Engine management system recommendations - Team Camaro Tech
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post #1 of 14 (permalink) Old Jan 21st, 18, 05:09 PM Thread Starter
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Engine management system recommendations

I've got a 6.0 that I'm building. Nothing crazy; flat top pistons, cam motion cam, milled 317 heads with polished runners. Either an edelbrock victor jr or the doorman ls2 intake (balance between look and $). I've been looking at options for the engine management system such as fast, Holley, stock ECU with custom harness and tune, and thanks to some searching on LS1tech I came across this https://www.ampefi.com/product/ms3pr...ess-w-ecu-evo/

I'm leaning toward the ms3pro. Any input or suggestions?
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post #2 of 14 (permalink) Old Jan 21st, 18, 05:21 PM
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Re: Engine management system recommendations

Way over kill and expensive for what youíre doing

I would suggest PSI Harness, sensors, pedal and ECM for about $1200

Are you going cable or DBW?
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post #3 of 14 (permalink) Old Jan 22nd, 18, 10:43 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Engine management system recommendations

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Originally Posted by Vega$69 View Post
Way over kill and expensive for what youíre doing

I would suggest PSI Harness, sensors, pedal and ECM for about $1200

Are you going cable or DBW?
I figured you would have some insight John. If I go with the old school look (eldelbrock and 4150 throttle body) then cable. If I use the plastic ugly then probably DBW. Odly enough the LS intake and DBW throttle body looks like it would be a cheaper installation. One concern with the victor jr intake is that it may be too tall for my SS hood which is a deal breaker.

I like the ability to self tune the MS3 and it's ability to grow if I decide to make any changes in the future. However getting another tune on an OE ECM wouldn't be that big of a deal.

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post #4 of 14 (permalink) Old Jan 22nd, 18, 11:29 AM
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Re: Engine management system recommendations

I would be worried about support five years from now. Pretty sure OEM support will be there....

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post #5 of 14 (permalink) Old Jan 22nd, 18, 12:10 PM
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Re: Engine management system recommendations

Not sure but I believe the MS3 is Speed Density tuned.

For a street car build like your I much prefer a Maf tune which you get with the GM ecm
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post #6 of 14 (permalink) Old Jan 22nd, 18, 06:40 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Engine management system recommendations

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Originally Posted by Vega$69 View Post
Not sure but I believe the MS3 is Speed Density tuned.

For a street car build like your I much prefer a Maf tune which you get with the GM ecm
Correct, it is speed density. Curious why the preference for a MAF system?

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post #7 of 14 (permalink) Old Jan 22nd, 18, 06:57 PM
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Re: Engine management system recommendations

Better for changes in atmospheric conditions
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post #8 of 14 (permalink) Old Jan 23rd, 18, 07:06 AM
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Re: Engine management system recommendations

A MAF system measures the amount/volume of air ingested and adds this value to the fuel formula via injector pulse width.
A Speed Density system calculates the volume of air ingested with values read from MAP, TPS, O2, and coolant sensors.

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post #9 of 14 (permalink) Old Jan 27th, 18, 07:48 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Engine management system recommendations

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vega$69 View Post
Way over kill and expensive for what youíre doing

I would suggest PSI Harness, sensors, pedal and ECM for about $1200

Are you going cable or DBW?
So I've been researching the PSI engine controller kits....

My build is based off an early '03 long block. The only kits they have appear to be LS3 and newer. I've relocated the cam sensor to the timing cover to expand my camshaft choices. I have the rotating assembly going to the machine shop for balance this week; if I have them swap the reluctor ring for 58x and get the later knock sensors that mount to the block then I should be able to use the LS3 kit correct?
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post #10 of 14 (permalink) Old Jan 27th, 18, 10:25 AM
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Re: Engine management system recommendations

Yes
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post #11 of 14 (permalink) Old Feb 13th, 18, 05:45 AM
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Re: Engine management system recommendations

alittle late I'm sure, but my thoughts...

I think it depends on how much you like to mess with tuning and how much you want to change your engine combo over time.

Majority of the people run the stock computer with either a HP tuners or EFI live tune. You can buy premade harness, pop it on with the factory ECM and have somebody tune it with EFI live or HP tuners. You can also buy the HP tuners and tune it yourself, but learning curve for tuning a factory computer is pretty steep. It can be ran with Mass Air or speed density. It can control a 4L60E or 4L80E. It is cheaper this route and it works well... You have your harness and ECM cost, then around $300-$500 for the initial tune assuming you don't have any bugs for them to fix.

If you enjoy tuning, having a power adder, and data logging, MS3pro or the MS gold box has it's benefits. They're speed density set ups with cable driven throttle body's. There's tons of people doing it... It's still a steep learning curve but not as hard as trying to tune the factory ECU. This is probably one of the cheaper stand alone ECU routes. I'm considering this route, but I'm running a turbo and I enjoy tuning and data logging.

Or if you have more money to burn, you can step it up to a Holley, FAST, or better known stand alone ECU's. They have proven track records with more local(USA) support.

If you plan to have somebody else to tune it, I'd consult who ever you'd use locally to tune it and see what they're comfortable using.

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post #12 of 14 (permalink) Old Feb 13th, 18, 07:22 AM
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Re: Engine management system recommendations

Are you going to have a 24x or 58x sensor. PSI sells early LS1 style harnesses. I know a couple of guys that have used them recently and were happy with them.

https://www.psiconversion.com/produc...s-4l60e-4l80e/

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post #13 of 14 (permalink) Old Feb 13th, 18, 04:16 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Engine management system recommendations

Quote:
Originally Posted by zboss86 View Post
alittle late I'm sure, but my thoughts...

I think it depends on how much you like to mess with tuning and how much you want to change your engine combo over time.

Majority of the people run the stock computer with either a HP tuners or EFI live tune. You can buy premade harness, pop it on with the factory ECM and have somebody tune it with EFI live or HP tuners. You can also buy the HP tuners and tune it yourself, but learning curve for tuning a factory computer is pretty steep. It can be ran with Mass Air or speed density. It can control a 4L60E or 4L80E. It is cheaper this route and it works well... You have your harness and ECM cost, then around $300-$500 for the initial tune assuming you don't have any bugs for them to fix.

If you enjoy tuning, having a power adder, and data logging, MS3pro or the MS gold box has it's benefits. They're speed density set ups with cable driven throttle body's. There's tons of people doing it... It's still a steep learning curve but not as hard as trying to tune the factory ECU. This is probably one of the cheaper stand alone ECU routes. I'm considering this route, but I'm running a turbo and I enjoy tuning and data logging.

Or if you have more money to burn, you can step it up to a Holley, FAST, or better known stand alone ECU's. They have proven track records with more local(USA) support.

If you plan to have somebody else to tune it, I'd consult who ever you'd use locally to tune it and see what they're comfortable using.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 130fe View Post
Are you going to have a 24x or 58x sensor. PSI sells early LS1 style harnesses. I know a couple of guys that have used them recently and were happy with them.

https://www.psiconversion.com/produc...s-4l60e-4l80e/
I've actually been communicating with PSI a bit about their products. I've converted the engine over to the 58x crank and 4x cam gear since it seems to increase my options. Shad, great points. If I were you going with a turbo setup and wanting to log track data I would go with the ms3pro in a heartbeat. BUT if I'm realistic about what I am building it's an NA street engine.....and the PSI kit makes a lot of sense. I've also used some aftermarket kits in the past that use the single O2 sensor and I really prefer the better tune you get with an O2 for each bank. The PSI kit keeps that oem functionalitly and I think if I sit down with HP tuners I will have a very good running engine in the end. As I'm typing it sounds pretty much like I have my mind made up now doesn't it?

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post #14 of 14 (permalink) Old Feb 15th, 18, 05:52 AM
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Re: Engine management system recommendations

I only use PSI on all my builds ... great product
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