Starter wire, battery relocation question? - Team Camaro Tech
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post #1 of 10 (permalink) Old Feb 18th, 08, 11:41 AM Thread Starter
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Starter wire, battery relocation question?

I put a ford solenoid in the trunk. The small 16 gauge wire that activates it is on the starter as of now. Question..Could I take it off the starter and run it to the solenoid in the trunk to activate it then just make a small jumper from the 1 Gauge starter wire at the starter to the "S" terminal on the starter. I'm affraid the amperage in the 1 gauge will be too much.

Or should I just "T" into the small wire and run it to the back also. So the 1 wire will be on both "S" terminals on the starter and solenoid. When the key is turned on It will give power to both. When the power goes to the rear solenoid it will give power to the 1 Gauge wire starting the car.

What one is correct? Here's a lame diagram....

Thanks

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Last edited by mnm99; Oct 9th, 08 at 05:08 AM.
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post #2 of 10 (permalink) Old Feb 18th, 08, 12:03 PM
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Re: Starter wire, battery relocation question?

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Originally Posted by mnm99 View Post
I put a ford solenoid in the trunk. The small 16 gauge wire that activates it is on the starter as of now. Question..Could I take it off the starter and run it to the solenoid in the trunk to activate it then just make a small jumper from the 1 Gauge starter wire at the starter to the "S" terminal on the starter. I'm affraid the amperage in the 1 gauge will be too much.
Good choice.

Quote:
Or should I just "T" into the small wire and run it to the back also. So the 1 wire will be on both "S" terminals on the starter and solenoid. When the key is turned on It will give power to both. When the power goes to the rear solenoid it will give power to the 1 Gauge wire starting the car.
Bad choice.

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post #3 of 10 (permalink) Old Feb 18th, 08, 01:38 PM
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Re: Starter wire, battery relocation question?

I like the first option since it will reduce the liklihood of having a starting circuit problem at two places. The first option is less likely to fail and will be easier to troubleshoot.

The "real" ford relay bypass circuit that has been used by so many to cure the "heat soak" problem has a short copper strap tha connects the battery connection on the solenoid directly to the starter motor winding. In effect, it BYPASSES the relay contactor inside the starter solenoid letting the ford solenoid carry all the electrical load.

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Last edited by JimM; Feb 22nd, 08 at 07:16 PM. Reason: clarify
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post #4 of 10 (permalink) Old Feb 18th, 08, 03:02 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Starter wire, battery relocation question?

The only thing I was concerned about was the ammount of power running from the starter wire through the little jumper to the S terminal at the starter. With all that power needed to turn the starter wouldn't melt the little wire? Maybe I'm wrong at this????

1968 Camaro Convertible ,350 TWIN TURBO , PTC 3000 stall, Hotchkis TVS kit / Subframe connectors, Caltracs, 9" rear, Street Star wheels (P275/40ZR17 / P235/45/17) , Electric cutouts. [B] .....FOR SALE.....

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post #5 of 10 (permalink) Old Feb 18th, 08, 06:30 PM
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Re: Starter wire, battery relocation question?

The 'S' wire won't draw but a few amps, so I don't think you'll have a problem there. Seems like someone took a measurement and it was something like 3 or 4 amps to engage the solenoid. In any case, it's not much. Just make sure the wire carrying the starter current is plenty big and you should be fine.

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post #6 of 10 (permalink) Old Feb 19th, 08, 03:08 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Starter wire, battery relocation question?


1968 Camaro Convertible ,350 TWIN TURBO , PTC 3000 stall, Hotchkis TVS kit / Subframe connectors, Caltracs, 9" rear, Street Star wheels (P275/40ZR17 / P235/45/17) , Electric cutouts. [B] .....FOR SALE.....
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post #7 of 10 (permalink) Old Feb 22nd, 08, 03:22 PM
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Re: Starter wire, battery relocation question?

This circuit is pretty simple. At the risk of over-simplfing this.....

Stock - 12 Volts flows from the battery to the positive terminal of the solenoid and stops. The "S" terminal circuit runs from the terminal through an electro-magnetic winding in the solenoid to ground.

* When the "S" terminal is energized (via keyed voltage), it will pull the core (that round cylinder attached to the starter drive fork) in, throwing the drive into the ring gear.

At the end of that stroke, it will push a small rod towards the front of the solenoid. This is attached to a copper coated disc that makes contact with the Positive Terminal (12V charged), the starter motor windings, and the "I" terminal on the front of the solenoid. The "I" terminal can supply full voltage to the coil when cranking. (also know as a resistor bypass)

When contact is made between the positive and starter terminals, current flows through the starter windings and the starter motor turns.

When power is discontinued at the "S' terminal, the magnetic field ceases and the solenoid spring throws the drive back out of the ring gear and a smaller spring in the solenoid pushes the copper coated disk away from the solenoid contacts and electricity quits flowing to the starter windings and the starter quits spinning.

Modified - The only difference is that the live electrical current stops at the remotely located Ford solenoid. It is still controlled by keyed voltage to the "S" terminal. When energized, current flows the length on the normally dead cable, to the GM starter solenoid, through a JUMPER to the "S" terminal of the solenoid which starts the process at *.

When the key is released, voltage ceases to flow down the cable, across the JUMPER to the "S" terminal of the GM solenoid, the drive retracts and the current flow to the starter windings stops.

Because it causes current to flow to both the solenoid magnetic field and the starter windings at the same time, I suppose you could call it a shunt. But because we are modifying a circuit, most of us would call it a jumper. Either way, there is no magic in a simple piece of metal that conducts electricity.

Last edited by mikebrow74; Feb 24th, 08 at 10:15 AM.
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post #8 of 10 (permalink) Old Feb 22nd, 08, 07:19 PM
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Re: Starter wire, battery relocation question?

Mike's got this covered pretty well, I think.





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post #9 of 10 (permalink) Old Feb 23rd, 08, 05:00 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Starter wire, battery relocation question?

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Originally Posted by JimM View Post
Mike's got this covered pretty well, I think.
Sure does! Almost done with the relocate. Man this cost more than I figured....$500+ and still counting!It looks good though.

1968 Camaro Convertible ,350 TWIN TURBO , PTC 3000 stall, Hotchkis TVS kit / Subframe connectors, Caltracs, 9" rear, Street Star wheels (P275/40ZR17 / P235/45/17) , Electric cutouts. [B] .....FOR SALE.....
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post #10 of 10 (permalink) Old Mar 24th, 16, 12:26 PM
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Re: Starter wire, battery relocation question?

I just spent an hour on the phone with Mark from Mad Electrical on this subject. If you are using an older set up the starters did not draw to much current and the left side small stud on the solenoid can work....although he said the new solenoid's are all junk and we will probably run into problems. The best way to run the blue wire to the starter is through a relay and splice the wire to your key on off switch. I have he's manual and will take a picture of it and post it tonight. The newer starters take a lot more juice to activate and with the newer solenoid's (being junk) they do not poses the best component's and can cause the starter to not disengage from shorting with out the use of a relay.

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Last edited by dondb; Mar 24th, 16 at 12:42 PM. Reason: added more
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