any way to ID 4Bolt BBC later model - Team Camaro Tech
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post #1 of 20 (permalink) Old Dec 28th, 16, 08:31 AM Thread Starter
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Rich
 
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any way to ID 4Bolt BBC later model

I know early 4 bolts had a 1" plug above the oil filter but later models did away with the 1" plug. I'm guessing when they started with the external oil filters between filter and block?
I found one thats supposedly out of a motorhome and hope it would be 4 bolt but pan is still on it - I know would be best to pull pan and look, was hoping ther would be an external identifier, anyone?

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post #2 of 20 (permalink) Old Dec 28th, 16, 10:32 AM
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Re: any way to ID 4Bolt BBC later model

All Mark IV big blocks (two bolt rear main seal) have the plug for an oil cooler, even the ones that used the sandwiched oil cooler lines found in motor homes and pick-up trucks with the trailering package. All newer Gen V and Gen VI blocks (one piece rear mains) have four bolt mains but they do not have the oil cooler pipe plug machined into the block.

The extra oil cooler machine work was preformed on all Mark IV big blocks, as the Corvette had an oil cooler on high performance engines that used that fitting to plumb the cooler, as part of the machining process to make a four bolt block from a stock two bolt.

That said a motor home should have a four bolt main block with a forged steel crank, though it isn't guaranteed. If they bought a full chassis from GM it would have the truck forged parts (usually with a tall deck if it has air brakes; if it used hydraulic brakes it would be a standard deck height); but if it was a motor added to another chassis it could be anything.

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post #3 of 20 (permalink) Old Dec 28th, 16, 01:53 PM
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Re: any way to ID 4Bolt BBC later model

Quote:
Originally Posted by Larger Dave View Post
All newer Gen V and Gen VI blocks (one piece rear mains) have four bolt mains but they do not have the oil cooler pipe plug machined into the block.
Are you sure that's "all" Gen VI? My 2015 8.0L block is machined for the oil cooler. Two holes with pipe plugs next to the oil filter.

'69 SS396 X66 L34 08D M21 BS
460ci Gen VI 9.75:1 AED 950 carb
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post #4 of 20 (permalink) Old Dec 28th, 16, 02:28 PM
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Re: any way to ID 4Bolt BBC later model

8.0L? There is an 8.i Gen 7 tall deck OMC marine engine (used in one ton trucks as a cheap option for a diesel engine before GM started installing Isuzu diesel engines, and GMPP makes an 8.2L 502 (truck replacement engine and the ZZ 502 variant but I know of no 8.0L engine.

Anything that new (2015) is going to be a hand built motor; not a production piece. As such it was probably custom made for an application other than for use in light tucks, which was the last production use of the BBC. A custom made motor can have whatever you want on it (if your pockets are deep enough).

The tall deck 8.1 liter motor (basically a 496 using a 4.25 inch stroke crank with a 0.030 over 454 bore, only this was a factory made motor in Tonawanda, NY that had a virgin block) was destined for marine applications, or in a light truck . As such it probably would have had the machine work for a remote mounted oil cooler. I do not know as I have never owned one.

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post #5 of 20 (permalink) Old Dec 29th, 16, 02:09 AM Thread Starter
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Rich
 
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Re: any way to ID 4Bolt BBC later model

Quote:
Originally Posted by Larger Dave View Post
All Mark IV big blocks (two bolt rear main seal) have the plug for an oil cooler, even the ones that used the sandwiched oil cooler lines found in motor homes and pick-up trucks with the trailering package.

Big Dave
Dave are you saying that it would have the 1" plug or would it be smaller? I know the 80's Mk IV 4bolt didnt have the big 1" plug

69 R/S Z/28 302 X33 D80 late 09C
69 T/A clonification LS6-6speed under construction
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post #6 of 20 (permalink) Old Dec 29th, 16, 07:02 AM
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Re: any way to ID 4Bolt BBC later model

Quote:
Originally Posted by Larger Dave View Post
8.0L? There is an 8.i Gen 7 tall deck OMC marine engine (used in one ton trucks as a cheap option for a diesel engine before GM started installing Isuzu diesel engines, and GMPP makes an 8.2L 502 (truck replacement engine and the ZZ 502 variant but I know of no 8.0L engine.

Anything that new (2015) is going to be a hand built motor; not a production piece. As such it was probably custom made for an application other than for use in light tucks, which was the last production use of the BBC. A custom made motor can have whatever you want on it (if your pockets are deep enough).

The tall deck 8.1 liter motor (basically a 496 using a 4.25 inch stroke crank with a 0.030 over 454 bore, only this was a factory made motor in Tonawanda, NY that had a virgin block) was destined for marine applications, or in a light truck . As such it probably would have had the machine work for a remote mounted oil cooler. I do not know as I have never owned one.

Big Dave
4.28" (+.020) x4.25"
The motor is listed by GM as a "Performance auto, LPG truck etc. & Marine".

20161022_141430 by Dave H, on Flickr

'69 SS396 X66 L34 08D M21 BS
460ci Gen VI 9.75:1 AED 950 carb
241/249 @ .050" .625/.625 110 LSA

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post #7 of 20 (permalink) Old Dec 29th, 16, 07:08 AM Thread Starter
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Rich
 
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Re: any way to ID 4Bolt BBC later model

Hawk I have no idea what that has to do with my question?

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post #8 of 20 (permalink) Old Dec 29th, 16, 07:15 AM
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Re: any way to ID 4Bolt BBC later model

Quote:
Originally Posted by zman1969 View Post
Hawk I have no idea what that has to do with my question?
I was responding to Dave's response to my comment about him saying all Gen VI blocks weren't machined for oil coolers.
Also, when you said later model, I wasn't sure if you meant later Mark IV, or Gen V or VI.

'69 SS396 X66 L34 08D M21 BS
460ci Gen VI 9.75:1 AED 950 carb
241/249 @ .050" .625/.625 110 LSA

Semper Fi!

"The galleries are full of critics. They play no ball, they fight no fights. They make no mistakes because they attempt nothing."
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post #9 of 20 (permalink) Old Dec 29th, 16, 07:23 AM
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Dave
 
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Re: any way to ID 4Bolt BBC later model

That sounds like a new engine to me. It is possibly a Gen VII block with a different cast iron head as the OMC version of the 8.1 had modified LS style aluminum heads that used four head bolts per cylinder like a big Buick 455 to hold them in place (compared to the six head bolts per cylinder on the Mark IV through Gen VI big blocks).

Those two shiny silver colored plugs on the oil pan rail are the oil cooler fittings on your block.



They reflect the fact that the oil passages were changed in the Gen V and the Gen VI to priority main feed.

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post #10 of 20 (permalink) Old Dec 29th, 16, 07:29 AM
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Dave
 
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Re: any way to ID 4Bolt BBC later model

Quote:
Originally Posted by Larger Dave View Post
That sounds like a new engine to me. It is possibly a Gen VII block with a different cast iron head as the OMC version of the 8.1 had modified LS style aluminum heads that used four head bolts per cylinder like a big Buick 455 to hold them in place (compared to the six head bolts per cylinder on the Mark IV through Gen VI big blocks).

Those two shiny silver colored plugs on the oil pan rail are the oil cooler fittings on your block.


They reflect the fact that the oil passages were changed in the Gen V and the Gen VI to priority main feed.

Big Dave
Not to derail Rich's thread any more than I already have... It's a 2015 Gen VI motor. It's the one I'm building for my 69. My understanding is that, unlike Gen VI, Gen VII motors have differences that make it so Mk IV parts won't fit.

'69 SS396 X66 L34 08D M21 BS
460ci Gen VI 9.75:1 AED 950 carb
241/249 @ .050" .625/.625 110 LSA

Semper Fi!

"The galleries are full of critics. They play no ball, they fight no fights. They make no mistakes because they attempt nothing."
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post #11 of 20 (permalink) Old Dec 29th, 16, 07:50 AM
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Dave
 
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Re: any way to ID 4Bolt BBC later model

Yes they are different but they didn't have four head bolts like I said above. In that I was mistaken. I do know the symmetrical port Gen VII heads do not fit any other engine but I can not recall why.

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post #12 of 20 (permalink) Old Dec 29th, 16, 08:55 AM Thread Starter
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Rich
 
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Re: any way to ID 4Bolt BBC later model

I give up

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post #13 of 20 (permalink) Old Dec 29th, 16, 09:56 AM
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Re: any way to ID 4Bolt BBC later model

Quote:
Originally Posted by zman1969 View Post
I give up
Can you tell us approx. what years you're asking about? A later model BBC is pretty broad nowadays. It'd be easier to answer if we knew.

'69 SS396 X66 L34 08D M21 BS
460ci Gen VI 9.75:1 AED 950 carb
241/249 @ .050" .625/.625 110 LSA

Semper Fi!

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post #14 of 20 (permalink) Old Dec 29th, 16, 09:59 AM Thread Starter
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Rich
 
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Re: any way to ID 4Bolt BBC later model

GEN IV - up to 90

69 R/S Z/28 302 X33 D80 late 09C
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post #15 of 20 (permalink) Old Dec 29th, 16, 10:21 AM
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Re: any way to ID 4Bolt BBC later model

Any access to a bore scope? They're cheap now ($20 for a cheapie on Amazon). Pull the dipstick and poke the camera snake in. They attach to your cell phone. Other than that, I think the most sure fire would be the suffix code if you can get to it.
Even on the earlier big blocks the following pic showing the differences between 2 and 4 bolts isn't always true.
That's my understanding even though this is what Colvin has to say about it: " On all Chevrolet big block engines, the method of the crankshaft bearing cap retention (2- or 4-bolt caps) can be identified without pulling the engine apart or removing the oil pan. Just check the three exterior holes above the oil filter boss.
All 2-bolt blocks have the front hole drilled 5/16". It is not drilled or tapped into the oil galley. The center hole is drilled and tapped a 3/8" pipe thread into the oil galley. The rear hole above the oil filter has a 1/2' USS coarse-thread hole that is not drilled into the oil galley.
On the 4-bolt blocks, the front hole(towards the front of the engine) has a 3/8' pipe thread hole drilled into the oil galley. The center hole has a 1/2' pipe thread hole drilled through to the top of the oil galley. The rear hole above the oil filter has a 1/2" USS coarse-thread hole, Which is not drilled into the oil Galley."


'69 SS396 X66 L34 08D M21 BS
460ci Gen VI 9.75:1 AED 950 carb
241/249 @ .050" .625/.625 110 LSA

Semper Fi!

"The galleries are full of critics. They play no ball, they fight no fights. They make no mistakes because they attempt nothing."
HawkX66 is offline  
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