Brake Lights Don't Light - Team Camaro Tech
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post #1 of 17 (permalink) Old Feb 21st, 09, 03:44 PM Thread Starter
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Brake Lights Don't Light

Horn and hazards fixed. Thank you all for help with that. Now my brake lights dont light when pressing on the brake.

What I have found out so far:

With key in the ignition, turned to accessory...

Brake Fuse = Good (Using a light stick I checked the left and right fuse prongs, with fuse installed [Just to be sure: it's the bottom fuse of an original type fuse panel, correct?]. I have steady green light on each side of the fuse, with fuse installed.)

One item of note - the center fuse [4th one down of the 8 fuses] on my original 67 fuse panel has no voltage on either side. The label says "inst." and "lps". What will this affect?

Brake switch = Good. (I light sticked top pin of brake pedal plug, got Steady green light. Bottom pin gets steady green light when brake pedal depressed.)

Rear Light bulbs/sockets = Good. (Assuming the brakes use the same bulbs, they light when using the hazards and/or turn signals)

So - what's left to check? Please give me the "for dummies" version if you are willing to help. I am a noob with electrical stuff.

Thank you all in advance for your help. I am in crisis mode, as I have 4 days to get this car to pass a safety inspection on Oahu then get it on a Matson ship before I PCS back to the mainland. Thank you. Thank you! Thank you!!

Plain Jane 67 w/ Original 327/210.
Mods: 3spd Saginaw now a PowerGlide. 2bbl Rochester now a Holley 4bbl (4160). Hardened Valve Seats. 133k Miles. Everything else is original. Family car since 1968!
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post #2 of 17 (permalink) Old Feb 21st, 09, 04:09 PM
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Re: Brake Lights Don't Light

Right stop light is dark green; left stop is yellow. Both go through hazard switch and turn signal switch.

So if turn signal works, uses the same filament, then I would say t/sig switch is not making contact for brake power from brake switch.

Fiddle with t/signal lever/switch and brakes should work with no key on, straight battery power, as in hazard power.

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post #3 of 17 (permalink) Old Feb 21st, 09, 04:39 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Brake Lights Don't Light

Quote:
Originally Posted by Everett#2390 View Post
Right stop light is dark green; left stop is yellow. Both go through hazard switch and turn signal switch.

So if turn signal works, uses the same filament, then I would say t/sig switch is not making contact for brake power from brake switch.

Fiddle with t/signal lever/switch and brakes should work with no key on, straight battery power, as in hazard power.
With key in and turned to accessory, turn signals work. (key out, they dont) So Ev, I do what? With the key off, I "Fiddle with the turn signal switch"? BRB

OK - tried that- key out, stepped on brakes, hit the turn signal left and right switch several times - no change.

Plain Jane 67 w/ Original 327/210.
Mods: 3spd Saginaw now a PowerGlide. 2bbl Rochester now a Holley 4bbl (4160). Hardened Valve Seats. 133k Miles. Everything else is original. Family car since 1968!
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post #4 of 17 (permalink) Old Feb 21st, 09, 07:37 PM
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Re: Brake Lights Don't Light

Quote:
Originally Posted by midratz.com View Post
One item of note - the center fuse [4th one down of the 8 fuses] on my original 67 fuse panel has no voltage on either side. The label says "inst." and "lps". What will this affect?
That fuse is for dash (instrument) Lamps, it's fed from the tail light fuse only when the tail lights are on.
Brake light circuit goes from fuse through the B/L switch to the T/S switch then out to Brake light T/S bulb filament. I'd say you need a new T/S switch but you might be able to get it to work by "fiddleing" with the hazard switch or the turn signal lever.

Jeff
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post #5 of 17 (permalink) Old Feb 21st, 09, 11:29 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Brake Lights Don't Light

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Originally Posted by yellow69RS View Post
That fuse is for dash (instrument) Lamps, it's fed from the tail light fuse only when the tail lights are on.
Brake light circuit goes from fuse through the B/L switch to the T/S switch then out to Brake light T/S bulb filament. I'd say you need a new T/S switch but you might be able to get it to work by "fiddleing" with the hazard switch or the turn signal lever.

Jeff
So, since i have no current going to the brake lights, thats why that inst fuse has no voltage? So once i figure out this brake light prob, the voltage will come back to that inst fuse?

So a degraded t/s switch can work fine for t/s'ing, yet stop current from getting to the brake fillaments? How do you all suggest i "fiddle" the t/s? Like wiggle it? Or take the steering column apart and get at the wires going to the
t/s switch. Anyone know of a tutorial out there on t/s switch replacement? Is it
simple enough for a noob as i to figure out you think?

Plain Jane 67 w/ Original 327/210.
Mods: 3spd Saginaw now a PowerGlide. 2bbl Rochester now a Holley 4bbl (4160). Hardened Valve Seats. 133k Miles. Everything else is original. Family car since 1968!
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post #6 of 17 (permalink) Old Feb 22nd, 09, 06:40 AM
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Re: Brake Lights Don't Light

The inst fuse gets current from tail light fuse, I had brake light problem on a 79 caprice
the white wire at turn signal connector was broken at the haromicna connector. But spliced around the connector worked fine.
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post #7 of 17 (permalink) Old Feb 22nd, 09, 07:16 AM
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Re: Brake Lights Don't Light

I just repaired many and I mean many electrical problems on my 69. I would suggest before you tear anything major apart like your turn signal, you need to make sure you have good ground wire connections. There are two or three in the trunk. Remove the screw, cut off the connector, put on a new connector, sand the steel and put in a new screw. Also check the wiring connections right at the socket. I've found that although the wire looks intact, the copper inside was broken but the insulation looked good. This happens after 40 years of replacing bulbs. As in all electrical troubleshooting, look for the simple and most obvious befroe diving in deep.
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post #8 of 17 (permalink) Old Feb 22nd, 09, 07:57 AM
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Re: Brake Lights Don't Light

keep in mind 67-68 and 69 all have some different grounding points. They are not all the same but they are the most important thing to a good working elec. system. Buy a box of star washers and clean up any grounds you can find. Refer to the AIM for all locations in the wiring diagrams there.

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post #9 of 17 (permalink) Old Feb 22nd, 09, 08:00 AM
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Re: Brake Lights Don't Light

As John has already mentioned the tail light circuit supplies current to the inst lamps, if you checlk that fuse with the tail lights on it'll have power. I don't believe your problem is in the trunk as your turn signal work. Turn signal switch replacement is not too difficult but at this point the availability of parts might be an issue.

Jeff
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post #10 of 17 (permalink) Old Feb 22nd, 09, 08:56 AM
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Re: Brake Lights Don't Light

Turn signal switch might be bought at most any auto electrical store/shop selling Standard Motor Products parts. TS-24, 72-67 Chev truck, comes with adapting harness. I'm only speculating.

I'm sure other aftermarket suppliers can supply, NAPA?

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post #11 of 17 (permalink) Old Feb 22nd, 09, 10:28 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Brake Lights Don't Light

Quote:
Originally Posted by john68 View Post
The inst fuse gets current from tail light fuse, I had brake light problem on a 79 caprice
the white wire at turn signal connector was broken at the haromicna connector. But spliced around the connector worked fine.
Harmonica connector? What's that? Where's that?

Plain Jane 67 w/ Original 327/210.
Mods: 3spd Saginaw now a PowerGlide. 2bbl Rochester now a Holley 4bbl (4160). Hardened Valve Seats. 133k Miles. Everything else is original. Family car since 1968!
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post #12 of 17 (permalink) Old Feb 22nd, 09, 11:05 AM
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Re: Brake Lights Don't Light

The flat long connector, for the turn signal switch, so the wires can fold back and slip
thru the colum, my 68 uses a semi circular style, If you saw the connector you would
understand the nickname.
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post #13 of 17 (permalink) Old Feb 22nd, 09, 03:11 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Brake Lights Don't Light

I got lucky and found an AC-Delco turn signal wire harness at NAPA for just shy of $90.00 This thing scares me. Before I jump in and try and swap this thing out - could someone please walk me through where and how to test my wiring from my brake switch (which is good) to the T/S assy, then from the T/S assy to the rear fillaments. I just cant shake the feeling its probably a relatively simple reconnection of a loose wire somewhere in this area. I mean - a tech did go into this area and fix my corroded horn spring post. Maybe he jolted something loose.

So - I have my test light at the ready, where/what color wires and test points do I check first.

Thanks all!

Plain Jane 67 w/ Original 327/210.
Mods: 3spd Saginaw now a PowerGlide. 2bbl Rochester now a Holley 4bbl (4160). Hardened Valve Seats. 133k Miles. Everything else is original. Family car since 1968!
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post #14 of 17 (permalink) Old Feb 22nd, 09, 03:54 PM
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Re: Brake Lights Don't Light

OK see if I can talk us thur this, I can probally ckeck quicker than I can type,
There is a white wire out of brake pedal switch, orange in, use test light, Pointed end,
ground wire out top, We call electric ice pick. Orange shouhd be hot at all times, white
wire hot with brake pedal pressed, The white wire goes to the turn signal sw. check it at both sides of the connector. this connector is simi circular, check both sides, with test light, wires can brake inside the insulation. Wiggle wires whyle checking, if no problem there problem is up in column or in turn switch, O yea, check wlite wire with brake pedal pressed, Goog luck.
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post #15 of 17 (permalink) Old Feb 22nd, 09, 04:29 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Brake Lights Don't Light

Quote:
Originally Posted by john68 View Post
OK see if I can talk us thur this, I can probally ckeck quicker than I can type,
There is a white wire out of brake pedal switch, orange in, use test light, Pointed end,
ground wire out top, We call electric ice pick. Orange shouhd be hot at all times, white
wire hot with brake pedal pressed, The white wire goes to the turn signal sw. check it at both sides of the connector. this connector is simi circular, check both sides, with test light, wires can brake inside the insulation. Wiggle wires whyle checking, if no problem there problem is up in column or in turn switch, O yea, check wlite wire with brake pedal pressed, Goog luck.
Well- Good News! Probably while you were typing this I mustered up the courage to try and replace this T/S wiring harness. It was after I had the old harness out and dangling from the steering column, wondering how in the h-e-double fish stick I was going to get the old wires out, and route the new ones through, that the idea dawned on me to just plug in the new harness first without removing the old completely and see if the problem was even there in the first place. So I did - and the brake lights started working! Then I thought "is it the main harness assy, or the little "harmonica to half pipe" smaller harness that did the trick. I removed the main assy, and plugged the old main harness into the smaller new harness, and the brake lights still worked. The I thought - what if it was just the act of plugging and unplugging the things that actually fixed the problem. Sure enough, I reconnected all the original stuff, and, you guessed it, the brake lights (and everything else) still worked.

Long story short. Had I just unplugged and replugged all the wiring harnesses, I would have had this problem licked days ago.

Now on to the safety inspection site tomorrow, and a nice fat Padron 1926 stogie today!

Woo hoo. Thanks guys for all your help.

Jason - out.

Plain Jane 67 w/ Original 327/210.
Mods: 3spd Saginaw now a PowerGlide. 2bbl Rochester now a Holley 4bbl (4160). Hardened Valve Seats. 133k Miles. Everything else is original. Family car since 1968!
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