Electric Fan Power Source - Team Camaro Tech
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post #1 of 31 (permalink) Old Mar 7th, 09, 04:53 PM Thread Starter
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David
 
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Question Electric Fan Power Source

The control module for the electric fan on my '69 Camaro is wired to get its' power directly from the battery(wire connected to the positive battery cable). I have read threads where the horn relay can be used as a power source. I would like to change the wiring of the control module as it is only a few inches from the horn relay. Would the correct way to power the control module consist of hooking up the power lead to the side of the horn relay where the red wire is attached as in the photo below.........


Thanks in advance for the assistance, it's greatly appreciated.

David F.

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post #2 of 31 (permalink) Old Mar 7th, 09, 05:34 PM
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Brandon
 
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Re: Electric Fan Power Source

You can hook up to either that post or the one with the black wire. Or to prevent any shorting of the system. Run through a relay that way it won't take your whole electrical system down with it.

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post #3 of 31 (permalink) Old Mar 7th, 09, 05:42 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Electric Fan Power Source

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nantooch View Post
You can hook up to either that post or the one with the black wire. Or to prevent any shorting of the system. Run through a relay that way it won't take your whole electrical system down with it.
Thanks for the info Brandon. Any recommendations on what type of relay????

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post #4 of 31 (permalink) Old Mar 7th, 09, 06:37 PM
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Dale
 
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Re: Electric Fan Power Source

I would wire it directly to the battery, with a dedicated 8-10 gauge wire. Install a circuit breaker right close to the battery.
Relay.. your basic bosch relay will do fine. They usually are rated for 30 amps.
Like this
http://www.classictruckshop.com/club...h/foglites.htm

The relay looks like this, and can be found at any parts store.
http://www.waytekwire.com/automotive-relays.htm
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post #5 of 31 (permalink) Old Mar 7th, 09, 06:41 PM Thread Starter
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David
 
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Re: Electric Fan Power Source

Quote:
Originally Posted by dale68z View Post
I would wire it directly to the battery, with a dedicated 8-10 gauge wire. Install a circuit breaker right close to the battery.
Relay.. your basic bosch relay will do fine. They usually are rated for 30 amps.
Like this
http://www.classictruckshop.com/club...h/foglites.htm

The relay looks like this, and can be found at any parts store.
http://www.waytekwire.com/automotive-relays.htm
Dale
Thanks Dale!!!!!!!

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post #6 of 31 (permalink) Old Mar 7th, 09, 06:45 PM
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Re: Electric Fan Power Source

I agree with Dale. While you could use the horn relay, the 8 ga wire to the horn relay is supplying all power to the vehicle. When you add the 30 amps or so drawn by the fans, you're likely to see some voltage droop and some heating of the wire between the battery and the horn relay.

Your wiring looks very nice. If you still have the junction block behind the battery on the radiator support, tap in there with an eyelet terminal and a piece of fusable link. Install a self reseting circuit breaker in the same general area and use that power supply to feed the fan relay. That'll keep your main power feed isolated from the high current of the fans and be plenty safe.

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post #7 of 31 (permalink) Old Mar 7th, 09, 06:55 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Electric Fan Power Source

Quote:
Originally Posted by dnult View Post
I agree with Dale. While you could use the horn relay, the 8 ga wire to the horn relay is supplying all power to the vehicle. When you add the 30 amps or so drawn by the fans, you're likely to see some voltage droop and some heating of the wire between the battery and the horn relay.

Your wiring looks very nice. If you still have the junction block behind the battery on the radiator support, tap in there with an eyelet terminal and a piece of fusable link. Install a self reseting circuit breaker in the same general area and use that power supply to feed the fan relay. That'll keep your main power feed isolated from the high current of the fans and be plenty safe.
Thanks for the recommendations Dave!!! This looks like the best way to proceed.

David F.

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post #8 of 31 (permalink) Old Mar 14th, 09, 03:29 PM Thread Starter
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David
 
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Re: Electric Fan Power Source

I need some advice in regards to how I need to wire the fan control module to function with a relay. I used the recommended link containing this diagram to create a schematic of how I believe I need to wire my fan control module.......................


Based on the diagram above,this is how I "think" the fan control module should be wired.............



Wiil this work?? Do I have to connect directly to the battery,or will a connection at the junction block suffice?? Where in the circuit would the fusible link and self resetting circuit breaker be installed?
Thanks in advance for any/all help,it's greatly appreciated.

David F.

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My Machine: 1969 Pro Street Camaro
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post #9 of 31 (permalink) Old Mar 14th, 09, 04:10 PM
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Re: Electric Fan Power Source

I'm not sure you need the relay in that setup. The fan control module is the current handling device so the relay isn't needed (I would think). You definately wouldn't want the relay connected to battery power at the fuse block since it'd be on all the time. The fusable link and breaker would be installed where you show a 20A fuse.

Dave
========================
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post #10 of 31 (permalink) Old Mar 14th, 09, 04:12 PM
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Steiner
 
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Re: Electric Fan Power Source

Like a couple of guys already said, it would be best not to use the junction. The cable feeding it was sized for the amperage load of the original accessories on the car and I figure that in those days they weren't sized for add-ons. By connecting to the junction, you're adding on a 15A or so draw to that cable and may overload it if you have a lot of accessories running at the same time. That could melt the cable insulation or burn the cable.

When I installed a Flex-a-Lite fan in my truck, I ran 10AWG cable from the battery to an auto-reset circuit breaker to the fan supply. Then I used an unused fused circuit at the fuse panel to supply the control voltage. All you need is either the circuit breaker which the kit should have come with OR fusible link OR a fuse. Using a combination is redundant.


Quote:
Originally Posted by 1969ProStreetCamaro View Post
I need some advice in regards to how I need to wire the fan control module to function with a relay. I used the recommended link containing this diagram to create a schematic of how I believe I need to wire my fan control module.......................


Based on the diagram above,this is how I "think" the fan control module should be wired.............



Wiil this work?? Do I have to connect directly to the battery,or will a connection at the junction block suffice?? Where in the circuit would the fusible link and self resetting circuit breaker be installed?
Thanks in advance for any/all help,it's greatly appreciated.

David F.
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post #11 of 31 (permalink) Old Mar 14th, 09, 04:19 PM Thread Starter
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David
 
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Re: Electric Fan Power Source

Quote:
Originally Posted by dnult View Post
I'm not sure you need the relay in that setup. The fan control module is the current handling device so the relay isn't needed (I would think). You definately wouldn't want the relay connected to battery power at the fuse block since it'd be on all the time. The fusable link and breaker would be installed where you show a 20A fuse.

........so where I indicate a connection to "ignition or battery power" at the fuse block, it should be replaced by a connection to the ignition switch??, or can I just power the control module with 8 gauge wire from the battery and be done??

David F.

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post #12 of 31 (permalink) Old Mar 14th, 09, 04:33 PM
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Steiner
 
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Re: Electric Fan Power Source

Does your fan have a temperature sensor?
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post #13 of 31 (permalink) Old Mar 14th, 09, 04:39 PM Thread Starter
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David
 
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Re: Electric Fan Power Source

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steiner View Post
Does your fan have a temperature sensor?

Yes, it installs into the upper radiator hose and is connected to the control module in my diagram.

David F.

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post #14 of 31 (permalink) Old Mar 14th, 09, 04:46 PM
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Steiner
 
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Re: Electric Fan Power Source

Quote:
Originally Posted by 1969ProStreetCamaro View Post
Yes, it installs into the upper radiator hose and is connected to the control module in my diagram.

David F.
OK. You need at least two 12V supplies.

One is the high current supply that is going to run your fan. That is the one that needs to come directly from the battery and have 20A protection (circuit breaker or fuse) or whatever your documentation states.

The other is control voltage for the circuit board which comes from a 12V supply that is switched, i.e. on with the ignition on. It only needs to be a 5 amp circuit. With it being a switched circuit, your fan cannot run with the ignition off. You should also fuse it to be safe. Make sure it is an independent circuit and not shared. My Flex-a-Lite control board was dirty as hell. I used a 12V signal from several places and had things like ABS lights come on or the windshield wipers start running when the fan would kick on.

If you want, you can wire in a switch to turn your fan on and off as you see fit on either the A/C circuit or the manual switch circuit. The A/C one is usually wired to the A/C condensor clutch signal line so that when the A/C kicks on, the fan comes on. Your switch circuit should also come from an ignition switched source so that if you accidentally leave it on the fan doesn't run.

The controls are in your fan box. When the temperature hits your set temperature, it uses a transducer to close the contacts of the low current 12V signal which is the coil of the relay supplying the high current 12 volts from the battery to the fan.
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post #15 of 31 (permalink) Old Mar 14th, 09, 05:25 PM Thread Starter
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David
 
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Re: Electric Fan Power Source

Quote:
Originally Posted by dnult View Post
I'm not sure you need the relay in that setup. The fan control module is the current handling device so the relay isn't needed (I would think). You definately wouldn't want the relay connected to battery power at the fuse block since it'd be on all the time. The fusable link and breaker would be installed where you show a 20A fuse.
...Oops!! I should have stated "Switched 12 volt Source"



Quote:
Originally Posted by Steiner View Post
Like a couple of guys already said, it would be best not to use the junction. The cable feeding it was sized for the amperage load of the original accessories on the car and I figure that in those days they weren't sized for add-ons. By connecting to the junction, you're adding on a 15A or so draw to that cable and may overload it if you have a lot of accessories running at the same time. That could melt the cable insulation or burn the cable.

When I installed a Flex-a-Lite fan in my truck, I ran 10AWG cable from the battery to an auto-reset circuit breaker to the fan supply. Then I used an unused fused circuit at the fuse panel to supply the control voltage. All you need is either the circuit breaker which the kit should have come with OR fusible link OR a fuse. Using a combination is redundant.
.......currently wired to the battery and has a fuse,but I like the idea of using the circuit breaker.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steiner View Post
OK. You need at least two 12V supplies.

One is the high current supply that is going to run your fan. That is the one that needs to come directly from the battery and have 20A protection (circuit breaker or fuse) or whatever your documentation states.

The other is control voltage for the circuit board which comes from a 12V supply that is switched, i.e. on with the ignition on. It only needs to be a 5 amp circuit. With it being a switched circuit, your fan cannot run with the ignition off. You should also fuse it to be safe. Make sure it is an independent circuit and not shared.
....control module is currently wired as you describe above. My thoughts for using a relay in the circuit is to reduce the load on the (brand new) wiring. Are my concerns of using a relay in the circuit unecessary???

David F.

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My Machine: 1969 Pro Street Camaro
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