Best Ignition/Distributor - Team Camaro Tech
Electrical & Wiring Troubleshooting electrical.

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #1 of 20 (permalink) Old Jul 6th, 15, 01:15 PM Thread Starter
Gold Lifetime Member
Jim
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Torrance
Posts: 399
Garage
Best Ignition/Distributor

As I'm beginning to research all the parts I'll need to bring my 67 back to life, I'm wondering what Ignition/Distributor would be best for a Street/Strip application. I used to run a Stinger Ignition and still have it and it looks to be in good shape but that is 25 year old technology and I'm sure there have been many improvements throughout the years in regards to ignition systems. What is your opinion on MSD E-Curve Distributors? MSD vs Mallory vs any other brand?
427 CID/ 4 Speed
Thanks, Jim
4Speed67CamaroRS is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 20 (permalink) Old Jul 6th, 15, 01:36 PM
Banned
Chet
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Oakland County
Posts: 1,353
Re: Best Ignition/Distributor

In my opinion, if you're not running efi than you're better off blueprinting a stock HEI, upgrading the coil and module, and dialing in your curve with a spring kit and, if needed, a mechanical advance stop. MSD's quality has not been the greatest lately. Stock HEI is more than adequate with the right mods.
onefiness is offline  
post #3 of 20 (permalink) Old Jul 6th, 15, 03:21 PM
Senior Tech
Eric
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 601
Re: Best Ignition/Distributor

MSD now owns Mallory and Accel. They are continuing to service, but no longer make those lines according to their web site. I agree that MSD quality is not what it used to be. Maybe because they have bought up so much of their competition.

ERIC
67 Convertible, 350CID, TKO600RR, 3.73 Eaton Posi
ept000 is offline  
 
post #4 of 20 (permalink) Old Jul 6th, 15, 03:45 PM
Senior Tech
Steps
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 13,316
Re: Best Ignition/Distributor

Quote:
Originally Posted by onefiness View Post
In my opinion, if you're not running efi than you're better off blueprinting a stock HEI, upgrading the coil and module, and dialing in your curve with a spring kit and, if needed, a mechanical advance stop. MSD's quality has not been the greatest lately. Stock HEI is more than adequate with the right mods.
I tend to agree....the GM 4 post modules.. not the very early ones which I doubt any around any more... are sort after for modded high rpm motor bikes, even the dodge guys like them...
We tend to right off 'factory' stuff to quick... mostly due to marketing propaganda of aftermarket companies whos prime interest is returns to shareholders.
Yeah if getting into dedicated track.. one goes to fixed timing, magnitos etc...often track and street dont cross for good reasons.
And as suggested above, regardless of type of dizzy, it comes back the right timing at a given load at a given rpms right thru the rpm range... ideally within 1 deg...max 2 degs

Also The HEI was introduced not as a 'upgrade' but because Government pressures on emissions and economy... which meant introduction of EGR, for leaner burns... lean burn has more advance therefore EGR curves have a lot of Vaccuum advance and less cent....Non EGR as most of us have requires modding of the curves
Also, and think this maybe a legislation thing... dizzies off the shelf these days are set up for EGR.
Modding is not difficult be it a Factory HEI or MSD whatever.....detailed how tos and walk thrus in many older threads.
Big body HEIs often have issues with room next to the firewall... It the fan is not too close to the bottom of the shroud, then the higher trans mount option just sorts this out.....thu every 5 yrs or so u may have to replace the rear HT boot on the back of the dizzy cap

My Spelling is not incorrect...it is creative

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Steptoe is offline  
post #5 of 20 (permalink) Old Jul 6th, 15, 04:03 PM
Senior Tech
Morgan
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Detroit
Posts: 941
Garage
Re: Best Ignition/Distributor

Why not use an original distributor with either the pertronix III OR THE CRANE XRI. the HEI module is too big and causes other issues with the firewall. I purchased one of the pertronix distributors rtr distributors and it is ok, the advance limiter clips were useless and not calibrated like advertised. I could not even get $100 for a restored one that I curved on my machine.

The Msd requires a box to fire it and while a good system, why would you want to have to deal with the box and mounting it.

Buy the correct coil for whatever system you go with

69 Copo 9560 ZL-1 automatic [email protected], 1.95 on f70-14 polyglas F.AS.T. Race June 2016
69 Copo 9560 ZL-1 4spd [email protected] 1.93 60ft on F70/14
PSMCDR 2014
71LS6 vette [email protected] PSMCDR 2012 SOLD
1971ls6 is offline  
post #6 of 20 (permalink) Old Jul 6th, 15, 04:05 PM
Senior Tech
Al
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Vancouver, USA
Posts: 10,511
Re: Best Ignition/Distributor

I've had an MSD E-curve for about 10 years - it has been flawless. I bought mine when they first came out at a very reasonable introductory price. They are now quite expensive. It's a pretty penny for a feature that you're likely to use once - kinda like ride height adjustable coil-over shocks. The e-curve works with or without the MSD box - mine's w/o.

True coil-in-cap GM HEI is a really good and reliable system. The drawback - as said - is firewall clearance, which is a crapshoot on these old cars.

For a street/occasional strip car a blueprinted points distributor with a good aftermarket conversion module (such as Pertronix) would be my choice. These modules - as far as I know - are not true High Energy Ignition - but should be more than adequate for your needs, and will fit your chassis w/o worry.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
BPOS is offline  
post #7 of 20 (permalink) Old Jul 6th, 15, 04:23 PM Thread Starter
Gold Lifetime Member
Jim
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Torrance
Posts: 399
Garage
Re: Best Ignition/Distributor

Are any of you familiar with "Stinger" ignitions? I don't quite remember how I acquired one years ago but it installed easy as I remember and performed great. I figured after all these years, it may be no good anymore or just outclassed by new technologies. I understand they're no longer made but were respectable back then. Any info?
Thanks, Jim
4Speed67CamaroRS is offline  
post #8 of 20 (permalink) Old Jul 6th, 15, 05:08 PM
Banned
Chet
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Oakland County
Posts: 1,353
Re: Best Ignition/Distributor

just another version of the MSD ignitiion box built by the same company that did Hays Clutches. I think I would find out if you can still get service and parts before I put it in my engine bay.
onefiness is offline  
post #9 of 20 (permalink) Old Jul 6th, 15, 05:13 PM
Senior Tech
Mike
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Newark Delaware
Posts: 591
Garage
Re: Best Ignition/Distributor

I've had an msd 6al box and msd dist on my car for 10 plus years now never a problem 1. What are some of the problems you guys are having with msd stuff just curious?


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


67 RS 355sbc 11.76et @ 116mph 1.67 60' Deluxe Parchment interior
Bad67355 is offline  
post #10 of 20 (permalink) Old Jul 6th, 15, 05:35 PM
Gold Lifetime Member
Scott
 
scblucam's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Houston, TX
Posts: 2,491
Garage
Re: Best Ignition/Distributor

I had a 6A fail over 25 years ago. Told it was from inadequate grounding.

68 302 M20 - 85 IROC Z
The older I get the faster I was.
scblucam is offline  
post #11 of 20 (permalink) Old Jul 6th, 15, 07:10 PM
Senior Tech
Dave
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Tampa, Florida
Posts: 4,706
Re: Best Ignition/Distributor

I have been using MSD since they hit the market decades ago. I haven't had a lot of issues with any of their products; and I have built about fifty or so cars for others that were happy as well. Any problems I have had have been due to poor electrical circuits in the car I installed the parts on to, not with MSD. Ignition boxes want a rock steady voltage and do not like low voltage or excessive voltage problems caused by mechanical points in the external voltage regulator. Also if you ever reversed polarity by trying to jump some one off (red to red black to black how simple can it get?), and your ignition was energized when it happened that box is now toast.

What they are like today I can not say as I locked my roll around cabinets for the last time about twelve years ago.

The advantage of a CD system is multiple spark discharges below 4,200 RPM where most street motors live with a 6AL box. A capacitive discharge isn't taking a miniscule little bit of energy and trying to amplify it through a transistorized circuit the way an HEI system does. A capacitive discharge system takes the batteries energy, runs it through a bunch of caps in the box (the bigger the box a 7 or a 10 the bigger the caps; so the more energy it lets loose when it discharges) and discharges it when your magnetic coil in the distributor says it's time to fire.

Another advantage is the ability to plug in a retard chip, rev limiters, RPM activated switches and five or six other different RPM controlled electrical relay devices to control boost retard, or your ignition advance under multiple stage nitrous systems; to just being able to crank a big cube high compression BBC with a miniature starter and the battery in the trunk

As mentioned because capacitive discharge boxes differ from inductive ignitions (Points) the ignition coil is also different (usually an E and I stacked coil with a central winding). The inductance of the ignition coil has to match the model of CD ignition box (MSD lists two or three coils for each sized box to choose from).

One problem not mentioned by the those who favor the factory HEI is that above 4,500 RPM the spark energy falls off as the HEI module over heats (transistors do not like heat). Under sustained high RPM use the HEI module will fail all together (usually tell tale is dropping ignition pulses sounding like you are hitting the rev limiter.

For a street strip car and if you have a good stock GM distributor I would stuff a Petronix HEI module inside of it. On my race car I ran a MSD 7AL-3 box that replaced an earlier Vertex magneto. It met every need I had except data logging at the time. Today I wouldn't by an analog box (though they are very robust) and stick with the newer digital boxes that will interface with a data logger if you ever go that route and have all of the chips internally controlled by rotary switches.

Big Dave
Larger Dave is offline  
post #12 of 20 (permalink) Old Jul 6th, 15, 07:57 PM
Senior Tech
Brian
 
PA Camaro Guy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: PA
Posts: 642
Re: Best Ignition/Distributor

If you aren't running a box, MSD8360. Fits against the firewall, has a rev limiter, is somewhat customizable, and has given me no grief whatsoever. Cannot say the same about the Mallory unit I had before I got angry and threw it out (new). Also, MSD's tech service is reachable and knowledgeable if you have a question.

1969 Camaro 383
2.02/1.63 & 234/244 Vortec
TH350 / 12 bolt 3.73
PA Camaro Guy is offline  
post #13 of 20 (permalink) Old Jul 6th, 15, 08:42 PM
Gold Lifetime Member
Lynn
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Oklahoma City
Posts: 3,117
Re: Best Ignition/Distributor

Lots of choices for ignition. Don't know that there is a "best".

You will find varying opinions (polar opposite) on the Stinger system.
Some guys swear by it, others swear at it.

You said it was working when pulled right? I would use it. It's FREE.
Check the air gap. 002. to 005. A piece of standard copier paper works well if you don't have really thin feeler gauges.

On the other hand, if you decide to go with a GM HEI distributor, you will need to re-curve as Steps said. In a high performance application (high RPM), you should plan on two other things. 1. Use solid core plug wires. Secondly, that ignition doesn't draw huge amperage, but does have a high instantaneous amperage draw, so it must have a nice thick (like 10 gauge) lead wire. And that lead wire should not be on a shared circuit. Best bet is to run a dedicated wire from independent 12v supply with a hidden toggle switch to turn it on. That gives you the bonus of an extra theft deterrent. Not 100% effective, but if some douche defeats the ignition switch and doesn't know about your hidden toggle, the car won't start until he runs 12 volts to the distributor. Hopefully that slows him down enough.

Lynn
bilodeaulynn is offline  
post #14 of 20 (permalink) Old Jul 7th, 15, 12:42 AM
Senior Tech
George
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: LI,NY
Posts: 1,057
Re: Best Ignition/Distributor

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bad67355 View Post
I've had an msd 6al box and msd dist on my car for 10 plus years now never a problem 1. What are some of the problems you guys are having with msd stuff just curious?
They just mysteriously die. Mine lasted about 2 years and that was over 20 years ago. Im not surprised to see so many people with msd failures.
carbuff67rs is offline  
post #15 of 20 (permalink) Old Jul 7th, 15, 09:00 AM
Senior Tech
mike
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: east coast
Posts: 2,288
Re: Best Ignition/Distributor

I have the Mallory Hyfire 6. It can control boost retard, start retard. I have had it for 6 years and even had a small under hood fire that melted the plastic lens and it still works fine. Also it is under the hood.
bigblockragtop is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Team Camaro Tech forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address.
NOTE we receive a lot of registrations with bad email addresses. IF you do not receive your confirmation email you will not be able to post. contact support and we will try and help.
Be sure you enter a valid email address and check your spam folder as well.



Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome