LS 6.0 camshaft selection - Team Camaro Tech
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post #1 of 18 (permalink) Old Dec 7th, 17, 05:51 AM Thread Starter
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Matt
 
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LS 6.0 camshaft selection

Hey guys,

Not new to engine building but this is my first LS build. I contacted Comp. Cams for a camshaft recommendation and I am curious to what you guys think about it. Let's here some opinions to this specific camshaft first, and then if you think you have a better recommendation you can add that to.

Here is the vehicle / engine information:

VEHICLE INFORMATION
Make: Chevrolet Model: Camaro
Year: 1969
Weight: 3500 lbs. Axle Ratio: 3:73
Transmission Type: Manual Overall Tire Height: 26.1
Torque Converter Stall Speed: N/A
ENGINE INFORMATION
Engine Block Type: Chevrolet Engine Family: LS 6.0 LQ9 2004
Engine Size: 364 c.i.
Number of Cylinders: 8 Bore: 4.0"
Stroke: 3.622" Compression Ratio: 10.5:1
Connecting Rod Length: 6.098"
Intake Manifold Type: Holley 2X4 dual plane or stock LS6. Not sure yet.
Cylinder Head(s) Brand: Stock 317 heads milled .020"
Head Runner Volume: Unknown. Stock but polished. Ported Heads: No
Intake Valve Size: Stock Exhaust Valve Size: Stock
Rocker Arm Type: Stock Rocker Arm Ratio Stock:1
Exhaust Headers: Yes
RPM Range Low: 1000 RPM Range High: 6000
Nitrous Oxide: No Horsepower from Nitrous: N/A
COMPUTER CONTROLLED VEHICLES
Vehicle Computer Type: Stock
FUEL DELIVERY
Fuel Type: Pump Gas Fuel Octane Rating: 89
Carburetor: No Carburetor Size: N/A
Electronic Fuel Injection: Yes Custom Tuned: Yes
APPLICATION SPECIFICS
Application Type: Performance Street Other Application Type: N/A
Race Class (If Applicable): Would like to road race infrequently
VALVE TRAIN SPECIFICS
Desired Lifter Type: Hydraulic Roller
Type: OE Hyd. Roller Engine
What type of camshaft are you currently using?
Camshaft Brand: None Part Number: N/A
Specs: N/A

Considering the current peformance of your vehicle, do you need:
More Low Speed Torque? Yes More RPM? No
Is Idling Speed Important? Yes Is Emissions Compliance
Important? No
Does Your Vehicle Currently Use the Following:
Air Conditioning? Yes
Power Steering? Yes Power Brakes? Yes

The camshaft recommended was: part # 54-444-11

Cam Style: Hydraulic roller tappet
Basic Operating RPM Range: 2,000-7,000
Intake Duration at 050 inch Lift: 224
Exhaust Duration at 050 inch Lift: 230
Duration at 050 inch Lift: 224 int./230 exh.
Advertised Intake Duration: 273
Advertised Exhaust Duration: 279
Advertised Duration: 273 int./279 exh.
Intake Valve Lift with Factory Rocker Arm Ratio: 0.581 in.
Exhaust Valve Lift with Factory Rocker Arm Ratio: 0.588 in.
Valve Lift with Factory Rocker Arm Ratio: 0.581 int./0.588 exh.
Lobe Separation (degrees): 114
Camshaft Gear Attachment: 3-bolt
Computer-Controlled Compatible: Yes
Grind Number: XER273HR

Honestly at my first look the selection seems aggressive for a mostly street car with an occasional road-race entry. Let know what you guys think and thanks!

My Build Thread


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post #2 of 18 (permalink) Old Dec 7th, 17, 06:02 AM
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Greg
 
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Re: LS 6.0 camshaft selection

Quote:
Originally Posted by 350sshugger View Post
Hey guys,

Not new to engine building but this is my first LS build. I contacted Comp. Cams for a camshaft recommendation and I am curious to what you guys think about it. Let's here some opinions to this specific camshaft first, and then if you think you have a better recommendation you can add that to.

Here is the vehicle / engine information:

VEHICLE INFORMATION
Make: Chevrolet Model: Camaro
Year: 1969
Weight: 3500 lbs. Axle Ratio: 3:73
Transmission Type: Manual Overall Tire Height: 26.1
Torque Converter Stall Speed: N/A
ENGINE INFORMATION
Engine Block Type: Chevrolet Engine Family: LS 6.0 LQ9 2004
Engine Size: 364 c.i.
Number of Cylinders: 8 Bore: 4.0"
Stroke: 3.622" Compression Ratio: 10.5:1
Connecting Rod Length: 6.098"
Intake Manifold Type: Holley 2X4 dual plane or stock LS6. Not sure yet.
Cylinder Head(s) Brand: Stock 317 heads milled .020"
Head Runner Volume: Unknown. Stock but polished. Ported Heads: No
Intake Valve Size: Stock Exhaust Valve Size: Stock
Rocker Arm Type: Stock Rocker Arm Ratio Stock:1
Exhaust Headers: Yes
RPM Range Low: 1000 RPM Range High: 6000
Nitrous Oxide: No Horsepower from Nitrous: N/A
COMPUTER CONTROLLED VEHICLES
Vehicle Computer Type: Stock
FUEL DELIVERY
Fuel Type: Pump Gas Fuel Octane Rating: 89
Carburetor: No Carburetor Size: N/A
Electronic Fuel Injection: Yes Custom Tuned: Yes
APPLICATION SPECIFICS
Application Type: Performance Street Other Application Type: N/A
Race Class (If Applicable): Would like to road race infrequently
VALVE TRAIN SPECIFICS
Desired Lifter Type: Hydraulic Roller
Type: OE Hyd. Roller Engine
What type of camshaft are you currently using?
Camshaft Brand: None Part Number: N/A
Specs: N/A

Considering the current peformance of your vehicle, do you need:
More Low Speed Torque? Yes More RPM? No
Is Idling Speed Important? Yes Is Emissions Compliance
Important? No
Does Your Vehicle Currently Use the Following:
Air Conditioning? Yes
Power Steering? Yes Power Brakes? Yes

The camshaft recommended was: part # 54-444-11

Cam Style: Hydraulic roller tappet
Basic Operating RPM Range: 2,000-7,000
Intake Duration at 050 inch Lift: 224
Exhaust Duration at 050 inch Lift: 230
Duration at 050 inch Lift: 224 int./230 exh.
Advertised Intake Duration: 273
Advertised Exhaust Duration: 279
Advertised Duration: 273 int./279 exh.
Intake Valve Lift with Factory Rocker Arm Ratio: 0.581 in.
Exhaust Valve Lift with Factory Rocker Arm Ratio: 0.588 in.
Valve Lift with Factory Rocker Arm Ratio: 0.581 int./0.588 exh.
Lobe Separation (degrees): 114
Camshaft Gear Attachment: 3-bolt
Computer-Controlled Compatible: Yes
Grind Number: XER273HR

Honestly at my first look the selection seems aggressive for a mostly street car with an occasional road-race entry. Let know what you guys think and thanks!
I'm no cam expert but comparatively speaking the cam in my LS3 is GM "Hot" cam and the specs aren't much different except for lift and it is a very mild cam in my personal opinion. Take a look at Texas Speed or Brian Tooley cams to compare. Both are known for specializing in LS engines.

Valve Lift (in): .525 intake / .525 exhaust
Camshaft Duration (@.050 in): 219 intake / 228 exhaust

My 69 Build thread :
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post #3 of 18 (permalink) Old Dec 7th, 17, 06:19 AM
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Re: LS 6.0 camshaft selection

Stock LQ9

With the pistons in the LQ9 be careful when selecting a cam to make sure you have piston to valve clearance.

I would use longer duration shorter lift cam similar to the LS3 hot cams. .525 lift.

Do not use the Holley 2x4 intake the High Rise wont fit under the hood and the Mid Rise kills low end torque due to very short runners

Use an LS6 intake or better yet the MSD Atomic intake.

If you can Id also seriously consider picking up a pair of 243 heads.
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post #4 of 18 (permalink) Old Dec 7th, 17, 07:02 AM
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Im going with a texas speed stage 3

69 Frost Green Camaro
LS3 with TSP stage 3 cam
Tremec TKO 600
Moser 12 bolt rear with ford ends 3.73:1 Eaton tru trac differential
Speedtech pro touring subframe
Ridetech rear 4-Link


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post #5 of 18 (permalink) Old Dec 7th, 17, 09:50 AM
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Re: LS 6.0 camshaft selection

Why not have Pat G spec a custom Cam for your exact engine and goals? Ive done it with great results.

https://www.guerragroup.com/camshaft-help

Don

1969 Camaro LSA 6L90E AME subframe and IRS
1969 Camaro vert LS3 4L65E Ridetech level 2 - sold
1959 El Camino project
1969 Mustang Sportsroof project
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post #6 of 18 (permalink) Old Dec 7th, 17, 11:20 AM
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Greg
 
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Re: LS 6.0 camshaft selection

If you notice, it appears Texas Speed grinds Pat G's cams for them. I was considering the Texas Speed Stage 3 myself, but haven't pulled the trigger yet.

My 69 Build thread :
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post #7 of 18 (permalink) Old Dec 7th, 17, 11:38 AM Thread Starter
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Matt
 
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Re: LS 6.0 camshaft selection

Quote:
Originally Posted by gphusker View Post
I'm no cam expert but comparatively speaking the cam in my LS3 is GM "Hot" cam and the specs aren't much different except for lift and it is a very mild cam in my personal opinion. Take a look at Texas Speed or Brian Tooley cams to compare. Both are known for specializing in LS engines.

Valve Lift (in): .525 intake / .525 exhaust
Camshaft Duration (@.050 in): 219 intake / 228 exhaust
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vega$69 View Post
Stock LQ9

With the pistons in the LQ9 be careful when selecting a cam to make sure you have piston to valve clearance.

I would use longer duration shorter lift cam similar to the LS3 hot cams. .525 lift.

Do not use the Holley 2x4 intake the High Rise wont fit under the hood and the Mid Rise kills low end torque due to very short runners

Use an LS6 intake or better yet the MSD Atomic intake.

If you can Id also seriously consider picking up a pair of 243 heads.
Quote:
Originally Posted by stamatisg1977 View Post
Im going with a texas speed stage 3
Quote:
Originally Posted by dhutton View Post
Why not have Pat G spec a custom Cam for your exact engine and goals? Ive done it with great results.

https://www.guerragroup.com/camshaft-help

Don
Quote:
Originally Posted by gphusker View Post
If you notice, it appears Texas Speed grinds Pat G's cams for them. I was considering the Texas Speed Stage 3 myself, but haven't pulled the trigger yet.
Thanks for the feedback guys. I'm not used to a cam approaching .600" lift without being fairly aggressive when building small blocks; I knew that the LS engines were different and I just need to re-learn what is normal. I will definitely check ptv clearance with the flat tops as I would check it with a mild cam too. That really should be checked on any quality build regardless of the camshaft selection.

Thanks for the heads up on the Holley intake. That is the second time I have read a comment like that; which is too bad since it could be made to look like an old school dual quad setup. I'm not willing to sacrifice power for looks so I'll have to go with one of the plastic ugly's.

Texas speed keeps coming up on the LS boards as well so I'm going to have to check them out.

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post #8 of 18 (permalink) Old Dec 7th, 17, 03:00 PM
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Don
 
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Re: LS 6.0 camshaft selection

Quote:
Originally Posted by gphusker View Post
If you notice, it appears Texas Speed grinds Pat G's cams for them. I was considering the Texas Speed Stage 3 myself, but haven't pulled the trigger yet.
But he specifies it. He specd an EPS Cam for me with EPS lobes which are easier on springs and dont sound like a sewing machine like a lot of high lift LS cams do.

Don

1969 Camaro LSA 6L90E AME subframe and IRS
1969 Camaro vert LS3 4L65E Ridetech level 2 - sold
1959 El Camino project
1969 Mustang Sportsroof project
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post #9 of 18 (permalink) Old Dec 7th, 17, 04:08 PM
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Re: LS 6.0 camshaft selection

Cam Motion High Performance LS Camshaft & LT1 Cams <-- will be my next go around.

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post #10 of 18 (permalink) Old Dec 7th, 17, 04:48 PM
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Re: LS 6.0 camshaft selection

Try the little guys, not someone reading to you off a spreadsheet & avoid the ultra fast ramp trend if you can.

Work them heads over thats where the power is at!! In fact do them first then pick your cam if you can
Edit: hope I dont ruffle any feathers but you dont need a custom cam most times they are just off the shelf stuff someone is picking for you
Maybe some have had good experiences but the few Ive paid $$ for never "ran" finally learned my lesson. Take your time and find the right one;half the guys recommending them dont know the first things about them anyways.

Last edited by cv67; Dec 7th, 17 at 06:28 PM.
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post #11 of 18 (permalink) Old Dec 7th, 17, 05:52 PM
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Re: LS 6.0 camshaft selection

Keep in mind that when you mill the heads sometimes you have alignment problems with mounting the intake so be careful how much you mill, I agree with John as to measure the PTV clearance but usually .600 lift is the max. but milling reduces that.
LS6 intake is a sought after cathedral port piece from GTO's and Vettes.
317 heads are truck heads that flow decent and are sought after the turbo guys because of their larger combustion chambers. 243 or 799's are the ones to look for, they flow more and increase compression therefore you wouldn't have to mill.
If you stick with the 317 a little more lift airflow would help with around the same duration as the GM LS hot cam, something like Lunati's.
Voodoo LS1 W/ L92 Heads Hydraulic Roller Cam - GM V8 LS GEN III/IV 267/278 - Lunati Power
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post #12 of 18 (permalink) Old Dec 7th, 17, 05:57 PM
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Re: LS 6.0 camshaft selection

Here's a good deal on some new 243 heads, problem is they won't last long......someone will scoop them up.
https://ls1tech.com/forums/parts-cla...ever-used.html
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post #13 of 18 (permalink) Old Dec 7th, 17, 06:24 PM
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Re: LS 6.0 camshaft selection

Quote:
Originally Posted by DOUG G View Post
I've bought 2 LS Cams from Cam Motion and they are great to work with and excellent cams.

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post #14 of 18 (permalink) Old Dec 7th, 17, 06:29 PM
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Re: LS 6.0 camshaft selection

Quote:
Originally Posted by slazisme View Post
Here's a good deal on some new 243 heads, problem is they won't last long......someone will scoop them up.
https://ls1tech.com/forums/parts-cla...ever-used.html
Edit: hmm, NIB tempting..
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post #15 of 18 (permalink) Old Dec 8th, 17, 05:55 AM Thread Starter
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Re: LS 6.0 camshaft selection

Quote:
Originally Posted by DOUG G View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by cv67 View Post
Try the little guys, not someone reading to you off a spreadsheet & avoid the ultra fast ramp trend if you can.

Work them heads over thats where the power is at!! In fact do them first then pick your cam if you can
Edit: hope I dont ruffle any feathers but you dont need a custom cam most times they are just off the shelf stuff someone is picking for you
Maybe some have had good experiences but the few Ive paid $$ for never "ran" finally learned my lesson. Take your time and find the right one;half the guys recommending them dont know the first things about them anyways.
Quote:
Originally Posted by slazisme View Post
Keep in mind that when you mill the heads sometimes you have alignment problems with mounting the intake so be careful how much you mill, I agree with John as to measure the PTV clearance but usually .600 lift is the max. but milling reduces that.
LS6 intake is a sought after cathedral port piece from GTO's and Vettes.
317 heads are truck heads that flow decent and are sought after the turbo guys because of their larger combustion chambers. 243 or 799's are the ones to look for, they flow more and increase compression therefore you wouldn't have to mill.
If you stick with the 317 a little more lift airflow would help with around the same duration as the GM LS hot cam, something like Lunati's.
Voodoo LS1 W/ L92 Heads Hydraulic Roller Cam - GM V8 LS GEN III/IV 267/278 - Lunati Power
Quote:
Originally Posted by H20cooled View Post
I've bought 2 LS Cams from Cam Motion and they are great to work with and excellent cams.
Agree with much that has been written. My 317's have been milled .020" to bring down the chamber volume a bit and I am working on polishing the ports. (For me this is free work because of what I have access to). There is nothing wrong with them so I will leave it at that for now. The main reason I started looking at cam selection is so I can get the correct springs for finishing the rebuild on the heads.

I spent quite a bit of time reading about Cam Motion and Texas Speed products last night. I'm leaning toward Cam Motion at the moment. I appreciate everyone's input.

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