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Adding accessories...pictures, ideas, tips?

3K views 15 replies 10 participants last post by  350sshugger 
#1 ·
My fellow enthusiasts,

My car will be returning from paint soon and I will begin the task of wiring; of which I have never custom wired a complete car before. I know many of you have so I'm hoping to learn from your experiences if you would be willing to share. Here is what I have and will be installing:
AAW classic update kit
Nu-Relics power windows-all 4
Holley fuel injection (terminator x)
Vintage air
Dakota Digital RTX gauges (including Holley BIM)
Electric fans

Seeing as the car didn't come with all of these electronics I have to figure out how to make it all fit. And with my car being a clean slate, I've got an opportunity to make the installation as clean as possible. Here are some specific questions:

1) Every accessory manufacturer want you to run their power lead right to the battery, which isn't practical. I would prefer to run a lead from the battery to a terminal location. How have others handled this? The AAW harness also has some circuits available for running these items so I need to flush that out.
2) Ideas for locations to mount some of these items. The BIM and module for the Dakota Digital gauges? How about the Holley ECU? I would prefer the ECU be under the dash but I have a feeling the vintage air is going to consume a lot of the Realestate.
3) How and where did you guys mount and handle the relays for the fans, fuel pump, etc?

I plan on keeping my battery under the hood. Thanks in advance!
 
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#2 ·
My fellow enthusiasts,

My car will be returning from paint soon and I will begin the task of wiring; of which I have never custom wired a complete car before. I know many of you have so I'm hoping to learn from your experiences if you would be willing to share. Here is what I have and will be installing:
AAW classic update kit
Nu-Relics power windows-all 4
Holley fuel injection (terminator x)
Vintage air
Dakota Digital RTX gauges (including Holley BIM)
Electric fans

Seeing as the car didn't come with all of these electronics I have to figure out how to make it all fit. And with my car being a clean slate, I've got an opportunity to make the installation as clean as possible. Here are some specific questions:

1) Every accessory manufacturer want you to run their power lead right to the battery, which isn't practical. I would prefer to run a lead from the battery to a terminal location. How have others handled this? The AAW harness also has some circuits available for running these items so I need to flush that out.
2) Ideas for locations to mount some of these items. The BIM and module for the Dakota Digital gauges? How about the Holley ECU? I would prefer the ECU be under the dash but I have a feeling the vintage air is going to consume a lot of the Real estate.
3) How and where did you guys mount and handle the relays for the fans, fuel pump, etc?

I plan on keeping my battery under the hood. Thanks in advance!
What you might consider is running a single large wire off of the battery (and the proper size fuse on this wire at the battery) and then go into what they call a distribution block. These distribution blocks accept the one large wire from the battery and then allow smaller wires to be attached to it to where then these smaller wires go to things like the fuel injection, cooling fans, fuel pumps, audio amplifiers and such. Some distribution blocks are built with ATC fuse holders to where then the smaller output wires can be protected with the proper sized fuse. Some distribution blocks may also be designed for using just glass fuses, resettable circuit breakers, ANL fuses, and so on.
Now under the hood you will only see one additional power wire off of the battery going to your added items.

NOW, what most of these companies do not tell you is if you do add this big old power wire off of the battery and have your things grounded to the car body, this connection between the body of the car and the battery/alternator system needs to be upgraded. If this is not done one can melt together internally floor shifter cables, have a ground going through bearings, and other avenues that were not designed for the transfer of power.

When adding things possibly set up what they call a "Big Three Upgrade". In car audio installations this is done a lot but also needs to be done when other things electrically are added to a vehicle like what you are wanting to do.

Distribution blocks:

https://www.google.com/search?q=car...3NPkAhWbHjQIHYNyDlMQ_AUIEigC&biw=1366&bih=654

Big Three Upgrade:

https://www.google.com/search?biw=1..........0j0i7i30j0i5i30j0i30j35i39.TK2TXeeTwK4

You may find unused circuits on you AAW kit and if for some reason you need a 30A supply but an unused wire and circuit unused in your kit only has a 20A fuse you cannot just replace the 20A fuse with a 30A.

I bet too if you do some google searches you might find someone that has a relay/distribution block/fuse setup already made up or a company that can build one for your specific needs.

Jim
 
#3 ·
OP

Depending on how many "accessory" circuits the AAW fuse block accommodates you will still likely need a secondary distribution block as noted that either includes fuse circuits the size you need and/or relay/fuse modules that are feeding from a +12vdc cable from battery to distro block

Electric fans, for example, draw between 30-40 amps apiece so you will need a relay/fuse for each one which likely is beyond the AAW harness and also whatever stereo amp loads you may have.

Get a 135 amp alternator

I have a 78 series side post battery with #2 gauge battery cable that has a 6 gauge aux cable molded into it that runs to the distro box but I don't have electric fans or big stereo

Get some GOOD battery cables at least #2 if not #1 gauge or roll your own with cable size of choice and terminals and a crimper. Battery cable Crimpers are not much $ the kind you use a BFH on.

FWIW I bought these cables for my side post battery (they are not a Camaro part but worked great for me.)

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000IYTNII/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o02_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000IYTOBY/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o01_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
 
#4 ·
I skipped around on your build thread (and which from what little I did see was pretty intense) but if you are looking to put back on the spring ring battery terminal ends, this may present some issues to keep these ends and then be able to add in additional electrical devices. If you are going with something else for battery cable ends then the options for connecting additional wires or a wire leaves you with a lot of different options.

SoCal805 suggested running a 135A alternator and while it may be what you need, it's just hard telling with the info posted so far. I'll agree that some electric fans can draw 30-40A each but then some other brands might draw 15-20A or another type might draw 60A each. With asking about what yours draw will require more info on your end. I've just been around long enough to where I have had customer's asking how big of a power wire they need with their 1,000W amplifier and until it's know what amperage fuses they have on the amp no one can really say if the power wire needs to be a 12 gauge or a 4/0 wire. To many times marketing gets involved with items and the ratings become super inflated.

Electrical needs to be thought of just like a fuel delivery system. If one wants to make "X" amount of horsepower then it will require so much fuel so if one needs "X" amount of current/amperage/voltage, then you need an alternator that can support this amount or be larger.

Jim
 
#5 ·
Jim, SoCAL;

Thank you for the information. So that you guys know where I'm starting from as far as background, I spent 5 years as an ASE master technician before I became an engineer so I know the basics and pitfalls of automotive wiring. My dad is an electrical engineer and wants to help, but his experience is all industrial plant and consumer housing. This will be a learning curve for him. He and I will have to sit and draw everything out ahead of time before we just start cutting and splicing.

I looked up the Big 3 kits as I had never heard of those. I had not thought of running a direct wire from the alternator...is that always necessary? I think the only big draw item will be the cooling fans and then the fuel pump. I'm not planning on running a giant stereo. For cooling fans I was looking dual 2000 cfm SPAL fans that come with the radiator, I think it's champion radiators. It looks like those fans would have about 18A draw apiece.

I definitely need a #1 power cable with a second lead (#6 or larger) going to the distribution block. I will make my own cables. Then a #1 ground cable with a second lead grounded to the sub-frame, and also ground straps from the body to the frame. I'm guessing it would be a good idea to run a distribution block for the grounds as well?

The AAW harness has a dedicated circuit for the fuel pump, power windows, and cooling fan. The cooling fan is a single 30A fuse, so I might need more with the duals. There is a 20A and a 30A battery circuit that are unused. What have you guys used as good locations for distribution blocks and relays? How about some of the control modules?
 
#6 ·
Then a #1 ground cable with a second lead grounded to the sub-frame, and also ground straps from the body to the frame. I'm guessing it would be a good idea to run a distribution block for the grounds as well?

The AAW harness has a dedicated circuit for the fuel pump, power windows, and cooling fan. The cooling fan is a single 30A fuse, so I might need more with the duals. There is a 20A and a 30A battery circuit that are unused. What have you guys used as good locations for distribution blocks and relays? How about some of the control modules?
I think aux leed from the - cable from battery to body. the body to frame, firewall to motor using the stock type braided ground straps is fine vs having a distro - block feeding all those locations

Sounds like the AAW dedicated electric fan circuit is to low for 2 x 18 amp draw dual fans. I would run a distro feed from the aux + cable that then supplies 2 x 20 amp fuse/relays dedicated to the fans and everything else to the AAW fuse terminal block

The core support between battery & PS fender is one spot you could install distro/relay/fuse. They would be more "tucked away" in that location. Or next to horn relay that is on DS of core support if that is where the horn relay remains using the AAW harness

Sounds like you easily have the skill set to do this. Draw out your schematic and sum up your total loads and determine what Alt size you need.

I didn't see if the AAW has circuits/Relays for the Vintage Air or what that system needs so that may also be something you feed from the AUX distro side which will impact what size Aux wire that comes off the + battery cable

I prefer to pull from AUX distro vs Alternator for these kind of "extras"
 
#7 · (Edited)
Big three upgrade is part of a special language that car audio enthusiast speak.

I have a friend at work that enters competitions to see who has the best and loudest sound systems in their cars. He often speaks this language to me. He has a tattoo of a speaker manufacturer on his arm. He sent a photo of the tattoo to the company. They were impressed by his loyalty. They sent him two free speakers for his car.

From what I understand, the big three upgrade replaces the factory wiring with larger wires. This is needed because the audio amps draw so much current and the factory wires were not sized large enough to handle the load. This also helps with the voltage drop so the amplifiers are running at full power during the competition. The ground wires and the wire from the alternator to the battery are upsized.

Do you need to do this? If you are replacing the original 60 amp alternator with one that is larger (135 amp) then the answer is yes. More current requires larger wires.

The manufacturers of aftermarket equipment love to say that you should run their power wires directly to the battery. They do this because they want to minimize the voltage drop and the battery posts are the quietest point in the electrical system when you think about noise. The battery is the black hole in the electrical system. The closer the electrical connection is to the battery, the less noise will be on the power wire.

A distribution block moves the connections away from the battery post. This might give a chance the components will experience noise on the power line. It might happen but probably it will be ok. I would run the car's pcm (automobile engine computer) directly to the battery if the instruction manual say to do this. Run all your grounds to one common point. Try not to daisy chain the straps or ground something just anywhere. Ground loops are not good.

Alright, this is what I got:
I have a 1969 Firebird Convertible. Power top, heater, no AC, lights, AM radio. I know a 60 amp alternator will run all this stuff.
This is what I added:
Vintage Air (25 amps), Electric Fuel Pump (20 amps), Two Radiator Fans (36 amps total), audio amplifier (40 amps), Intercooler pump (10 amps).
The added load is 25+20+36+40+10= 131 amps.

I need at least a 180 amp alternator. Look up a modern day Camaro with the same options you have on your car. The alternator ampacity will give you some idea what size you need.
 
#10 ·
Tony, which kit did you use? I've heard/read nothing but good about the Nu-Relics kits.

Was looking into the same thing and came across this. Blue Sea Systems ST Blade ATO/ATC Fuse Blocks 6 circuit w/cover. Planned on mounting it behind battery on core support. Has built in fuses so you don't heed in line fuses for your accessories. You would just need 1 in line fuse for the feed wire. Check it out.
That does look like a great solution. Just need to find something with the ampacity, the ones I was finding were light duty.


I also like the idea of mounting the distribution block on the core support next to the battery. That's a great location and simplifies the installation.
 
#9 ·
Was looking into the same thing and came across this. Blue Sea Systems ST Blade ATO/ATC Fuse Blocks 6 circuit w/cover. Planned on mounting it behind battery on core support. Has built in fuses so you don't heed in line fuses for your accessories. You would just need 1 in line fuse for the feed wire. Check it out.
 
#11 ·
I'm going to be getting into a similar situation pretty soon. Current (new) alternator is 100A and it might not be enough. Adding Vintage Air and dual cooling fans, also motorized RS headlight doors, but I don't know if that's a big draw or not. Plus I eventually _might_ think about EFI. So I guess I'm not only gonna need a better means to distribute current, but also have to think about relays for fans. I have no intention of putting a gigawatt stereo in the car, don't have anything now, I pretty much like listening to the motor LOL. If I ever did put in a radio I'd probably go with a modernized one like Rich Blankenship builds.

Anyway, I'm curious about twi things; First, has anyone used and liked those battery terminals with multiple wire options, some even have digital display of current. Second, what about a combination waterproof relay/fuse box to take care of the dual fans, AC, maybe EFI? Pictures below.
 

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#12 ·
You can minimize the average and peak current consumption of your fans by using a PWM controller instead of relays. Quieter too.

Don
 
#13 ·
#16 ·
Since this thread got revived here's what I ended up doing. 100amp junction block by the battery on a fabricated mount. Fabricated similar mount on opposite side for ECU. Mounted the Dakota Digital boxes behind the cluster. I was warned about difficulty to access but it works for me so far. Everything is documented in my build thread.
 

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