Output Wiring? CS 130 - Team Camaro Tech
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post #1 of 8 (permalink) Old Jul 30th, 06, 08:39 PM Thread Starter
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Output Wiring? CS 130

Does anyone know of some alternate wiring methods for a cs 130 to make it produce more amperage at lower rpms. I was told that there are some ways to accomplish this w/o changing the alternator. Supposedly there is a way to trick it to charge more.

There isn't anything wrong with the current alt, the pulley is large diameter and is part of a matched canton set so changing isn't an option.

According to the local auto electric guy 200 amp version is worse at low rpm/idle.

Thanks for any suggestions, SS.

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post #2 of 8 (permalink) Old Jul 31st, 06, 12:09 AM
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Re: Output Wiring? CS 130

The CS-130 is one of the best alternators for high output at low speeds. There isn't much out there that is better. If you are having a charging problem it is probably related to you pulley ratio. Even the biggest, baddest alternator won't charge if it isn't spinning fast enough. Why can't you just change one of the pulleys, there are many out there in different sizes to suit any app. Post back with what you have.

Greg U

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post #3 of 8 (permalink) Old Jul 31st, 06, 09:41 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Output Wiring? CS 130

I have a canton road race set, the pulley is 5" diameter and the obvious problem. The set is matched and of course expensive and doesn't throw belts most importantly.

In terms of draws/accessories-The fan pulls 19 amps constant and 30 on start up. I put a fan controller in, the and issue got worse to the point the battery died at an autocross event. I am not sure if it was cycling the fan more based on flucuating temp or what? I can remove the fan controller and go back to a toggle but it seems like going backwards and I don't think it is the problem it just slightly intensifies it.

The battery would need charging periodically but the car always started prior (to the controller installation) except after leaving the fan running-hence the addition of the controller. After 3 or 4 starts and driving the battery voltage will go from a max of 12.8V fully charged to 12.5V or less. Battery is an Optima Red top which is supposed to be about 650 CCA if memory serves.

At idle is the biggest issue, it simply doesn't charge. I have found a 1 amp draw and fixed it. At 2k it charges well! The car isn't a daily driver but I can't have it die at an event. I have been putting going off to the dragstrip based on the issue and summer is getting short.

I am probably going to add some additional ground straps and see if canton has another pulley but either way I was hoping for additional option. SS

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post #4 of 8 (permalink) Old Aug 1st, 06, 05:05 AM
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Re: Output Wiring? CS 130

I believe one of your problems is the battery is too small and secondly, its not a daily driver.

As undee suggests, a smaller alt pulley is needed. Get a stock size and smaller length belt. Or, get a larger crankshaft pulley.

As far as the battery, 650 CCA is too small. The fan uses 20 amps for normal running, 20 amps continuously. Doesn't take long for the battery to become discharged.

A 1000 CCA battery would be better served along with a battery tender plugged in when not in use. Or a second battery, just in case, and alternate batteries with daily driver.

Better yet, if car is trailered, which I doubt, you could hook up a quick disconnect between the car and towing vehicle and allow the towing vehicle to charge battery and run fans during cooldown.

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post #5 of 8 (permalink) Old Aug 1st, 06, 05:56 AM
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Re: Output Wiring? CS 130

Is your CS 130 wired for remote voltage sensing, or is the remote sensing wire just connected to the hot wire of the alternator?
This techref https://www.camaros.net/techref/ftecref14.html shows a cs130 install that DOES NOT use remote voltage sensing.

If yours is wired like this, you might try rewiring it.

Rather than connecting terminal #2 to the alternators output, run a longer wire and connect it to the horn relay, or even to the battery junction block on the drivers side of the rad support. This will "trick" the alternator into producing more charge.

Note that, if it applies the above wiring change will help, but I agree, your problem is the 5" pulley. Replacing it with a 3" will nearly double the alternator rpm.





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post #6 of 8 (permalink) Old Aug 1st, 06, 01:04 PM
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Re: Output Wiring? CS 130

Quote:
Originally Posted by railing68
I have a canton road race set, the pulley is 5" diameter and the obvious problem. The set is matched and of course expensive and doesn't throw belts most importantly.
Are these serpentine or V belt pulleys? What is the pulley ratio? What is the max engine RPMs? Have a link? The pulleys are probably made for road racing where high RPMs for long periods are the norm. They are used to prolong alternator life and to keep belts from throwing. For street use a 3 to 1 ratio is best.

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post #7 of 8 (permalink) Old Aug 1st, 06, 04:56 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Output Wiring? CS 130

Wow, thanks for the replies! In looking at them all of them are good and applicable.

First here is the link to the pulley set. They are V type.

http://www.cantonracingproducts.com/..._roadrace.html

With that I spoke to a Canton Tech today and purchased the 3.25 alt pulley # 75-204 which is from the street set-up. Originally the 383 was spinning to 7k but now with the 406 6k or 6200 rpm is max so the 3.25 should be fine.

I previously forgot to mention a vac pump as an additional accessory which pulls 7.5 amps but runs only intermittently on the street.

According to the tech it will be 169% overdriven with the 3.25". the RR set was 1:1 approximately which was a good portion of the problem. I have been considering a bigger battery as well because as state the 650CCA is low even though the battery checks out at 800CCA when fully charged. I do want to stay single since I just got a box set-up fabbed in the trunk which is vented etc.

I just got quoted on a Optima Blue top 950CCA is $150. Ouch!

I will also look at the current wiring configuration and compare to the diagram.

The pulley was only $33 + shipping so I will try that, but a new battery will probably be in order.

Thanks to all! SS

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post #8 of 8 (permalink) Old Aug 2nd, 06, 03:07 AM
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Re: Output Wiring? CS 130

Quote:
Originally Posted by railing68
With that I spoke to a Canton Tech today and purchased the 3.25 alt pulley # 75-204 which is from the street set-up. Originally the 383 was spinning to 7k but now with the 406 6k or 6200 rpm is max so the 3.25 should be fine.
Hate to say it, but you are still going to have a charging problem at lower RPMs even with that pulley, especially if any high current items are on (like fans) At 900 Rpm, the alternator will only be turning 1521 rpms or so. In my experience alternators need about 1800 rpms to put out anything, will charge at 2000 rpms if no high current items are on, 2200-2400 rpms to charge with high current items. This is alternator rpms, with 10-12si alternators. Do this test with current pulleys on , start car and turn on electrical accessories, slowly bring up engine rpms till the alternator is charging, note rpms. As a example you said 2000 engine rpms it charged good. 2000 x 1.1 = 2200 alternator rpm. replacement pulley is 3.25, or 169% overdriven. To reach the same 2200 alternator rpm the engine would have to be at 1300 rpms. 1300 x 1.69 = 2197. It may charge some a little lower but is is not going to at idle. Since you already bought the pulley, post back at what rpm when it charges, do it with all accessories on and with as little as possible, just to see how slow a CS130 alternator can turn before it stops charging. Some discharge at idle can be acceptable depending on the type of driving you do.

Heres a link on pulley ratios and alternator output.
http://www.powermastermotorsports.co...r_pulleys.html

Greg U

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