacaville, CA
Posts: 86
Post

Thanks again for the replies. Now that I have proof of insurance I'll get some miles on the car this week and see whats up with the oil. Unfortunately it's going to have to go into storage soon, so this may have to wait until spring. I appreciate all the help, but there is one more question I need to answer: Yes the engine has gotten to about 230 degrees which is definately a little warm. I have an electric fan installed now, so hopefully it's under control. Also when I changed the intake I installed a 160 thermostat to help even more.

I'll get some miles on the car within the next few weeks... I'll change the oil again before I put it in storage. Maybe I could pull the engine and rebuild it over the winter... I'll post again for an update soon, as I'm sure there will be more questions!

Thanks again!
Aaron

68 Coupe, dual quad 327,
Aaron Bullock is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Team Camaro Tech forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address.
NOTE we receive a lot of registrations with bad email addresses. IF you do not receive your confirmation email you will not be able to post. contact support and we will try and help.
Be sure you enter a valid email address and check your spam folder as well.



Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome