Elec total loss! - Team Camaro Tech
Electrical & Wiring Troubleshooting electrical.

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post #1 of 18 (permalink) Old Oct 13th, 10, 10:25 PM Thread Starter
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Elec total loss!

Hey ,

yesterday night I try to start my 68 Camaro, the starter turns for a second than the elentric was total off.No light, no starter not even radio or blower is working .

The aaa tried to help but didn't found the problem , because old Muscle cars are very rare in Germany.

So last night I had a look on the wiring diagram, but I don't really know were to start for trouble shooting.

Is there a master fuse or anything like that?

I ask because the Batterie has 12,7 V and the red wire which goes from the engine compartment to the fuse panel ( rear side) has also 12,7 V and the fuses look as there is not anyone broken.

Did anybody had the same problem before?

Thanks Giorgio
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post #2 of 18 (permalink) Old Oct 13th, 10, 10:53 PM
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Re: Elec total loss!

If you put a screwdriver across the terminals on the back of the starter (and it does give quite a spark) one way the solenoid with throw in the other way the starter will spin...if does that starter is working

All the ign lights are out....check the middle fuse (I think) ign.

My Spelling is not incorrect...it is creative

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post #3 of 18 (permalink) Old Oct 13th, 10, 11:00 PM
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Re: Elec total loss!

I would say check the fusible link attached to the horn relay. It is a pretty thick wire and if it stretches when you pull on it it is burned up.

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post #4 of 18 (permalink) Old Oct 13th, 10, 11:40 PM
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Re: Elec total loss!

Check the junction block behind the battery. A 12 volt wire from the battery hooks to it, then powers the main harness, lights, signals, radio. It is on the end of the core support. Small plastic part that has a metal stud with threads. They are bad for rusting and the little nut holding the wire falls off or rusts or the threads get screwed up or corrodes... Good Luck...

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post #5 of 18 (permalink) Old Oct 14th, 10, 12:23 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Elec total loss!

Thanks for the quick answers .

@ jess : I check the junction block and 12,7 V in and 12,7 out

@ larry : Is the horn relay behind the battery ( unter water bowl of radiator rh side) or is that one on the left side of the raditor support bracket?

@Steptoe : Middle Fuse ? were IGN is written on the fuse panel is an cable lug on .Is that the fuse?

Thanks Giorgio
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post #6 of 18 (permalink) Old Oct 14th, 10, 04:15 AM
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Re: Elec total loss!

Junction block check is good, next to the battery - has positive pigtail bolted to it.
Horn relay is on the other side of radiator and has two red wires on the a buss bar - also one of the red wires has a small section is orange this is the fusible link. You measured battery voltage there, good so far. However, removing them from the buss bar and wire brushing them won't hurt.
Fuse panel inside at BAT terminal should have battery voltage all the time.
At fuse panel, IGN fuse, yes, this is the one, with IGN switch ON, should have battery voltage. No voltage here, then ign switch bad or the red wire from the fuse panel to headlamp switch and ign switch is not making good contact, there is a crimp splitting the red wire in the dash.

Could be a loose wire in the firewall connector, maybe tighten the screw securing the connector together?
Another simple check is to check voltage between the battery cable clamp and the battery post with the meter. A dirty/corroded connection will show battery voltage across the junction with power is demanded, like cranking the engine or turning on headlights.

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post #7 of 18 (permalink) Old Oct 14th, 10, 11:30 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Elec total loss!

What I checked today :

After the bus bar at the horn relais is no in line fuse ( fusible link) installed,
the preowner has removed it and drilled several red wires together .

Removed the ignition switch and there was only 12,7 V only on the red wire,all others 0 V.

When ignition switch in on : 0 V on IGN on fuse panel.

Checked and removed all fuses of the fuse panel , all fuses ok and removed any corrosion .

With all fuses installed and ignition switch in off : I have only on the left side of the fuse panel 12,7 V , in the middle and right side all 0 V .
And when I turn the ignition switch to on : the left side of the fuse panel goes to 0 V on all left hand fuses .

Its crazy it seems that there is short circuit, but I dont have any idea where .
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post #8 of 18 (permalink) Old Oct 14th, 10, 12:30 PM
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Re: Elec total loss!

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Originally Posted by Trickerlog View Post
With all fuses installed and ignition switch in off : I have only on the left side of the fuse panel 12,7 V , in the middle and right side all 0 V .
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And when I turn the ignition switch to on : the left side of the fuse panel goes to 0 V on all left hand fuses . Its crazy it seems that there is short circuit, but I dont have any idea where .
No, you don't have a short, just a wire/connection not passing any current to handle the demand due to either broken strands, corroded connection/crimp, etc.

With key on, IGN, measure the battery voltage from the battery to the fuse panel, at every connection point and where the reading goes to less than 1 volt, back up one step to the battery where battery voltage is read.

The path in between these two points is faulty - bad connection - could be behind the fuse panel through the firewall or a loosen terminal.

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post #9 of 18 (permalink) Old Oct 14th, 10, 01:19 PM
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Re: Elec total loss!

After you get this figured out you need to make sure you have a fusible link attached to the red wire going to the horn relay buss bar. Maybe attach a picture of that area. It is not an inline fuse but a piece of wire designed to burn out if there is a short and it is important.

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post #10 of 18 (permalink) Old Oct 18th, 10, 03:21 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Elec total loss!

The failure is still there and it seems to me that it is a bonding lead problem of the batterie!!!!!!!!

Can anybody tell the way and contacts of the bonding lead ( ground wire / cable) from the batterie to the body,that I can check all this bondings for broken or missing leads or bad contacts because of corrosion ?????????


Thanks Giorgio

Last edited by Trickerlog; Oct 18th, 10 at 03:56 AM.
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post #11 of 18 (permalink) Old Oct 18th, 10, 04:30 AM
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Re: Elec total loss!

The negative cable attaches to the engine, if '67 or '68, intake manifold; if '69 and later, alternator bracket. Moving to engine block itself would be a good choice.

The neg cable pigtail gets attached to the fender by a sheet metal screw.
Also, if car has the AM radio suppression option, there should be two ground straps, looks like braided wire, from the firewall to both valve cover bolts, one each per side if a V8, or the last valve cover bolt if a L6. Lastly, there would be a ground strap from the pass side firewall subframe cage to subframe just under the heater.

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post #12 of 18 (permalink) Old Oct 18th, 10, 06:31 AM
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Re: Elec total loss!

I would double check the connection at the bulkhead connector on the firewall. It could be a loose or corrodided connection between the 2 bulkheads.

Mike
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post #13 of 18 (permalink) Old Oct 18th, 10, 11:01 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Elec total loss!

All ground strap attachment points were in bad condition, but it was not the reason .

I opened the wire bundles and found a burned wire , the colour is not more visible, but I read the wiring diagram it should be the pink wire.The other thing is that after replacement of the wire I have only 10,9 V on the wire , but on the battery Ive got 12,7 V , so it seems there is a contact resistance anywhere.

I ve got some trouble with the reading of the wire diagram ,because I have no abbreviation list of the colour codes , do anybody has a list of that ( LBL, DBL .etc ? ).

Thanks Giorgio
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post #14 of 18 (permalink) Old Oct 19th, 10, 04:35 AM
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Re: Elec total loss!

BRN = BROWN T = TAN
OR = ORANGE
P = PINK
R = RED
PPL = PURPLE
GRN = GREEN
LG = LIGHT GREEN
DG = DARK GREEN
B = BLUE
LBL = LIGHT BLUE
DBL = DARK BLUE
GY = GRAY
Y = YELLOW
W = WHITE
BRN/W = BROWN with WHITE strip
DBL/W = DARK BLUE with WHITE strip
B = BLACK
B/W = BLACK & WHITE

Replacement wire went from where to where? What circuit?

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post #15 of 18 (permalink) Old Oct 19th, 10, 04:48 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Elec total loss!

Thank you very much Everett .

In winter time I will modify my fuse panel and the bulk head con. with quick disconnects like this : http://www.ifcet.com/UploadFiles/201032617518748.jpg

and a brand new modern fuse panel and that will solve the eletric problems .

Thanks Giorgio
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