Small Block Headers with Quick Ratio P/S - Team Camaro Tech
Tech 2002 General Tech questions from 2002
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post #1 of 13 (permalink) Old Mar 21st, 02, 11:05 AM Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Berkley, MI, USA
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Here's a slightly new twist on an old question for everybody... What extra ground clearance small block headers fit with a Quick Ratio Power Steering Box?
This week I was informed by Headman that their 68606 "Shorty" Headers (which I bought) fit power steering cars, but not with Quick Ratio boxes due to their extra large size. Is this guy on crack or has anyone else run into this?
I also e-mailed Hooker and all I got for a response was: "The 2466 headers have the same exterior dimensions as the Hedman
headers." Sounds like they've got the same problem. Has anyone installed the new Hooker "Shorty" header yet? I'd be interested in hearing first hand how the install went and the P/S clearances.
I know that on the Headman's the one tube near the P/S box would have to be crushed to approximately half it's original size to squeeze past (if I were to go ahead and install them.)
Just to let everyone know, I'm using a late 70's T/A Steering Box. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks,
Rich Downing

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Rich D. 69 Camaro with:
Vortec 350, T-56, 12 bolt, 94 Vette Brakes, Hotchkis suspension, and 17" Torque Thrusts.
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post #2 of 13 (permalink) Old Mar 21st, 02, 12:00 PM
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Brad
 
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Since you have the T-56, I am assuming you have a hydraulic clutch and clutch linkage clearance is not really an issue. I have generally heard good things about the "afterburner" headers made by flowtech (I think that is the correct manufacturer and style) These are designed for automatic transmission cars (they dont fit the old style clutch linkage) but this should not be a problem on your car.
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post #3 of 13 (permalink) Old Mar 21st, 02, 05:23 PM
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David Pozzi
 
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The quick ratio box is the same dimension as the regular box.
Suprisingly the PS box only sticks out toward the engine about half an inch more than a manual box.
Make sure you have the correct motor mounts for the frame brackets you are using.
How about cutting and moving the offending tube?
David

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67 RS 327 original owner. 69 Camaro Vintage Racer, 65 Lola T-70 Chev SB Can-Am Vintage Racer
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post #4 of 13 (permalink) Old Mar 21st, 02, 07:24 PM
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Donnie
 
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I ran into the exact problem myself about two months ago when I installed a quick ratio box on my '69 Z28. I called Hedman and they told me I wouldn't have any problems with their header, but I did. After talking to them again it was determined that they didn't make a header for my car that would fit with the quick ratio. Well, they were new headers, and I didn't want to buy new ones from somewhere else so a friend came over and we "modified" the header enough where it would clear the box and it worked out great. You can't tell it was modified and there's enough space to let air flow through and not get too warm. I haven't had any problems at all with the space that's there and the p/s is great. It's the best investment I've ever made other than buying the car itself.
1969 Fathom Green Z28,DZ302,M20,4:10,p/s,t/w,am/fm,console and gauges,comfort grip steering wheel,deluxe houndstooth interior.
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post #5 of 13 (permalink) Old Mar 22nd, 02, 03:23 AM Thread Starter
 
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Location: Berkley, MI, USA
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Thanks Guys! I do have the hydraulic clutch set-up, so clutch linkage clearance wouldn't be an issue, but I have heard some bad things locally about the quality of the afterburners and would rather stick with a brand name like Headman or Hooker.

I think I'll do like you recommend David and modify or relocate the offending tube and have them re-coated. We've got a place here in the Detroit area that we use for work all the time and I think I can get them to sneak one header in for little or no cost.

It really is a shame though that with all of the "Pro-Touring" cars being built that some of the bigger header manufacturers won't re-design to fit our common modifications. I mean, why would you want extra ground clearance headers on anything that wasn't really low to the ground (i.e. "Pro-Touring" or "G-machine" style.), which more often than not have power steering?

If anyone has experience with the new Hooker shorty's please let me know as I'm still interested in finding out if they really are the same external dimensions.

Thanks Again,
Rich
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post #6 of 13 (permalink) Old Mar 22nd, 02, 03:56 AM
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John
 
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I thought that the boxes for power steering be it standard or quick ratio were the same in external dimensions. I may be wrong.

I am running Dynomax headers though and they give ample clearance around my stock power steering box. Distance of the closest tube to the box is an inch or maybe a fraction more. I am using Energy Suspension poly motor and trans mounts which might help in this regard. Not sure.
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post #7 of 13 (permalink) Old Mar 22nd, 02, 05:33 AM
 
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boodlefoof,

I'd be interested in some more details on your motor mounts and frame stands like Part No.'s, etc.

I recently purchased a set of the Dynomax 1 5/8" headers, P/N 86001, that were supposed to fit around the steering box, but no such luck when I test fit them.

It's funny, because when I set them down next to the old set that came off the car, they were identical in every way. The old set had been extensively "massaged" on the No. 3 tube to get proper clearance. There was a different number on the flange area of the old set too (7200). Maybe that is an old BlackJack number, because I think that Walker purchased them, and they are now going by the Dynomax brand name.

Just like Protour69, I'd appreciate any information that will allow me to get headers on the car that fit.
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post #8 of 13 (permalink) Old Mar 22nd, 02, 05:55 AM
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what engine did your car have stock? i have come up with a theory on why things like this happen. it has to do with the 302/350 engine mounts being different than the 307/327 mounts. did you swap to an HEI distributor, and if so, did you have to bash the firewall in to get it to fit?
my Nova had a 307 stock, and the same dynomax headers mentioned previously- 86001- fit my PS box with about 3/4 inch clearance. i bent one of them, and the Jet-Hot coating started to fall off in large chunks, so i got a set of Hedmans. the one tube literally rests along the PS box tight, and i had to dent the one part in about 1/2 inch to get it in there at all. but i have plenty of HEI firewall clearance.
as for shorty header clearance, i would say that if you have the 302/350 mounts, it should clear. most of the "better" headers seem to have been engineered on high performance models- like Z/28's and SS's.

------------------
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355sb, vortec heads, HOT cam,T-10 tranny, 3.70 gears 16X8" IROC wheels. 12" Corvette brakes on the way.
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post #9 of 13 (permalink) Old Mar 22nd, 02, 06:14 AM
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John
 
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I don't know the part numbers for the mounts or the headers sorry to say. They are items that Summit advertizes by item, but not part number or application. I called and told them what I had and they said they would send the parts I needed.

The car was an original 327 and PG trans.
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post #10 of 13 (permalink) Old Mar 22nd, 02, 12:13 PM
 
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My car was originally a 6 cyl., and probably a Powerglide. It now has a 350 with a Turbo 350 trans. These were already in place when I got the car. It also had the HEI already installed and the firewall appears to have had minimal modifications.

I guess what I would like to know at this point is, if I change to the proper 350 motor mounts and frame stands, will the Dynomax headers fit? I don't know which exact mounts and stands are there now, but the headers most certainly will not work with what it does have. Alternatively, will the Energy Suspension pieces solve my problems? I'd prefer not to have to send the headers back if I don't have to.

I'll be able to do some measuring of the existing mounts and stands this coming week as the engine is coming out to make way for the new 355 with Vortec heads, GM HOT cam, RPM Air Gap, etc. Basically a copy of the Hot, Hot, Hot engine build-up from Chevy High Performance late last year with the exception of 1.5 ratio rockers to give me .492 lift.
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post #11 of 13 (permalink) Old Mar 26th, 02, 04:33 AM
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Gene
 
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I have an AGR quick ratio box and Hooker Competition Series headers. No interference at all.

If the Hooker headers are the same exterior dimensions as the Hedman, I wonder if the same factory down in Mexico makes them?

[This message has been edited by gheatly (edited 03-26-2002).]
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post #12 of 13 (permalink) Old Mar 26th, 02, 06:10 AM
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Mark
 
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I have Hooker Super Comps 1-3/4" headers on my 69 with factory P/S box and they clear the box by a very small amount, maybe 1/8" or so. I am thinking that the notation that they will not fit fast ratio box has something to do with swaping out the factory box for a different year box that has a quicker ratio inside it. The factory original 69 quick ratio box is identical to the standard box and uses different pitman arm and steering knuckles to get the faster ratio. Just a thought....

-Mark.
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post #13 of 13 (permalink) Old Mar 26th, 02, 04:43 PM
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David Pozzi
 
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Make sure your motor mounts and frame brackets are correct.
David

------------------
Check my web page for First Gen Camaro suspension info:
David's Motorsports page
First Gen Suspension Page
67 RS 327 original owner. 69 Camaro Vintage Racer, 65 Lola T-70 Chev SB Can-Am Vintage Racer
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