Can someone tell me the correct way to check lift at the pushrod? - Team Camaro Tech
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post #1 of 26 (permalink) Old Nov 23rd, 05, 04:54 PM Thread Starter
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Can someone tell me the correct way to check lift at the pushrod?

I need someone to help me with instruction on the proper way to check lift at the pushrod. Where to mount dial indicator etc.
I don't want to pull the intake unless I have to. I want to see if I have a cam going bad or not.
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post #2 of 26 (permalink) Old Nov 23rd, 05, 05:32 PM
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Re: Can someone tell me the correct way to check lift at the pushrod?

Depends on what type of dial indicator mount you have. In either case as long as it is mounted so the "rod" in the indicator is in a direct line with the push rod you should be fine. You just don't want it to be at an angle or deflect. When I use the one that came with my cam degree kit, I made an adapter to fit in the water pump hole. My other one is a magnetic base. Which type do you have?

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post #3 of 26 (permalink) Old Nov 23rd, 05, 05:45 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Can someone tell me the correct way to check lift at the pushrod?

I don't have one yet. I need to but one. I figured the magnetic base mount would work better for this, am I right?
Where could I buy one without having to order it? Do you place the indicator on the rocker or the pushrod?

I am afraid I have lost or am losing a lobe on my cam, but I'm not sure. It has almost reached the point of driving me crazy. I figure checking it this way will tell me if it's bad or not.
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post #4 of 26 (permalink) Old Nov 23rd, 05, 05:57 PM
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Re: Can someone tell me the correct way to check lift at the pushrod?

I personally like to put it directly on the push rod, it will stay put with in the oil hole. The magnetic base makes it a lot more simple to mount (which is why I bought one). I did order mine, so I am not sure where you can buy one off the shelf. Might try Harbor Freight if you have one in your area. Napa auto parts might be another option. I think you guys have another store back there similar to a Harbor Freight, the name won't come to me, ahhh Northern Tool and Supply (or something like that).

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post #5 of 26 (permalink) Old Nov 23rd, 05, 06:09 PM
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Re: Can someone tell me the correct way to check lift at the pushrod?

Although it can be done at the pushrod, if there is a question about the cam, you might as well just pull the intake and check right off the lifter.

This is a magnetic base dial indicator from Summit, but I think I saw one at Harbor Freight.


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post #6 of 26 (permalink) Old Nov 23rd, 05, 06:19 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Can someone tell me the correct way to check lift at the pushrod?

I just called Harbor Freight and they have one. Would a one inch indicator be the best for this?
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post #7 of 26 (permalink) Old Nov 23rd, 05, 07:06 PM
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Re: Can someone tell me the correct way to check lift at the pushrod?

Yes, a 1" will be fine. Just remember when comparing the lift that you are looking at lobe lift, not advertised lift. I am sure you already knew this but, I thought I would mention it.

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post #8 of 26 (permalink) Old Nov 23rd, 05, 07:12 PM
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Re: Can someone tell me the correct way to check lift at the pushrod?

I bought this one at Harbor Freight.
http://geocities.com/[email protected]/Gear2.jpg
It has a 1" range.

I have been reading your posts about the ticking valve. If it was my engine I would do the following:
  • Remove the rockers on a couple of cylinders and manually depress the valves to eliminate the valve, spring, guide, and seat as a source of the noise. To depress the valves install the adjusting nut without the rocker and place a claw hammer under the nut to depress the valve (just like pulling a nail).
  • If the valves check out OK reassemble the valvetrain and crank the engine over to check if the pushrods are spinning. A spot of grease will help you see them turn. If your cam is flat the pushrod will most likely not be turning.
  • If all the pushrods are turning I would check the rocker geometry. At 50% lift the rocker should be centered on the valve stem. If the valves are new you may be able to see the pattern on the top of the valve stem. It should be centered. Pushrod Length & Rocker Arm Geometry
  • If you still have not found the source of the noise then itís time to pull the intake manifold and check the lifters.
Let us know what you find.

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post #9 of 26 (permalink) Old Nov 23rd, 05, 08:25 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Can someone tell me the correct way to check lift at the pushrod?

Today I pulled the spring that was clicking, the one I wrote about in my other thread. I inspected it and found nothing wrong. So I removed the inner spring and turned it a little then re-installed. The click went away.

I don't have any noise like that on any other valves. I have a spring compressor that works like the claw hammer you mentioned.

I marked my pushrods and they aren't turning much. They will turn eventually but I wouldn't say they are spinning. They are moving slow and the engine has to run a while before a couple of them turn at all.

My engine is idling rough, and I can still hear a miss. No popping, or backfire. It smooths out at higher RPM's but I can still hear it stumbling.

I have removed spark from each cylinder and their is a noticable RPM drop on all 8. All rockers are moving.

It seems to have power though, it will spin the tires right now. But I can hear the valve train, not clacking or ticking loudly, but I can hear it and I don't think I should be able to hear it like this.

I would like to finally rule out the cam or not.
For info I did re-use my stock rocker arms.
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post #10 of 26 (permalink) Old Nov 23rd, 05, 08:56 PM
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Re: Can someone tell me the correct way to check lift at the pushrod?

I think we're getting somewhere.
If the click was interference between the spring and the inner damper and it's gone now, that's good!
All that's left if to adjust the valves right, it counds like you have them way too tight.
So make a mess again...engine at slow idle, loosen a rocker nut till you know you hear that one "CLACKING" Watch how fast the pushrod is spinning, it'll be really whizzing around. Tighten the nut till the clack goes away, the pushrod spin will slow down. keep tightening until it's quiet, then a litle more, I just do a qtr turn. The pushrod should spin 1/2 - 1 rev everytime that valve opens and closes. Run down the whole side that way. When you're done, that side should be wqueit, and all the pushrods should be turning at close to the same speed.
Swap your valve covers and do the same to the other side, should be good to go.





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post #11 of 26 (permalink) Old Nov 23rd, 05, 09:10 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Can someone tell me the correct way to check lift at the pushrod?

I have adjusted them that way already. Put the covers back on let it run a while and then here comes the noises again. So then I tried bringing each cylinder up to TDC and adjust to what feels like zero lash, then add 1/4 - 1/2 turn. Same results.

When I assembled the engine I adjusted the valves before installing the intake. That way I could see the lifter. I have never had this problem before.


I appreciate the input from everyone, keep it coming. At this point I'll try anything.
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post #12 of 26 (permalink) Old Nov 23rd, 05, 09:25 PM
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Re: Can someone tell me the correct way to check lift at the pushrod?

well..... try adjusting them one more time. Make sure the motor is fully warm first. Drive it awhile or whatever, get it hot, then put on your cut up valve cover.
Another possibility is that your rocker nuts are old and loose, and they're loosening up on you, that's about the only other thing I can think of. I suppose if you have pressed in studs, they could be pulling out on you, but that's really stretching.
One thing I know for sure is... if the pushrods are not or barely spinning, something is wrong, and I'm hoping that something is just that they're too tight. The alternative is that something is very wrong. Remember, the spinning lifters are what spins the pushrods, and if the lifters don't spin, the cam will go flat.





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post #13 of 26 (permalink) Old Nov 23rd, 05, 10:08 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Can someone tell me the correct way to check lift at the pushrod?

Let me ask this. If I loosen up a rocker to the point that it is loose and noisy if the pushrod still doesn't spin I've got bigger problems and there's no use to try adjusting them further. Right?
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post #14 of 26 (permalink) Old Nov 24th, 05, 06:53 AM
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Re: Can someone tell me the correct way to check lift at the pushrod?

right.
There was a post not too long ago by GOSFAST discussing things like cam location in the block and where the lifter holes should be in relation to the cam lobes that might apply here.





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post #15 of 26 (permalink) Old Nov 24th, 05, 10:07 AM Thread Starter
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Unhappy Re: Can someone tell me the correct way to check lift at the pushrod?

Well I went out this morning and loosened up one of the rockers that the pushrod wasn't spinning, I mean loose. It still didn't spin. So I pulled the intake. Here are some pics of the lifters that look like they weren't spinning, do you all agree?

I guess these lobes are wiped right? I haven't pulled the valve cover or lifters on the other side yet, I might do that this evening after turkey. All the lifters could be spun with just one finger placed on the plunger.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v2...ifters0072.jpg


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v2...ifters0071.jpg
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